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Reuters
By Yilei Sun, Brenda Goh

BEIJING, Nov 25 (Reuters) - Tesla Inc plans to start manufacturing electric vehicle (EV) chargers in China in 2021, according to a document submitted to the Shanghai authorities by the U.S. firm which is seeking to expand sales in the world’s biggest car market.

Tesla, which now sells its Model 3 electric cars in China and plans to deliver its Model Y sport utility vehicles in 2021, plans to invest 42 million yuan ($6.4 million) in a new factory to make the chargers, also known as charging piles, near its car plant in Shanghai, the document seen by Reuters said.

China, which offers hefty subsidies for electric vehicles as it seeks to cut down on pollution from petrol or diesel cars, has been expanding its nationwide network of charging points, one of the biggest challenges to encouraging adoption of EVs.

Full article: https://www.reuters.com/article/tesla-electric-china-idUKL1N2IB18I
 

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Too bad his greed outweighs any patriotism he may be accidentally carrying in some remote corner of his brain.
 

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Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
Too bad his greed outweighs any patriotism he may be accidentally carrying in some remote corner of his brain.
Why would there be any? What gave you that assumption? His willingness to take federal funds? Or his willingness to put workers at risk?

That sucks, but why should they be any different than most other companies?
Anyone who bet on decoupling with China is getting hosed right now. The gravy train will miss any US company dumb enough to move from China https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-economy-industrial-profits-idUSKBN28704B
 

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Anyone who bet on decoupling with China is getting hosed right now. The gravy train will miss any US company dumb enough to move from China https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-economy-industrial-profits-idUSKBN28704B
These are one time gains due to weak prior year numbers to compare to and rebounding from lost sales/manufacturing due to China. I'm firmly in the "dumb to concentrate your business in China". Stay in China, but just for business within China. Any goods for export should be manufactured elsewhere.
 

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They already build cars there so it only makes sense to build the chargers there too.
+1
China's government subsidizes both EV as well as EVSE (such as chargers).
 

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Well, It makes sense for Tesla, for the Free world, not so much. How much longer can it be free? Its not Musks job to manage foreign relations, its up to our elected representatives, assuming of course they are elected, ... evidence suggests they are not elected...
 

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Governments only interfere in free markets like vehicles when they want to force change that otherwise wouldn’t happen. So without legislation against ICEs, excessive taxes on their fuels and financial incentives for choosing a BEV, those vehicles would be greeted with far less enthusiasm and change would happen more slowly.

I have to wonder how many buyers will embrace BEVs knowing that eventually they will have to pay for all the taxes now being paid by ICE users. There is no free lunch on energy and the people who control it.
 

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Governments only interfere in free markets like vehicles when they want to force change that otherwise wouldn’t happen. So without legislation against ICEs, excessive taxes on their fuels and financial incentives for choosing a BEV, those vehicles would be greeted with far less enthusiasm and change would happen more slowly.

I have to wonder how many buyers will embrace BEVs knowing that eventually they will have to pay for all the taxes now being paid by ICE users. There is no free lunch on energy and the people who control it.
The EV Religion is also drunk on the moral superiority of paying higher taxes, though they never make donations to the Feds or State Treasuries
 

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Governments only interfere in free markets like vehicles when they want to force change that otherwise wouldn’t happen. So without legislation against ICEs, excessive taxes on their fuels and financial incentives for choosing a BEV, those vehicles would be greeted with far less enthusiasm and change would happen more slowly.

I have to wonder how many buyers will embrace BEVs knowing that eventually they will have to pay for all the taxes now being paid by ICE users. There is no free lunch on energy and the people who control it.
Is it government interference to give incentives and cash breaks to large oil as well? $16 billion a year can go a long way somewhere else as well.
 

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Is it government interference to give incentives and cash breaks to large oil as well? $16 billion a year can go a long way somewhere else as well.
How about you offset that $16B will total taxes collected from the Industry, from payroll taxes etc to all the punitive taxes, see if there is any 'subsidy' to the oil industry.
 

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Is it government interference to give incentives and cash breaks to large oil as well? $16 billion a year can go a long way somewhere else as well.
I’d say it comes from the power bases influencing their politicians just as the green side of politics with EVs is influenced by their power base. It’s not that simple but kinda seems that way....

The only reason for supporting the oil industry is to keep work in the US instead of importing refined products from elsewhere, increasing the money drain.

Equally, fracking and shale oil mining are ways of guaranteeing domestic gas and oil supplies and having some influence on OPEC’s maximum pricing objectives. Domestic gas offers a way of nearly halving CO2 in power production almost immediately over coal fired power plants.

The point I was making is that once all that other tax income disappears, BEV owners will be expected to carry that tax burden as well.
The optics are that EVs will be cheaper to operate because no fuel cost and the taxes that go with that.....
 

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I’d say it comes from the power bases influencing their politicians just as the green side of politics with EVs is influenced by their power base. It’s not that simple but kinda seems that way....

The only reason for supporting the oil industry is to keep work in the US instead of importing refined products from elsewhere, increasing the money drain.

Equally, fracking and shale oil mining are ways of guaranteeing domestic gas and oil supplies and having some influence on OPEC’s maximum pricing objectives. Domestic gas offers a way of nearly halving CO2 in power production almost immediately over coal fired power plants.

The point I was making is that once all that other tax income disappears, BEV owners will be expected to carry that tax burden as well.
The optics are that EVs will be cheaper to operate because no fuel cost and the taxes that go with that.....
The hike on electric bills will be huge, forcing people to solar and off the grid, eventually making new cars unaffordable, but the dream for the religion is to force people into mass transit.. you know.. the masses...
 

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Is it government interference to give incentives and cash breaks to large oil as well?
In China? It's not government interference, but government ownership and control. Sinopec Group, CNOOC Group, and CNPC are all state owned enterprises.
 

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The hike on electric bills will be huge, forcing people to solar and off the grid, eventually making new cars unaffordable, but the dream for the religion is to force people into mass transit.. you know.. the masses...
By law, all taxes on fuel are used for road maintenance and upgrades, so when everyone switches, that has to be taken by other means, most likely by a road use tax on top of those increased electric utilities bills. There’s no way of avoiding compulsory taxes.
 

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By law, all taxes on fuel are used for road maintenance and upgrades, so when everyone switches, that has to be taken by other means, most likely by a road use tax on top of those increased electric utilities bills. There’s no way of avoiding compulsory taxes.
Here in Commiefornia, the law is almost always ignored and funds diverted to the whims of our masters. The deficit happy general funds. Safe for Federal funded freeway networks, our state roads are horrible...
 

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There’s no way of avoiding compulsory taxes.
In the U.S., our primary federal tax collecting agency, IRS, has the unofficial slogan "we've got it what it takes to take what you've got". They aren't kiddin'!
 

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By law, all taxes on fuel are used for road maintenance and upgrades, so when everyone switches, that has to be taken by other means, most likely by a road use tax on top of those increased electric utilities bills. There’s no way of avoiding compulsory taxes.
Uhhhh by law it's what ever the states want to do with the taxes they collect. Indiana passed a new road tax and only 29 percent is actually going to funds marked for road improvements.

EVs are cheaper to operate. It's easy to see. Unless gas hits 60 cents they'll still be cheaper even if you tax them higher.
 

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How about you offset that $16B will total taxes collected from the Industry, from payroll taxes etc to all the punitive taxes, see if there is any 'subsidy' to the oil industry.
What?? Are you trying to say the government is paying the oil industry to work?

In 2019 the net income was $28 billion.
 
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