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Originally posted by surferdude00711@Jun 18 2004, 10:40 PM
If you look, the symbol on/around a Volvo grill is the same symbol that designates a female. Like a circle with a down arrow to the left.
No, it's the man symbol, but it also stands for stregnth. Volvo (rolling in latin) + the strength symbol = rolling strength, their motto. One of the very few company logo that means something.
 

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Originally posted by bigals87z28@Jun 19 2004, 06:51 AM
Where is Ming when you need him! Look, this one is getting a V8! No, not pushrods, but a V8 none the less!
Guess they were getting scared about the Saab 9-7x!?!?! Betcha there 4.4 doesnt have DoD either!
Score 1 for GM.
The XC90 is the best-selling Euro' SUV in North America and Volvo has the best selling line of SUVs (MB and BMW SUV sales were way down last I looked). It's the competition that should be scared.

The 9-7x has enough bad karma around it to cause cancer :frankie:

Anyone who thinks a GM pushrod v8 is superior to a Yamaha DOHC v8 knows nothing...
 

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The 9-7x has massive bad karma because it's a barely facelifted oldsmobile BoF truck with an OHC GM v8 trying to pass as a SAAB! It's just wrong, wrong, wrong!

And the Yamaha engine will be a gleaming alloy work of art, with every bit of tech they can think to throw at it. Sure it'll cost more, but it's no doubt the superior engine. The TrailBlazer is barely competative in its class - how is it going to do against BMW, MB, etc in Saab clothing!?!
 

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Originally posted by mgescuro+Jun 20 2004, 05:16 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (mgescuro @ Jun 20 2004, 05:16 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-SUPERBADD75@Jun 19 2004, 11:27 PM

plenty of us have driven other GMT-360s, and, uh, they're not that great. a SAAB front end and a little suspension tuning isn't enough to make it a worthy competitor against stout competition. the X5, the XC90, Cayenne/Touareg... all very good, very modern SUVs. the SAABlazer is an old school SUV, not up to the task of today's luxury SUV market. get over it. stop worshipping GM just because they're GM. jeez.....
First of all, the 9-7X won't be competing with an X5 or a Cayenne or Touareg.
It is better geared to compete with M-Class and Discovery.

Sportier tuning, bigger wheels/tires, and a more powerful V8, better leather, a better dash, shoudl give the 9-7X enough value over the other 360s. [/b][/quote]
The M-class will soon be dead, to be replaced by a unibody crossover. The new Discovery, while still technically BoF, is infinitely more refined than the last (getting the Jag' v8, etc.) and is an actual off-roader anyways.

Spec-wise he only thing the 9-7x will be competeing with is the Aviator, which is a far deeper makeover than this "Saab" (with an entirely different interior and suspension components than the Explorer, which is already newer and more refined than this GM platform). And the Aviator hasn't been competeing that well anyways.
 

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I didn't realize the TrailBlazer still had a live rear axel! This "Saab" is completely hopeless.

...then again hordes of people are dumb enough to buy the re-trimmed, barely facelifted, solid-rear axel Escalade (when the FAR supieror Navigator is available for the same money). However I'm not sure those people are really into Saab ;)

And I'm pretty sure the TrailBlazer and Explorer are the same size. They can fit the third row because it's packaged better (e.g. IRS vs. live axel).

I really wish GM would just cut their losses and sell Saab before it's worthless :mrt:
 

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The Escalade is hyper-weak 'cause it's just a badge swap (like this Saab):

Navi' vs. Expedition:






Escalade vs. Tahoe






Plus of course the Navi' has IRS (how could that be worse than the Escalades solid axel?) and proper OHC engines (again, NO WAY the Escalade is as refined).

There's 100% no reason to pay more for the Escalade than the Tahoe - you could just buy an aftermarket grill and trim pieces and voila! And Escalade!
 

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It's no secret the Navi' has less horsepower (look at the specs!). However these are supposed to be luxury vehicles, so smoothness and refinement should be priority #1. There's simply no way GMs engineers are so wonderful and Ford's so bad that the old, mass-market 16 valve GM v8 is smoother than the new, designed-for-lincoln 32 valve Ford w/ timing. The Navi' is also getting the Jag' 6-speed auto next year, which should put even more distance betwen it and the Cadi'.

Only on this site could stateing the Navigator is superior to the Escalade have people jumping all over you :rolleyes:
 

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Originally posted by Hudson+Jun 21 2004, 03:02 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Hudson @ Jun 21 2004, 03:02 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-stewacide@Jun 20 2004, 12:34 AM
The M-class will soon be dead, to be replaced by a unibody crossover. The new Discovery, while still technically BoF, is infinitely more refined than the last (getting the Jag' v8, etc.) and is an actual off-roader anyways.

Spec-wise he only thing the 9-7x will be competeing with is the Aviator, which is a far deeper makeover than this "Saab" (with an entirely different interior and suspension components than the Explorer, which is already newer and more refined than this GM platform). And the Aviator hasn't been competeing that well anyways.
Please don't take this as me jumping on the "bash Stewie" band wagon, but what is your definition of "crossover?" What makes the current M-Class better than the next-generation? [/b][/quote]
I'm saying the next will be better (except probably off-road, where nobody takes it) because it's moving to unibody construction. Lighter, better ride, better space utilization, etc. According to the thread on top of this one they'll be both an SUV and a MPV on the same platform.

As for the difference between a crossover, unibody-SUV, and MPV, who the hell knows anymore. I doubt, however, this Merc' will be a true off-roader unibody in the veign of the Range Rover or Grand Cherokee.
 

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That Motor Trend comparison is of the old Navigator vs. the Escalade, both of which were lame badge-jobs. Show me where any magazine says the 2004 Navigator is in any way inferior to the 2004 Escalade?

The last 2004 Escalade review I've seen was on Top Gear, and to quote them: "the last time I felt plastic this cheap it had tic-tacs inside" :lol:
 
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