[linton23]

There have been several times when we have worked on these engines with customers having waited 10000 miles between oil changes due to the oil life system. The engine is just sludged with oil and gunk. My shop tells people change at 5000 miles and we have had a lot less issues.

Biggest gm issue I spent the stupid owners who only rely on driver information center to change oil.

The false sense of security created a customer base to stupid and lazy to check oil levels between synthetic extended oil changes.

After the dopes forgot to ever check oil level for thousands of miles and ran the engine dry...they had problems.

This is not just a GM owner group problem. BMW had a rash of engine problems until they did away with the oil dipstick completely in their cars because owners never used them and went to an electronic oil level monitoring system..

Today’s car owners are only maintaining their cars when the driver information system on the dash says to.

GM needs in my opinion to create a drivers information center alert for OIL LEVEL...

Old school car owners who remember to check the oil level every month or two religiously on their expensive to purchase vehiclesfrom the day they purchase the vehicle are much less likely to ever experience a problem.

Sure once the engines run dry the owners notoriously check the oil level but by then it’s too late...

The damage is done...

Not as popular as trying to blame the car company for a faulty design because it puts the stupidity on the lazy owners and not the manufacturers..

I won’t be coming back to this thread to read all the raging insults by the owners who are covering up their own stupidity by blaming the manufacturer for the owners lack of common sense until it’s too late.

Check your oil levels periodically before you run the engine dry in the extended synthetic oil change intervals.

 

[NHRATA01]

Biggest gm issue I spent the stupid owners who only rely on driver information center to change oil.

The false sense of security created a customer base to stupid and lazy to check oil levels between synthetic extended oil changes.

After the dopes forgot to ever check oil level for thousands of miles and ran the engine dry...they had problems.

This is not just a GM owner group problem. BMW had a rash of engine problems until they did away with the oil dipstick completely in their cars because owners never used them and went to an electronic oil level monitoring system..

Today’s car owners are only maintaining their cars when the driver information system on the dash says to.

GM needs in my opinion to create a drivers information center alert for OIL LEVEL...

Old school car owners who remember to check the oil level every month or two religiously on their expensive to purchase vehiclesfrom the day they purchase the vehicle are much less likely to ever experience a problem.

Sure once the engines run dry the owners notoriously check the oil level but by then it’s too late...

The damage is done...

Not as popular as trying to blame the car company for a faulty design because it puts the stupidity on the lazy owners and not the manufacturers..

I won’t be coming back to this thread to read all the raging insults by the owners who are covering up their own stupidity by blaming the manufacturer for the owners lack of common sense until it’s too late.

Check your oil levels periodically before you run the engine dry in the extended synthetic oil change intervals.

Sorry but you are completely wrong, it has nothing to do with incompetent (or stupid) owners and has nothing to do with oil level. And running the engine dry will kill the bearings long before the chain stretches.

The timing chain issues with the LLT are a combination of parts supplier, design, oil change intervals and oil spec.

1. The chain supplier was changed in 2010 because of poor QC.
2. The oil passages in the heads to lube the chains were enlarged around the same time for improved chain lubrication and less chance of sludge obstruction.
3. The oil life monitor algorithm was duplicated from the port injected LY7, allowing 12K OCI's which you can't blame on the average consumer for adhering to the OLM as all they are told to do by the owners manual is follow the OLM and check oil levels. As we all know DI is much harsher on oil than PFI and causes more fuel dilution. GM revised the OCI's on the LLT in 2012 and cut the interval roughly in half. I know this as I had a '10 and a '16/'17.
4. GM started spec'ing Dexos a synthetic blend around '12 to better handle the oil degradation of DI.

So you could have an early year LLT running dino oil at a GM directed change interval of 12K miles and be most prone to a chain failure.

Exhibit One that this was an issue was GM having a 10/120K special coverage warranty on the '09s for chain stretch.

Exhibit Two was the GM had the same goddamn chain stretch problem on the 2.4 DI because again GM used the same OCI algorithm as on the older 2.4 PFI version.

Sorry, but as an engineer who recognizes ****ty engineering pretty easily, that is ****ty engineering. Not ****ty maintenance.

Now, I got my '10 to 117k miles because I didn't trust the OLM and I've been using synthetic for years. So 6-7K change intervals with M1 or PP kept me from having any issues. Would your average consumer know to do that when all he hear's is "Follow your owner's manual"? Nope.

 

[clevelandrocks]

Sorry but you are completely wrong, it has nothing to do with incompetent (or stupid) owners and has nothing to do with oil level. And running the engine dry will kill the bearings long before the chain stretches.

The timing chain issues with the LLT are a combination of parts supplier, design, oil change intervals and oil spec.

1. The chain supplier was changed in 2010 because of poor QC.
2. The oil passages in the heads to lube the chains were enlarged around the same time for improved chain lubrication and less chance of sludge obstruction.
3. The oil life monitor algorithm was duplicated from the port injected LY7, allowing 12K OCI's which you can't blame on the average consumer for adhering to the OLM as all they are told to do by the owners manual is follow the OLM and check oil levels. As we all know DI is much harsher on oil than PFI and causes more fuel dilution. GM revised the OCI's on the LLT in 2012 and cut the interval roughly in half. I know this as I had a '10 and a '16/'17.
4. GM started spec'ing Dexos a synthetic blend around '12 to better handle the oil degradation of DI.

So you could have an early year LLT running dino oil at a GM directed change interval of 12K miles and be most prone to a chain failure.

Exhibit One that this was an issue was GM having a 10/120K special coverage warranty on the '09s for chain stretch.

Exhibit Two was the GM had the same goddamn chain stretch problem on the 2.4 DI because again GM used the same OCI algorithm as on the older 2.4 PFI version.

Sorry, but as an engineer who recognizes ****ty engineering pretty easily, that is ****ty engineering. Not ****ty maintenance.

Now, I got my '10 to 117k miles because I didn't trust the OLM and I've been using synthetic for years. So 6-7K change intervals with M1 or PP kept me from having any issues. Would your average consumer know to do that when all he hear's is "Follow your owner's manual"? Nope.

I wanted to follow up on my 2012 Traverse timing chain problem. Got it fixed for $2,500 and spent an extra $500 to fix the AC which I had charged weeks before and it leaked out. The AC repair included replacement of seals and this is a silver lining in the timing chain repair since the AC repair was probably a lot less expensive to do when they had the engine already out for the timing chain repair.

Car runs great now and I'm glad I had the repair done. I heard from an owner of an early year Traverse that they had the timing chain replaced in their Traverse and it never ran the same again so I was concerned that mine wouldn't run right after the repair. However, it seems to be running great.

I'm not sure about this but I may have caused this problem to begin with. It may have started the day I returned a Dingo Mini Skid Steer. After I returned the machine, I pulled into a parking lot and the engine started to stall, backfire and just run really rough. It stalled and I couldn't get it started and had to have it towed to the dealership. That's when they found the 15 codes I described above. I was worried that I ruined the transmission because I realized afterwards that the machine was quite a bit heavier than the Traverse's towing capacity and I was going up some pretty steep hills on my way to drop off the machine. So maybe I stretched the timing chain by towing this machine that was over capacity. $2,500 lesson learned to make sure to check the weight of what I'm towing and make sure its withing my cars towing capacity.

Whatever the cause of the timing chain stretch, its fixed now and glad to have it back and running well. Thanks everyone for your comments. Also, I'll make sure to do frequent oil changes (more frequent than recommended in the manual) and have them use the correct oil. Thanks again.

 

[DevonM5445]

It’s the camaro to I have a 2013 camaro 3.6 at 101000 rn and I am having to replace it right now

 

[Amatressa]

I have not heard of any failures on the newer iterations of the LFX yet. Let the warranty replace it and move on with life.

 

[DJ BINC]

This should be fun for the folks that buy one of the new midsize twins with the Lfx engine.Like the new gm,same as the old gm...

2016 LFX ENGINE - TIMING CHAINS, GUIDES, AND "PHASERS"????

IS MY MECHANIC SCREWING WITH ME?

 

[davester]

google "gm cam phaser" for your answer.

 

[Slushisagoat]

I have not heard of any failures on the newer iterations of the LFX yet. Let the warranty replace it and move on with life.

I have a newer 3.6L gm v6. The di DOHC version put in the Camaros. So far have not had a timing chain failure in the car 98k miles with mediocre service due to the car being my moms prior. Car is mostly highly miles due to us not living inside of the city. Have had a camshaft solenoid go bad on the driver side easy fix and the light went away.

After the last 8k miles or so the car has seem to get rougher and rougher. Exhaust doesn’t sad that good anymore and I’m thinking I need new timing chains soon. I think the exhaust sounding issue is a result of all the carbon buildup engine is known for having. As for the timing, the car has been bulky fully tuned up by me, and maintained, and still is rough sometimes. Hard idles sometimes not very often, sometimes lack of power, car has lag when stepping on pedal and etc. due to this I’m thinking timing chain needs to replaced.

The engine also has a slight tik. I believe the issue to be the lifters as these 3.6 were engineered terribly and burn through oil like no tomorrow. I’m going to upgrade to performance lifters because OEM is ****. Also if you do ever replace timing chains get heavier-duty chains that will last longer.

Hope this comment helps anyone years later from the original post and years later from my post. 2016 Chevy Camaro btw. And this 3.6l take 5-30, not 5-20.

 

[User Unknown]

I never had to do timing chains in a 3.6 yet but I bought a ‘13 Impala that had low compression on the drivers side (Bank 2, cylinders 2-4-6). The pressures were 110,80,50 respectively out of 140 nominal). I suspect bad/leaky valve guides as this is a known problem. Maybe the Bank 2 timing chain is tanked and the cam is off. I bought a 50k mile LFX out of a wrecked 2016 Buick for $780 and it was plug-and-play into my ‘13 Impala but I did swap the HP fuel pump and intake of course. My plan is to “restore” the bad 109k miles motor by sending the heads off to the machine shop to be cleaned and pressure tested and I will also install all-new timing components. Then I’ll buy a “tanked” Buick sedan or Cadillac SRX that uses a LFX for nothing and swap the motors. I’ve already seen very clean SRX’s on Facebook for $2k!
Someone in this thread made a comment that the 3.6 “must” be removed from the bottom. This is not true; I pulled my 3.6 LFX from the TOP with my Impala. Plenty of space.

 

[markrusslegg]

Yes. But without Oil Operated Cam Phasers.

Also, there is the engine removal that is done to do the job.

 

[User Unknown]

50,000 miles later (100k on the used motor now) and it's still running great. I'm using 5W-30 Synthetic and rolling with the GM Oil Life "Golden Rule" of 50% (consensus with old Wisconsin guys I've bumped into with the same engine). All of these newer motors use oil pressure to do other jobs like VVT. It is critical you run clean oil at all times to avoid issues with individual components (like an individual VVT ssolenoid) which may have degrading effects on the entire engine. Yup; we're effectively back to 3k OCI's. I'm at about 3500 to 4000 mile OCI's using my personal 50% GM oil life standard.
I need to also add that you should also be cleaning all four of the VVT solenoid screens every 30k miles or so. You might be shocked to see gunk partially clogging them. It'll be a good lesson on how to replace then in the event of a failure when away from home. I've had to do this with my other 3.6 Impala when on a 1200 mile road trip. I now carry a spare VVT solenoid in my emergency kit in the trunk.