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Can you post a larger high res version of this so I can keep a copy of it in a folder with the rest of your chops. That is ****in awesome! I like to look at them full screen and think about what life could be like in a perfect car world!
 

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A little shorter grille, which would add a slight slope to the hood.


Also think a lower deck-lid might help.
 

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I wouldn't knock it because I could never make any of the chops you do. But if you want my opinion on it I would say the proportions are off and the grill is good for an SUV but not a car. Even one as bulky as this. I will say, the convertible 2 door caddy you did the other day was awesome! Keeping in mind that opinions are subjective so Jimmy likes this one but I don't.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Can you post a larger high res version of this so I can keep a copy of it in a folder with the rest of your chops. That is ****in awesome! I like to look at them full screen and think about what life could be like in a perfect car world!
I'll do that for you later today when I get back to the large originals.


;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I wouldn't knock it because I could never make any of the chops you do. But if you want my opinion on it I would say the proportions are off and the grill is good for an SUV but not a car. Even one as bulky as this. I will say, the convertible 2 door caddy you did the other day was awesome! Keeping in mind that opinions are subjective so Jimmy likes this one but I don't.
Thanks. I was going for a Chrysler 300 look with the bluff grille. I have found some Americans really like that and many don't. Must be an either/or thing...



;)
 

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I'm not a mind reader so...
People are saying they don't like this chop but not actually describing why? Can somebody help me out and tell me what is wrong with this sedan, i.e. the front, the shape, the proportions - what exactly? To me it looks like a Chrysler 300 with an Escalade front...



;)
The sedan is Nearly production ready in my opinion. Dynamite! I can't see the rear well enough, so it may be the weakest part, but to me it looks great! Bold, strong, Cadillac. It should be what cadillac is shooting for!
Maybe you are overly sensitive to others' criticisms. Maybe you are trying to please a group that is negative to most initiatives. Who knows? It's Great to me!
 

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Three thoughts. First, the scale of the grill is, to my eyes, too big. Second, the c-pillar and raised trunk look tacked on and not integrated with the rest of the design. And last, the overall shape and forms are a bit dated looking. There is a bit of first generation Chrysler 300 here, and that car is nearly a decade old and really common here. Even if you played with fixing some of the details, I think you'd end up with a mash up of the 300 and the A&S facelifted DTS. Too soon for those designs to be retro; right now, they are just old.

Those shapes work fine on the different bones of the SUV, but are lacking on the much different proportions of the sedan.

That said, A&S is strongly rooted in the '67 Eldorado. That's a lovely car, but far from the only heritage Cadillac has. I wonder what A&S might evolve into if it was influenced by, say, the '76 Seville. Or, the '79 Eldorado. Both have some of the edginess of the first Eldo, but introduce other elements into the mix, including a more formal backlight and more horizontal lighting elements. Both have more exaggerated cabin-rear proportions as well.


 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Three thoughts. First, the scale of the grill is, to my eyes, too big. Second, the c-pillar and raised trunk look tacked on and not integrated with the rest of the design. And last, the overall shape and forms are a bit dated looking. There is a bit of first generation Chrysler 300 here, and that car is nearly a decade old and really common here. Even if you played with fixing some of the details, I think you'd end up with a mash up of the 300 and the A&S facelifted DTS. Too soon for those designs to be retro; right now, they are just old.

Those shapes work fine on the different bones of the SUV, but are lacking on the much different proportions of the sedan.

That said, A&S is strongly rooted in the '67 Eldorado. That's a lovely car, but far from the only heritage Cadillac has. I wonder what A&S might evolve into if it was influenced by, say, the '76 Seville. Or, the '79 Eldorado. Both have some of the edginess of the first Eldo, but introduce other elements into the mix, including a more formal backlight and more horizontal lighting elements. Both have more exaggerated cabin-rear proportions as well.


Yes it would be bigger than the 300 as I think Omega will be and Zeta could easily be. But to me a real Cadillac is a big car. Before Seville they never needed an 'entry level' vehicle. On the rear roofline I already posted on that in the other thread - see bottom below.

Personally i think the theme of what makes the Slade ao popular needs to stay which is the bold in your face styling. I think the A&S styling needs to change. The Slade lineup would need its own styling cues. The roof line is the biggest issue for me on the sedan. It seems to squared off or something.
That's interesting about the roofline. I think that may be what Z Fury above is also talking about with the rear reminding him of the Avalanche rear.

The reason I did the retro squared off roof is because I have over the years had so many people ask me to add a more formal upright roofline as there are many people who don't like that all cars today are virtually fastbacks.

There seems to be a divide in American taste - some like old-school, some like modern. I'm not exactly sure how to reconcile the two...


;)
 

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Its okay, just a little to boxy, I say if the front was reworked a little with a smaller grill you should be golden. Honestly it looks like a RWD Caprice/Impala updated from the 70's, except for the front end treatment.
 

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• The C pillar and back does not look good. The DLO has to be shaped to work with the new greenhouse.
• The "trunk" above the "bone line" is excessive. It's way too high.
• The body has too much heft below the doors.

Otherwise, I don't really mind it.

I didn't take the time to fully read the concept of your initial proposal, but I glanced at it and I generally got what I was looking at and like the idea of an "Escalade sedan".
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Better, but the decklid is still too high. Don't be discouraged.
I can cut the rear height down but when it comes to aerodynamics the rear is THE critical area that most drag is created, and that is why you see so many cars today with high deck lids and bangle butts. Because when a three box design draws the air down a too steep rear window or too far down creates a break-up of the laminar flow into turbulence... So fastback rear windows and high rear deck lids is the norm. It all depends on what FE you want... plus you get more luggage space.

It's one thing to do a more retro style but people don't want retro gas mileage. So now you know why we see wedge designs like CTS ATS as it is to try to hide the high trunk lid.



;)
 

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I really like it until you go past the rear doors. From there on back, I see too much Avalanche / Ridgeline proportions. But like you say, there is other considerations.


Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I really like it until you go past the rear doors. From there on back, I see too much Avalanche / Ridgeline proportions. But like you say, there is other considerations.


Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App

How about a bangle/bustle which keeps the deck height but sweeps the roofline down to the taillights...





;)
 
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