[autoplaybook]

No - after 1931 they were badge-engineered twins - following the VAG/BMW carve-up it's Bentley that retains the traditional heritage from Crewe - the current Rolls-Royces carries over nothing.

Nope. Bentley was downmarket from Rolls throughout their shared history, as they are now. The cheapest Bentley is the $185k Continental GT V8. The big Mulsanne starts at $296k.

The Rolls-Royce Ghost, the cheapest Rolls you can buy, starts at $301k. Higher than the biggest, most expensive Bentley. The Phantom Drophead Coupe starts at $470k.

And this has been true since the 1930's. Bentley was marketed as the less expensive, more sporting alternative, while Rolls was the flagship brand.

 

[SierraGS]

Cadillac doesn't currently get even close to competing in the luxury sector where Bentley is - Cadillac is trying to compete in the premium sector where a DOHC V8 is normal.

Do you mean the DOHC V8's that will be ripped out of 10 year old "Premium Sector" vehicles and replaced with OHV Small Block V8's?

 

[Ruperts Trooper]

Nope. Bentley was downmarket from Rolls throughout their shared history, as they are now. The cheapest Bentley is the $185k Continental GT V8. The big Mulsanne starts at $296k.

The Rolls-Royce Ghost, the cheapest Rolls you can buy, starts at $301k. Higher than the biggest, most expensive Bentley. The Phantom Drophead Coupe starts at $470k.

And this has been true since the 1930's. Bentley was marketed as the less expensive, more sporting alternative, while Rolls was the flagship brand.

Then, sir, you have no soul - or class. If you think that price means anything at that level, you know nothing about real luxury brands.

And they we're never, ever, called "Rolls" - they were ALWAYS "Royces"

 

[autoplaybook]

Then, sir, you have no soul - or class. If you think that price means anything at that level, you know nothing about real luxury brands.

And they we're never, ever, called "Rolls" - they were ALWAYS "Royces"

I have never, ever heard anyone ever call a Rolls-Royce a "Royce." I've heard them called Rolls on TG UK, even.

Also, the price differential must matter, since Bentley outsells Rolls 3:1. At that level, price might not be as big a consideration, sure. But exclusivity certainly is with luxury vehicles.

Rolls-Royce is definitely upmarket from Bentley. In price. And in exclusivity.

 

[Ruperts Trooper]

I have never, ever heard anyone ever call a Rolls-Royce a "Royce." I've heard them called Rolls on TG UK, even.

What has Top Gear got to do with serious motoring journalism - it's a comedy show!

 

[MisterMe]

What has Top Gear got to do with serious motoring journalism - it's a comedy show!

Top Gear has nothing to do with anything. Whatever the brand is called on Top Gear, it is almost always referred to as a "Rolls" and virtually never referred to as a "Royce." This was true long before Top Gear went on the air and will continue to be true long after it goes off the air.

 

[AMERICA 123]

Meanwhile .... we can appreciate these oldie but goodie 2V 'ohv' V8 numbers in yet another way.

Compared to HD 250 / 2500 TDs..... including with regard to peak torque and the torque curve.

Whew -

 

[johnstarnes]

Awkward looking fog lights.

 

[chinamonty]

I don't know which i prefer. The headlights on the Speed or the twins in an enclosure like the Arnage had. I think maybe the big singles but not by much. I don't know which ones are more effective.

 

[Ruperts Trooper]

Top Gear has nothing to do with anything. Whatever the brand is called on Top Gear, it is almost always referred to as a "Rolls" and virtually never referred to as a "Royce." This was true long before Top Gear went on the air and will continue to be true long after it goes off the air.

The Honourable CS Rolls was introduced to Henry Royce by a friend at the Automobile Club, Henry Edmunds, who was also a director of Royce Ltd. Edmunds showed him Royce's car and arranged the historic meeting between Rolls and Royce at the Midland Hotel, Manchester, on 4 May 1904. In spite of his preference for three or four cylinder cars, Rolls was impressed with the two-cylinder Royce 10 and in a subsequent agreement of 23 December 1904 agreed to take all the cars Royce could make. These would be of two, three, four and six cylinders and would be badged as Rolls-Royces.
Bronze bust at Derby Industrial Museum

The first Rolls-Royce car, the Rolls-Royce 10 hp, was unveiled at the Paris Salon in December 1904, although in the early advertising it was the name of Rolls that was emphasised over that of Royce. In 1906 Rolls and Royce formalised their partnership by creating Rolls-Royce Limited, with Rolls appointed Technical managing director on a salary of £750 per annum plus 4% of the profits in excess of £10,000. Rolls provided the financial backing and business acumen to complement Royce's technical expertise. In 1907 Rolls-Royce Limited bought out C.S. Rolls & Co.

They're known as Royce's - but if Americans buy them they can call them whatever they want - it's a culture/class thing.

 

[MonaroSS]

The Honourable CS Rolls was introduced to Henry Royce by a friend at the Automobile Club, Henry Edmunds, who was also a director of Royce Ltd. Edmunds showed him Royce's car and arranged the historic meeting between Rolls and Royce at the Midland Hotel, Manchester, on 4 May 1904. In spite of his preference for three or four cylinder cars, Rolls was impressed with the two-cylinder Royce 10 and in a subsequent agreement of 23 December 1904 agreed to take all the cars Royce could make. These would be of two, three, four and six cylinders and would be badged as Rolls-Royces.
Bronze bust at Derby Industrial Museum

The first Rolls-Royce car, the Rolls-Royce 10 hp, was unveiled at the Paris Salon in December 1904, although in the early advertising it was the name of Rolls that was emphasised over that of Royce. In 1906 Rolls and Royce formalised their partnership by creating Rolls-Royce Limited, with Rolls appointed Technical managing director on a salary of £750 per annum plus 4% of the profits in excess of £10,000. Rolls provided the financial backing and business acumen to complement Royce's technical expertise. In 1907 Rolls-Royce Limited bought out C.S. Rolls & Co.

They're known as Royce's - but if Americans buy them they can call them whatever they want - it's a culture/class thing.

I typed these two inquiries into Google:

royce cars -rolls

rolls cars -royce

Which one do you think got 800,000 hits and which 51 million?

I also Googled these:

"royce and bentley" "car magazine" -rolls -roll -r/

"rolls and bentley" "car magazine" -royce

Which do you think got zero and which do you think got 135? I had to add the -rol and -r/ because the 8 results were either misspellings where they dropped the s off Rolls or where Rolls-Royce was abbreviated to R/Royce.

I do know for a fact that the pompous members of the vintage and veteran Rolls-Royce car club call them Royces just to make themselves stand apart (and believe they are superior to) the rest of the world and the UK public who abbreviate the name down to either Rolls or Roller.

When I lived in the city I had 8 Rolls-Royce cars living in my street and was invited to join their club; but I went mainly to Ferrari Car Club events - which were so much more fun.

 

[autoplaybook]

Sg

The Honourable CS Rolls was introduced to Henry Royce by a friend at the Automobile Club, Henry Edmunds, who was also a director of Royce Ltd. Edmunds showed him Royce's car and arranged the historic meeting between Rolls and Royce at the Midland Hotel, Manchester, on 4 May 1904. In spite of his preference for three or four cylinder cars, Rolls was impressed with the two-cylinder Royce 10 and in a subsequent agreement of 23 December 1904 agreed to take all the cars Royce could make. These would be of two, three, four and six cylinders and would be badged as Rolls-Royces.
Bronze bust at Derby Industrial Museum

The first Rolls-Royce car, the Rolls-Royce 10 hp, was unveiled at the Paris Salon in December 1904, although in the early advertising it was the name of Rolls that was emphasised over that of Royce. In 1906 Rolls and Royce formalised their partnership by creating Rolls-Royce Limited, with Rolls appointed Technical managing director on a salary of £750 per annum plus 4% of the profits in excess of £10,000. Rolls provided the financial backing and business acumen to complement Royce's technical expertise. In 1907 Rolls-Royce Limited bought out C.S. Rolls & Co.

They're known as Royce's - but if Americans buy them they can call them whatever they want - it's a culture/class thing.

No, they're not. They weren't even in the articles you quoted.

Show me a single person on TV or in a major publication that calls ANY Rolls-Royce a "Royce". I can show you dozens, from the UK and America, that call them "Rolls."

 

[AMERICA 123]

I typed these two inquiries into Google:

royce cars -rolls

rolls cars -royce

Which one do you think got 800,000 hits and which 51 million?

I also Googled these:

"royce and bentley" "car magazine" -rolls -roll -r/

"rolls and bentley" "car magazine" -royce

Which do you think got zero and which do you think got 135? I had to add the -rol and -r/ because the 8 results were either misspellings where they dropped the s off Rolls or where Rolls-Royce was abbreviated to R/Royce.

I do know for a fact that the pompous members of the vintage and veteran Rolls-Royce car club call them Royces just to make themselves stand apart (and believe they are superior to) the rest of the world and the UK public who abbreviate the name down to either Rolls or Roller.

When I lived in the city I had 8 Rolls-Royce cars living in my street and was invited to join their club; but I went mainly to Ferrari Car Club events - which were so much more fun.

Well..... maybe so..... but then with that group or least over here we get into the MT thingie ....... and some other stuff. Prefer them all dirty including some mud anyway - so there is that kinda' split as well.

Funny, thought they were made and sold and bought to be used ......

Of late, having a lot more fun with the eclectic crazies who are equal respecters and non respecters of all brands ...... because it's not about the brands to begin with but rather the vehicles themselves and the driving experience which is the real wealth to be had ......... and then.... the pre war / immediate post war stuff.

And with some of young ones....no matter the choices ( JDM and related need not apply ) who question everything and then try to do something about it - with two dimes and nickel. Like as an example, certain old Sports Cars with recently acquired ohv American V6s.....

Porsche groups ( again of the more lively kind ) can be fun....

 

[MonaroSS]

Well..... maybe so..... but then with that group or least over here we get into the MT thingie ....... and some other stuff. Prefer them all dirty including some mud anyway - so there is that kinda' split as well.

Funny, thought they were made and sold and bought to be used ......

Of late, having a lot more fun with the eclectic crazies who are equal respecters and non respecters of all brands ...... because it's not about the brands to begin with but rather the vehicles themselves and the driving experience which is the real wealth to be had ......... and then.... the pre war / immediate post war stuff.

And with some of young ones....no matter the choices ( JDM and related need not apply ) who question everything and then try to do something about it - with two dimes and nickel. Like as an example, certain old Sports Cars with recently acquired ohv American V6s.....

Porsche groups ( again of the more lively kind ) can be fun....

The Ferrari Club, which oftern hired a circuit with the BMW Club, did more than just polish and picnic...

Sorry, don't know what the MT means... pick one

MT Mount
MT Mountain
MT Montana (US postal abbreviation)
MT Mountain Time
MT Manual Transmission (automotive)
MT Metric Ton
MT Medical Technologist
MT Medical Transcriptionist
MT Multi-Tasking
MT Megaton
MT Measurement Ton
MT Multiple Threads / Multi-Threaded (computing term)
MT Magnetic Tape
MT Motor Trend (magazine)
MT My Time
MT Music Therapy
MT Management Team
MT Message Type
MT Musical Theater
MT Mean Time
MT Mathematics
MT Matthew (Bible)
MT Million Tons
MT Mother Tongue
MT Movable Type (web publishing system)
MT Massage Therapist
MT Midtown (neighborhood; band)
MT Mathematics Teaching (Journal)
MT Mato Grosso (Brazil)
MT Medical Tribune
MT Morse Taper
MT Manufacturing Technology
MT Matera (Italy)
MT Monotone
MT Moving Target
MT Motor Transport
MT Meal Ticket
MT Muay Thai (Thai martial art)
MT MegaTokyo (webcomic)
MT MegaTokyo (anime)
MT Mobile Terminal
MT Matanzas (postcode, Cuba)
MT My Turn (gaming)
MT ministry team (US DoD)
MT Mozilla Thunderbird
MT Minor Threat (band)
MT Microtubule
MT Mother Theresa
MT Mathematics Teacher (journal of the National Council of Teachers of Mathematics)
MT Medium Truck
MT Maximum Torque
MT Metallothionein
MT Mobile Terminated (telecommunications)
MT Marianas Trench (band)
MT Membrane Type
MT MegaTokyo (comic strip)
MT Marine Transportation
MT Metric Tonne
MT Meitnerium (element 109)
MT Masterpiece Theater (PBS show)
MT Message Transfer
MT Military Transport
MT Mortise and Tenon (woodworking)
MT Medial Temporal (brain)
MT Mick Taylor (Rolling Stones member)
MT Measurement Technology
MT Mobile Team
MT Mistype(d)
MT means-tested
MT Mark Time
MT Member Training
MT Media Tensión (Spanish: Medium Voltage)
MT Module Test
MT Measured Time
MT Membership Training
MT Mechanical Transport
MT Mobile Transporter
MT Modus Tollens
MT MicroType (typing teaching software)
MT Ministry of Shipping (British archival material; Stanford University; Stanford, CA)
MT Morningthaw (gaming, Asheron's Call)
MT Medieteknik (Swedish)
MT Mechanical Time (Fuze)
MT Mechanical Time (artillery fuze)
MT Mixing Tank
MT Marine Technician
mT Maritime Tropical (weather; air mass)
MT Motor Tanker
MT Master of Technology (degree program)
MT Mode Transition
MT Mean Tide
MT Magister's Terrace (gaming, World of Warcraft)
MT Modern Trade
MT Mississauga Transit (Canada)
MT Missile Technician
MT Mistell (gaming)
MT Milchtrinker (gaming clan)
MT Meningitis Trust (UK)
MT Monon Trail (Indiana)
MT Muscle Thickness
MT Mobile Target
MT Miss Type
MT Mother Tincture
MT Meditación Trascendental (Spanish)
MT Maryland Theatre
MT Medial Temporal Cortex (part of brain)
MT Mana Tombs (gaming)
MT Mission Test
MT Master Trooper
MT Moluccas Time (GMT+0830)
MT Miss Tell (gaming)
MT Mas Tequila
MT Megger Test (insulation resistance)
MT Memoria de Traducción (Spanish: Translation Memory)
MT Management Threshold
MT Message Transmit
MT Medium Terminal
MT Movement Tracker
MT Maximum Tillering
MT Missionary Servants of the Most Holy Trinity (religious order)
MT Mode Transducer
MT Mouse Times (message board)
MT Modechart Toolset
MT Mugglethai (website)
MT Machina Terra (game)
MT Madness Temple (forum)
MT Militiae Templi (gaming clan)
MT Mobius Transformation
MT Multiple-Turbo
MT Metering Tank
MT Mansfield Typewriter
MT Master's of Taxation
MT Modtacular Clan (gaming group)
MT Ministria e Transportit (Albanian: Ministry of Transport)
MT Multiply-Testable
MT Merit Transportation Company
MT Manitoba Transit (Canadian public transit website)
MT Moderator Detritiation
MT Máfia do Tom
MT (USN Rating) Missile Technician
MT Modulation Thermography
MT Military Technician/Training
MT Mission Trainer/Training
MT Mittel Trage (Semi-Delay)
MT Mechanical Time/Transport
MT Meguma Terrain
MT Magnetic Particle Testing (welding)
MT Mach Technologies
MT Maat (German military)
MT Maintenance Test
MT Main Track (railroads)
MT Empty
MT Machine Translation
MT Magnetotelluric
MT Main Tank (gaming)
MT Maintenance Technician
MT Maintenance Trainer
MT Malta
MT Mirage Tank (Westwood Studios)
MT Market Turbulence
MT Modified Tweet (Twitter)

 

[Ruperts Trooper]

As I said, you can call them what you want if you buy one - the BMW-engined ones have never been right to traditionalists - and traditionalists used to be important to Rolls-Royce.

 

[AMERICA 123]

Ruperts Trooper you have it far more right than wrong - in a really big way.

Anybody that worked there up thru 2002 always as did the real core customer base - always referred to them as 'Royce', 'Royce Works' or 'the Royce Works' or similar and then Royce for the vehicle's themselves.

And for exactly the reasons you tried to put forth - about the engineering and so forth and the greater appreciation without being a knock on Rolls for Mr. Royce.


The use of Rolls is a much later occurring pop culture thing and also about some certain buyers with no real appreciation or knowledge - often lacking as expected, in other ways as well.


And yes, it now dominates - so what.


In certain circles, it remains a Royce.


****


Packard did go against RR in a different sense @ different times - all these brand and time period comparisons are often complex and then also misrepresented.


They did not pigeonhole or match up as easily as some would like.

And a lot of things moved around almost on a constant basis.


The Bentley story is often distorted as much as any other.

 

[Ruperts Trooper]

Ruperts Trooper you have it far more right than wrong - in a really big way.

Anybody that worked there up thru 2002 always as did the real core customer base - always referred to them as 'Royce', 'Royce Works' or 'the Royce Works' or similar and then Royce for the vehicle's themselves.

And for exactly the reasons you tried to put forth - about the engineering and so forth and the greater appreciation without being a knock on Rolls for Mr. Royce.


The use of Rolls is a much later occurring pop culture thing and also about some certain buyers with no real appreciation or knowledge - often lacking as expected, in other ways as well.


And yes, it now dominates - so what.


In certain circles, it remains a Royce.


****


Packard did go against RR in a different sense @ different times - all these brand and time period comparisons are often complex and then also misrepresented.


They did not pigeonhole or match up as easily as some would like.

And a lot of things moved around almost on a constant basis.


The Bentley story is often distorted as much as any other.

I did my apprenticeship at "Royce's" in the '60s, so if it's hasn't got a L-series V8 it's not genuine.

As an irrelevant aside, it was Packard that licence-built the R-R Merlin aero engine during WW2 to supplement R-R production.

 

[AMERICA 123]

Yes.

And there is great story behind all that.

Including the wonderful thank you letter to Packard from RR.


While we are at it, here in the 'States, the 2014 standard wheel base Ghost opens up about 34 /36,000 US dollars less than the 2014 Mulsanne.

( The gap had been larger previously. )

For 2015 figure about 20K / ???

Both had some price increases for the 2014s / 2015s; the largest of which I believe is for the bump going from the 2014 Ghost to the 2015 Ghost II.