Seems like all years and all applications of the engine have the timing chain issue.

GM does the work under the powertrain warranty, so if it happens within the first 5y/100K, you'll be OK. Annoyed, but OK.

 

Yes Suzuki too has the engine in their suv's and problems too.http://www.suzuki-forums.com/2g-2007-xl7/41420-timing-chain-problem.html

Also found on the forums here this thread
http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/f53/acadia-3-6l-chain-stretch-98372/index2.html

Seems like oil changes need to been done sooner then later also. I sure hope GM has fixed this problem as it sounds like this is this engines down fall.

 

I think a lot of mech's will tell you that you should just change your oil sooner than the OLM tells you. Especially in the Lambda vehicles.

 

Quick question on this... Why does this seem to be a more prevalent problem on the Lambda's than any other vehicle with this engine? I have a 2009 Saturn Vue XR with the 3.6L and I haven't really seen/heard of any of these problems in the Vue. Same with the Malibu, Aura, G8 or any other car that uses this engine. It seems like it is mostly noticed in the Lambda's.

 

There are a ton of Lambdas on the road, and very few of the other vehicles you mention are optioned with the 3.6.

Are the Lambdas the only ones using the direct injected versions??

CTS/STS/First-gen SRX?/Camaro

 

Are the Lambdas the only ones using the direct injected versions??

 

I have a question about this.
Years ago my CTS (2004 3.6) was making a strange 'bearing' noise, similar to a wheezy, perpetual brake disk grinding. I took it to the dealer twice under warranty and they claimed at both incidents that it was just fine. Well now that the car is no longer under warranty, I decided to replace essentially the entire front engine system, belts, tensioners, pulleys, even the power steering pump. To no avail. My thoughts now are that it is inside the chain cover, perhaps a bad pulley w/i, or whatever.
My question is, does a stretched chain make noise? Could this be what my noise is?
If so, would they retro act on the warranty since I complained about it twice? It is very irritating.
Please help....
Joel

 

I would call Customer Assistance and ask, but I wouldn't hold my breath for help on a car 7 model years old. But it never hurts to ask.

Ditto for the person who said don't wait for the OLM to change the oil. I wouldn't go over 4000 miles, and even less if towning or lots of stop and go.

 

Bump:
I have a question about this.
Years ago my CTS (2004 3.6) was making a strange 'bearing' noise, similar to a wheezy, perpetual brake disk grinding. I took it to the dealer twice under warranty and they claimed at both incidents that it was just fine. Well now that the car is no longer under warranty, I decided to replace essentially the entire front engine system, belts, tensioners, pulleys, even the power steering pump. To no avail. My thoughts now are that it is inside the chain cover, perhaps a bad pulley w/i, or whatever.
My question is, does a stretched chain make noise? Could this be what my noise is?
If so, would they retro act on the warranty since I complained about it twice? It is very irritating.
Please help....
Joel

 

I don't recall hearing a noise, but it's been a few years. The red flag was the check engine light and the OnStar remote diagnosis.

 

GM should offer a 'customer satisfaction' warrenty of 10y/100k on these chains since it *is* a problem.

If my chain goes at 110k well then so be it. If it goes at 60K after 5 1/2 years Im gonna be PO'd

 

I think that they have issued a special warranty for it and it covers 10 yrs/120k miles.

 

I would buy the vehicle with the 3.6 liter DI with confidence.

How many verified cases have there been?

 

This looks like the culprit in the 3.6L Timing Chain failure saga.

http://www.gmpowertrain.ca/Product/3... Summary.pdf

Smaller Pitch Timing Chain
The 3.6L V-6 VVT in the Cadillac CTS has a new timing chain with a smaller pitch (7.7
mm compared to 9.5mm previously) and more links. The chain features an inverted
tooth design. The smaller links engage at a lower impact speed, which decreases the
noise generated. In conjunction with the new chain, the number of teeth on the sprockets
is also increased, increasing the meshing frequency and further reducing noise and
vibration.
The new timing chain is a running change that will occur in all of GM Powertain’s V-6
VVT engines through the course of the 2007 model year.
Dual-Spray

 

Ok sounds like they tweaked it to make it quieter and also made it weaker!

So what's GM's solution going to be I wonder. Replace them as they fail, once they're off warranty no worries for them I guess. If it turns out to be wide spread it could really effect resale value on autos with this engine in a few years.

My father has a 2006 Buick Allure with a 3.6L I think. His has been fine so far with about 65,000 miles on it. Not sure if its the same sort of twin cam engine though.

 

Wonder if the original, larger chain fits...

 

The shop I work at just had a Traverse in for chains. 53,3XX miles. Last one in had 28,XXX.

 

Wait a minute. The stretch of a tining chain cannot be altered by increasing the frequency of oil changes and the timing chain only times the cam shafts to the crank shaft so it sees only rpm's; the load on a vehicle is not a factor unless you say that the load forces the motor to undergo higher rpm's for a longer period of time.
Timing chains do stretch and the old method of checking one is to put the chain on a table and look at the slump in the chain. My friend's 69 Camaro went out at 198,000 miles (we were driving home from work) and I change one in my 69 Nova at about 120,000 miles because I changed the cam. It was easy in theose days. Pull the radiator and remove the water pump and you have a ton of room.
Make the timing chain quieter? Has anybody ever heard a chain noise above the noise of the motor in general? There was GM's POS Iron Duke with the plastic gear (25,000 miles maybe of life) that was supposed to be quieter. I installed the steel aftermarket gear and could not hear the difference. How about the term "cheaper"? Anyway, with today's youth almost deaf from 2,000 megawatt entertainment systems that shake the vehicle's bolts loose, why worry about noise?

 

Oh ya those plastic gears on the old V-8's were something! But like you say a realitively easy an cheap fix. My current GM 3.4 MFI has 175,000 miles on it with no chain issues but its a simple push rod engine. Used always grab the crank and turn it back and forth to feel how much slack. On the older engines it was easy to watch the timing marks on the crank pulley to see how many degrees it moved. I wonder what's worse as many companies used timing belts to run the twin cam engines. They got better over the years but still by 70-80,000 miles it was time... some a lot less.

I can't see why they can design these chains with a 200,000 mile life span. Sorry but when I hear they are failing already at 10,000 to 70,000 miles ... it's not impressive. I'm sure GM spent a ton of money designing this direct injection engine, how did they end up with such a major flaw.

What do other car companies twin cam timing chain engines make it to before they crap out?

 

I recently had a mate who had a Holden VZ Commodore (about 5 year old) with the 3.6Lt engine (not DI). He was a bit lazy and missed an oil change. One morning he tried to start it and it sounded like it had lost compression. When we stripped it, the engine oil was like grease. Because it was low on oil pressure, the timing chain tensioner didn't keep the proper tension and allowed it to jump a tooth or two. The recommendation by the mechanic was to increase the frequency of oil changes

 

Hey JBsZ06, thanks for your kind words.

Originally I was going to quote back what turned out to be 99% of your excellent posts here but it got too long. Although I'm just going to have include some further down and or in another post.:yup:

You are succinctly asking all the right questions - and much more.

And there are the others outside of the spin docs - in fact all them in this thread like that - that have contributed here and in the other threads in a really useful way. :yup:

There is much more to all these interrelated topics.......... and imo, soon enough some more stuff will be out there in plainer view. Although of course, it will also be all spun up as well.


____________



Also worth noting perhaps........ Mopar is reported to be using a certain 5W -40 spec for the new 6.4s..... another sign that some sanity concerning engine durability and fundamental lube oil needs are going to stop the down grade that's been happening. All for some dumbass small and mythical FE improvement and the same concerning extended CC life.

It all looked good on paper - until you start factoring in the rest of the picture or better said, get all of the picture under view.

( Notice also that the Euros didn't fall for it - by and large and if they did get bit, they self corrected real quick - good for them. )


____________


I think we can ascertain there is a little more smoke yet again coming from the 'Ford - GMI camp' in this and all the other threads and sure as the day is long, it's about not discussing a Ford engine...... that very directly competes with the 3.6L from GM and some of what's up with that.

As always, you can tell what's up with their favorite based on what kind of garbage they try and throw on GM.

From another forum - here is a little more of that 'smoke' they most definitely do not want you to see.

Hang on - let's use this one instead.

Not sure if anyone has noticed, but I just discovered that the 2011 MY Ecoboost engines in the FLEX and Taurus SHO are calling for 5W-30 weight oil.

I have a 2010 and "didn't get the note" or any indication of this from Ford.

Can anyone shed some light on the reason for the change?

Was Ford noticing that the 5W-20 was shearing down too much under heavy use with the turbos and causing too much risk of wear?

I am more than a little annoyed about this shift . . .

Here is a link to the 2011 Owners Manual in .pdf form including showing the new spec.

https://www.fleet.ford.com/maintenance/owners_manuals/results.asp

Thoughts?

Andrew

Then.....

Hi Bob -

Thanks for your response.

I hadn't seen the other threads on this forum related to the oil weight change between years.

I also don't frequent the SHO forums . At any rate, I can't understand why the 2011 Flex EB would have a different spec vs. 2010 EB when the two engines are identical?

It makes me think that Ford decided that they didn't want to risk any reliability issues on the 2011 models but decided not to create confusion by telling owners of 2010 vehicles to change to a new spec.

From my point of view, it completely undermines Ford's credibility.

To have two different specs for the same engine in two consecutive years is absolutely ludicrous.

There was a lot of discussion about risks of running 5w-20 in a twin turbo engine on BITOG and my conclusion a year ago was that it should be okay if Ford engineered the engine right.

Now, with the newer spec, I'm thinking Ford must have realized something and made a change for reliability reasons, irrespective of a .2% improvement in fuel economy.

The F150 EB engine is different than the one in the Flex.

It uses different turbos and has some other changes.

If that engine had a different oil spec it wouldn't bother me as much.

But from year to year on the same vehicle, same engine, different story.

I think I'll be dumping my 5w-20 for 5w-30 full synthetic this weekend. I am really tweaked about this (as you can tell).

Andrew

http://www.fordflex.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=4010

I also wonder........ if lube spec changes to cover some lube related phenomena is why some of Ford's powertrain choices lost some MPG for 2011 ?





Huge point,. Beat up and failed oil plays havoc with all the rest of the system - tensioners and guides get all messed and do bad things - especially on startup - and or cold or real hot if drain down time applies.

The timing belt is such a money maker its ridiculous.

I only buy cars with timing chains and so should you.

The days that there were reasons for timing belts is long over.

HUGE MONEY MAKER FOR THE DEALERSHIPS THOUGH!

For the cars that have timing belts that is..

Buy the 3.6 liter with confidence. Anything else is nonsense.

:yup::yup::yup:

How many 3.6 liter engines has GM built? What percentage required timing chain replacement early?

How does that compare to any other manufacturer?

I say its equal.

I have confidence in the 3.6 DI V6 I own and if I have a problem in the 5 years or 100,000 miles its covered under warranty.

Thats a zero cost for 5 years or 100,000 miles..

If you are concerned about the issue after the 5year 100,000 mile period either buy an extended GM PP warranty for coverage...(I believe its very smart to buy off the internet 3 month and 3K miles before the original coverage expires...Ie. before 33k miles and 33 months on a 3year /36k original warranty..)

It cost me less than 30 dollars a month over the next 4 years and 48 thousand miles..for coverage on my 2008 corvette or cadillac CTS which happens to have the 3.6 liter DI

If I want to extend it beyond that? I just have to make a phone call to any GM dealer and buy yet another extended warranty...

It just about covers everything that a normal warranty and I don't mean to be rude ...but to whine about a timing chain issue that barely exists from a percentage standpoint and have the ability if you are concerned about that or any other issue long term...

Just pay the less than 30 dollars a month for the period you own the car..

I always get the GMPP warranty for my vehicles..I usually extend it one year past when I think I am going to own the vehicle...(along with an extra 12k miles) so the next owner I sell the vehicle is assured a good 12k miles of care free usuage..and they have the opportunity to extend the warranty should they choose..

I believe its a win win...

You either decide to win or not...

Thats each persons decision..

JMO

JB

:yup::yup:


So let's see.... for about the cost of half to one belt replacement I can cover a huge amount of this and that including the chain system way better. Then optionally, for the cost of a belt to two I can cover...... how much more - the whole vehicle ?????

Win -win indeed.

Most foreign cars that have those belts are interference motors..IE> toyota, honda and I'm not sure who else..but if you don't have those belts changed every 60k miles or whatever it calls for...YOUR IN DEEP DO DO! LOL

I'd take a chain over a belt any day of the week..

Buy with confidence a GM 3.6 liter motor..

ITs a dam good work horse...puts out excellent power and is quite fuel efficient, not to mention reliable...

I'd take it over any toyota v6 for reliable carefree motoring anyday of the week...SLUDGE toyota issue not even included...

:yup::yup::yup:

Yeah, really. I mean the choice over there is one, it wont run 'cause #5 or #6 just went through the block or you go later and the thing won't stop - what kind of choice is all that ?

And then to boot, somewhere in there you lost up to 22 - 32 HP........

I called up a friend today who owns a 05 Lexus Rx330, Toyota recommends a timing belt replacement every 90k, dealer said you should have it done at 80k to be safe. The cost is about $1400 (he just did his) if he keeps his unit for 160,000 miles thats close to 3k in belt replacements. My logic is that if i buy that Acadia that has a 100k powertrain warranty standard, plus the extended warranty for 60k (i will find out the cost of that) i will still be further ahead than if i went with a Lexus per say that had belts that NEED replacement no matter what, and are not covered under warranty. I reeeeellly want to buy that Acadia, i just hope after 6 yrs on the market they have that chain problem licked so i can feel good about the purchase and have no reservations.

:yup:

I agree with you 100%. I just spent $1400 on my TDI Jetta on the second timing belt service i had done in the time i owned it. I did not want to go back to a vehicle that needs this service, even on that wee little VW diesel it costs a fortune and many special tools are required for the job. If i buy the Acadia i only have to worry IF the chain causes trouble, and its nice to know it won't just snap and destroy the engine.

Poor GM, i'm sure this mess could be a supplier issue, i just wonder how many folks have scratched a new GM with the 3.6 off their list just due to this problem. I've had rotten luck with a 2003 VW, and an 06 Accord in the last few years, now i'm back to GM because the best vehicles i have owned in the last 10 yrs have been my 2002 Yukon and a 2000 Montana we owned since new. The Yukon is close to 200k now without one major repair, and that Montana (we sold to my cousin) keeps plugging away and it has close to 220k on it now, it's only major fix was the intake/head gaskets at 68k and has been dead reliable ever since.

:yup:

What puzzles me is why GM has had no issues with the Northstar and
its 2 timing chains that drive the OHCs while the almost same design

I'm not sayin' it applies, but practically speaking, the fewer the cylinders the harder it is on the chain in more ways than one - unless you got an oddball design. And yep, all that will matter more one way or another if coupled with a lube mismatch or fail.

I called my local Dealer just now and spoke to the service manager and asked him about any updates to this problem. He said late 07-all the way to early 10' 3.6l have a timing chain from a different supplier and they were a different design, the replacement chain set are from a new supplier and have proven to be durable, and all the brand new models have this new chain. He also stated that at his store they have only done five chains in 3.6l's. This is a rural store, but does a good sales volume.

He told me they did the chainset in a 08 Traverse @ 14000 miles, the same unit (a fleet vehicle none the less) comes in for regular service which now has around 160,000 miles and has never had any further issues. This makes me feel much better about the problem, looks like GM may have looked after it after all......

On a side note, my uncle bought a STS Seville in 94, he kept that one all the way till 04, he had close to 200k miles and never had a problem with the head gaskets. He bought a Eldorado in 97 and another STS in 99~ neither one of those ever had any type of problems, Eldo he still has and the STS he traded at 115k. He bought a DTS in 02 and it too was trouble free when traded in at 120k miles. He currently has a 06 DTS. I'm not saying they did not have a problem with the north*, just wonder what % of them did fail. I myself have owned a few Caddys with the North* but they were usually 6-10 yrs old already and i never kept them long. They were a awesome performing engine though!

Thanks for posting that info.

The TDI complete service includes the Belt, rollers, tensioner, and water pump, plus $40 worth of special power steering fluid and a synthetic oil change, i guess it was not ALL for the tbelt, but it all adds up quickly at the VW dealer!

I too live in a cold climate, wonder if switching to a 0 weight oil would help these engines.

Not from some...... step backwards - or even a big step backwards - if you want to go longer on the change. On the first level...... it's not about cold weather viscosity performance and cold weather pumping.

The cold climate thing............ is mainly more about the unavoidable for all increased fuel dilution and how that relates to other oil breakdown factors.

This is part of why your fuel choices are important as well.

Well anyway,if you want to go that way with it, going with a carefully selected HDMO 5W -40 would be nice..... with a deros 2 spec for starters.

A Deros 1 product of the recommended type would be the easy pick first choice.

The more research i do on these vehicles the more i find the majority of people are happy with them.

- which is the real reason why so many * cough * are attempting to spin here negatively.

Sigh, Couldnt you have posted that BEFORE I bought a 4.6 Explorer and a Nissan VQ engine that BOTH had timing chain problems when I got rid of them.

Sorry to hear that happened.:yup:

More latter, I think?

Meanwhile..... I'd 'probably' or possibly be even a little more careful about my lube and lube maintenance in your area.

 

Nice point Andretti. The old small blocks ran the oil pump off the distributor. You are correct of a greater load on the chain. Regarding timing belts, I have changed the one in my 3L Dodge and it showed no wear after 100,000 miles. But it is the cord in the belt that is the source of the strength so a belt can look like new and still fail. Indeed, though, timing belts have really become reliable and durable.
We are missing the point that the engineering department runs life tests on the motor with the chain used in production (I hope so). So, this should have raised some concern; after all, we are talking relatively few miles (17,000 is nothing) as time to failure.
When talking about substandard oils, you are implying that the API label is not being follwed by the person changing the oil. That seems to hold little possibility since the newer oils (the stuff on the shelf) exceed the earlier oils sold. Unless some is filling his motor with olive oil or the left over Mazola, I cannot see this as a problem. This does not bode well for GM since the buyer is going to be told to have oil changes at least every 3K miles.
I did not know it but you fellows are saying that the 3.6L is a Suzuki motor? So, for that matter why buy GM; get a Suzuki for less money.

 

These engines are NEW and having the chains stretch and throw codes. These engines tend to be in expensive $$ cars and SUV's. I'd right tore up if I dropped 50K on a new SUV and 20,000 miles they tell me the timing chains are worn out. I know everyone says no worries its under warranty. Its the point of it!

Hey but what do I know GM has sold over 700,000 Lambda SUV's alone with this engine in so they made a wack of $$$. The must figure they can afford to fix them all.

 

If the chain is stretching because of the strain of pushing a Lambda imagine if it were in the pickups.... I guess we now know one reason why the GMT-900s are still making do with the 4.3L.

I did oil changes on the 3800SC in my Grand Prix based on the OLM and ran synthetic in it because of the longer intervals... but based on what I've read with the 3.6L issues I'm doing standard 3000-4000mi intervals in the Acadia.

 

So when the chains go south are the replacements a better design? Or is this something that can fail again and again through the life of the vehicle? We are considering a new Acadia right now, i keep my rigs around for a long time and many miles and don't want to be tearing down half the motor every 70k.

 

So when the chains go south are the replacements a better design? ...........don't want to be tearing down half the motor every 70k.

THAT is the question many would like answered.
Maybe it is a question that should be asked directly to GM by many of its 3.6L owners?

 

Sawyer99, your thoughts about an Acadia making it to 20,000 miles (let alone 70,000 miles) is just horrible to imagine. There is no reason for timing chain performance to be so poor. This indeed sunds like a major engineering goof. How does GM talk about the ruggedness of its vehicles when they have problems such as head gasket problems (NorthStar), plastic intake manifold problems (3.8L V-6's) and this problem with timing chains? Forget giving me 300Hp or 400Hp, go back to Engineering 101 and provide a motor that can last 100,000 miles without the major pats failing. This is nothing new since my old Caravan is sittign there with 190,000 miles and needed a head gasket at 175,000 miles. I sold a 1973 GP with 110,000 miles and its motor was just humming along. Take away the CAD tools and engineering programs and tell these engineers to re-learn what they forgot. Where is Ed Cole when we need him?

 

I don't expect stuff to last forever (would be nice lol) but I feel it should have a "reasonable" service life. I feel bad for the engineers as I suspect they'd designed it to last... then the bean counter factor came in like you mentioned and screwed things up. Spending that extra $50 on the engine in mass production may have saved them a lot of warranty work, kept customers happy and coming back to buy more.

 

There is nothing wrong with the timing chain on the 3.6 powerplant.

Show me documented cases where there is an issue?

This is nonsense..

 

Have you been living in a cave? This is all over the web open up your eyes!

 

I won't knowingly buy a car where the engine has some designed-in defect.
If I were to buy a vehicle with the 3.6 and service it within factory specifications, would it last 150,000 without needing replacement?

 

Most "cheap" cars that are supposedly superior run timing belts. now thats a pain in the @ss that needs to be replaced as per owners manual and its not inexpensive.

The timing chain replacement schedule on the 3.6 I don't know off hand...but whatever it calls for..I'll do and its not a big deal.

This nonsense about the 3.6 having some BS timing chain issue is just that...NOnsense.

Traditionally if you change a timing chain prior to what the owners manual calls for your good to go.

Buy with confidence and if your really worried then buy an extended warranty. Hell I always do just for the assurance I can beat the living crap out of my cars without a care in the world..(if I wanted to but I don't)

The great part about GM products is a) they are extremely well tested through exhaustive R & D ..and B) parts and labor are more than cost competitive when compared to other foreign products...

Especially when you consider the performance of the various GM products.

IE. LS V8 engine family and the 3.6 V6.

A hundred and fifty thousand miles between timing chains? Read the owners manual and do what it calls for.

 

A timing chain replacement is a lot more expensive and a PITA than a timing belt replacement...

 

The timing belt is such a money maker its ridiculous.

I only buy cars with timing chains and so should you.

The days that there were reasons for timing belts is long over.

HUGE MONEY MAKER FOR THE DEALERSHIPS THOUGH!

For the cars that have timing belts that is..

Buy the 3.6 liter with confidence. Anything else is nonsense.

 

Wow! all this is making my decision to purchace thet Acadia very difficult. It's a brand new 2011 model, i would HOPE by now all the problems are taken car of and i could buy with confidence that it will last a long time without major repair. A friend of mine has a Enclave and is very happy with it so far, he's a former Infiniti owner and i steered him back to american products. i sure hope this problem has been solved by now....As for me, perhaps we will look at another Yukon XL, my current one has over 250,000 trouble free miles.

 

Here is a link to a Cadillac with an older version of the engine apart for a timing chains. At least this one had some miles on it. http://www.cadillacforums.com/forum...ts-first-generation-forum-2003/208489-timing-failure-top-end-rebuild-fully.html

Some real nice pics!

Same here regading looking to purchase an Acadia.... we'll see.

 

Sawyer99 pointd out that the motor must be removed from the vehicle on the Acadia. This is no easy task so the bucks go up in magnitude. So much forthose people who say they can live with some maintenance interval. Take an extended warranty? That is saying that one expects, to a high degree, that one will have major problems with the vehicle. Nice way to sell a product. And those actuaries at the insurance companies, selling those extended warranties, will duly note the problems and bump up the premium accordingly. So much for the commercial of some roughneck hauling a huge boat or tons of rock in his vehicle. More likely he will be sitting on the side of the road with a bad chain. Talk of an Achilles Heel.

 

How many 3.6 liter engines has GM built? What percentage required timing chain replacement early?

How does that compare to any other manufacturer?

I say its equal.

I have confidence in the 3.6 DI V6 I own and if I have a problem in the 5 years or 100,000 miles its covered under warranty.

Thats a zero cost for 5 years or 100,000 miles..

If you are concerned about the issue after the 5year 100,000 mile period either buy an extended GM PP warranty for coverage...(I believe its very smart to buy off the internet 3 month and 3K miles before the original coverage expires...Ie. before 33k miles and 33 months on a 3year /36k original warranty..)

It cost me less than 30 dollars a month over the next 4 years and 48 thousand miles..for coverage on my 2008 corvette or cadillac CTS which happens to have the 3.6 liter DI

If I want to extend it beyond that? I just have to make a phone call to any GM dealer and buy yet another extended warranty...

It just about covers everything that a normal warranty and I don't mean to be rude ...but to whine about a timing chain issue that barely exists from a percentage standpoint and have the ability if you are concerned about that or any other issue long term...

Just pay the less than 30 dollars a month for the period you own the car..

I always get the GMPP warranty for my vehicles..I usually extend it one year past when I think I am going to own the vehicle...(along with an extra 12k miles) so the next owner I sell the vehicle is assured a good 12k miles of care free usuage..and they have the opportunity to extend the warranty should they choose..

I believe its a win win...

You either decide to win or not...

Thats each persons decision..

JMO

JB

 

Wow... Is this NorthStar Head Bolt Deja Vu or what?

Step 1... Deny that there is a problem... Ah, What head gasket/ head bolt problem, demand to see the data...

Step 2... When that is produced then you deny that it happens all that much... based on a percentage of sales or compared to competitive products Ah you know that head gaskets fail all the time... What did you expect a built proof engine?

Step 3... Next you blame the customer... The head gaskets only fail if you don't replace the Dexcool as per the service recommendations... Or in this case.. If you follow GM's own OLM (that has worked seems more then fine for every thing from SBC's to NorthStars to Turbo 4's...for about 20 years) then you are a dumb soccer mom and you are screwed..

Step 4... Next you remind people that they should always buy an extended warranty... Cause what did you expect? Did you really think that the car would last 100,000 miles? Come on now who the heck builds those?

Step 5... Mean while you quietly fix the engineering problem, while you let the dealers and customers try and figure out why the cars are broken, continue to deny the problem and wonder why customers are leaving your best cars for competitive products... And wonder why the resale value of these cars is about the same as a litter of kittens.

Glad to see that GM learned from all of the pain of the NorthStar head bolts and is out in front of this one...

 

After the warranty, you are toast if you have to do a timing chain change.

 

Engines can be built either way...where the valves would slam into the pistons or not..
called non interference engines..

I had one of the plastic covered timing chain gear set in a 1969 350 firebird and its timing chain broke...It was NOT a big deal...I think the whole thing cost 500 bucks to have fixed..

My corvette Z06 had a double timing chain installed when did the higher lift cam/headers/etc..and after 60k miles..the timing chain broke...and if I wanted it fixed I could have had it done relatively inexpensively...

The LS engines were interference motors too..

It wasn't a big deal..I just didn't want to deal with it and wanted a new C6 z51 that has that sweet 436hp LS3 motor..!

Most foreign cars that have those belts are interference motors..IE> toyota, honda and I'm not sure who else..but if you don't have those belts changed every 60k miles or whatever it calls for...YOUR IN DEEP DO DO! LOL

I'd take a chain over a belt any day of the week..

Buy with confidence a GM 3.6 liter motor..

ITs a dam good work horse...puts out excellent power and is quite fuel efficient, not to mention reliable...

I'd take it over any toyota v6 for reliable carefree motoring anyday of the week...SLUDGE toyota issue not even included...