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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Another Firebird try from me. For this one, I kinda burrowed the grille from Dodge's new Challenger(which is among my favorites on the road these days), and split it in two for the Pontiac logo. DOES NOT look like Firebired I know, and the proportion came out funny, but I guess you can laugh at it. Enjoy.

 

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It's got too many exterior air vents, and it's a little "overstyled".

Other than that, I'm liking what I see.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 · (Edited)
Backseat is going to be really, really tight.

And they're going to have to go to Holden for the RWD engineering...sorry buddy.

They don't have to. As far as I know, new Camaro is NOT using the Holden product for its RWD. It can use the Camaro's AMERICAN made RWD system(though I DESPICE that lame Chevys), or if not, no matter how long it's going to take, they can use the previous generation Firebirds system, just tweeked BY the AMERICAN engineers. Just NOT Holden, OR any other non-North American. I just DON'T want Pontiacs to be involved anything with the Holden. I don't want them anything to do with Holden. For, now I hate Holden for all that non-sence of rebadging their stupid looking cars as a Pontiac and ruining the styles that once I loved. I know, I am one of the minority, but I am a lover of the outrageous/unique Pontiac interiors of the past, and the body side moldings that TELL you it's a Pontiac right away, though my current GP don't have it(which I love just as is however). I want Pontiacs to be Pontiacs, nothing else. Firebird should ONLY be NORTH AMERICAN, no where else. AT LEAST for the Firebird, though it's been known that there will be no Firebirds, nor anymore Pontiacs. At least the REAL North American Pontiacs that is.

In other words, I don't want Holden to do anything with the Pontiac. No matter how good or crappy they are. I just don't want the gracious Pontiac grille and logo to on that lame Aussie Holdens and I want the NORTH AMERICAN designers and engineers gets their share of the job and to get paid for it, NOT to lose their job to the guys/gals downunder.
 

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the rear should be the same as the Camaro.
 

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How much Chevy or Holden is in the vehicle depends on what it's based off of, and its parts content.

If you intend to base that Firebird off of the Zeta platform, it automatically has Holden in it because the platform was originally developed for Holden.
Also, to save money on development, some Chevy parts have to be in there - like if you want to use the Camaro's engines (which are excellent and would perform great in a Firebird BTW).

To be honest, I'd take a GTO over a Firebird anyways...your drawing is very good, you've come a long way from the first drawing of yours I've seen. :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Yes it is. Why else were they testing Camaros in Australia?
Then, Firebird should use the older, previous gen 2002 Firebird drivetrain that was designed and built IN NORTH AMERICA. I don't care about the old engineering, I still prefer it over anything Holden. I don't care about Chevy. I want the Pontiacs to be a REAL North American Pontiacs. I don't want any Holdens posing as Pontiac. That's how much I hate imported junks labeled as Pontiacs. I know I am one of the very few minority, but I don't want anything IMPORTED from outside of North America to have Pontiac names and logos. Period.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
The Front actually reminds me of the 77-78 model!
That was actually the kind of look I was going for. With the side and the back with the 02 Firebird mixed with the 68 Firebird's rear air vents, and the 3 split horizontal tail-lights it had.

I just want the next Firebird to look COMPLETELY different than the retro Camaro which I hate.
 

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Though some of the proportions are a bit off (I think the passenger-side front wheel, in particular), the themes here are quite attractive. The front, particularly, reimagines a Pontiac front end that gives a nod to the iconic "Bandit"-era Firebirds without looking particularly retro.

Regarding the Holden-hate, though, I think everyone here knows how you feel about it, but it's a non-starter in the real world. GM is a global company that needs to tap into international expertise. Zeta is a global platform that happens to have originated in Australia. To not use it because of its origin -- particularly because, besides weight, it's world-class -- doesn't make any sense.

Certainly, I can see an arguement for NA design/styling, but if the greasy bits are good, it doesn't really matter where they came from.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
Actually, I don't really 'HATE' Holden, or Australia on a whole. I just don't like the idea of this so called 'GLOBAL' project s***. I can live with having some rebadges from the already existing model of Holden, but I Hate the idea of killing the AMERICAN models in place of it. It seems only the Pontiacs are getting these Holden imports, while Buick, Chevy and others, aside from making some of their models elsewhere for sale in that particular regions, DON'T import the already exising models and rebadges it. Even if they do, they DON'T kill their current models. The Aussie G8 killed the Bonneville, AND the Grand Prix, which to me, are 2 of the greatest NORTH AMERICAN made sedans, even though the GP is a RE-SKINNED(NOT A REBADGE which I hate) Impala with a way sportier look. To me, G8 is nothing more than an imposter that killed 2 of the established greats. If Pontiac went on selling the G8 WITHOUT dropping the Bonniville and Grand Prix, since the price of the G8 kinda fits in between the 2, I would have not hated the Holden this much. Even when they imported the Holden and re-badged it as GTO, as ugly as it was, I did not hated them, until now. Now they are saying that the G6 will also be replaced by another import from Holden, and the rumors that the Pontiac will be closed down soon, I blame Holden for all of it.

Sorry for all this, but that's how I see it, and unless Chevy kills that lame Impala that killed Grand Prix(since I blame Impala partly for the demise of my car, since Impala didn't get killed while unfairly killing GP, no matter how good its' sales were), and bring back Grand Prix, Bonniville, that are NOT a re-badge of an Holden, my business will be elsewhere. NOT GM.

In other words, I don't care if Chevy, Buick and others to go 'global' and import their models, I just want the Pontiacs to remain NOTHING BUT Pontiac that was made in good ol' North America. I can care less about other divisions, I just don't want Pontiac to have ANY imports, just domestics. Just Pontiac.

Call me childish, arrogant, selfish, foolish, dumb or whatever, but that's my point of view that will never change and that's how I view this 'GLOBALIZATION' trash.
 

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Ironically, Canadian Pontiacs up until the early 1970s were actually built on Chevy chassis and used Chevy engines. This was due to the relatively small Canadian market and the different dealer structure here.

The cars shared basic styling with their US counterparts.

My Dad's 1962 Pontiac Parisienne came from the factory with a Chevy 283 smallblock and powerglide. You could get a Pontiac here with a Chevy 409 (fairly rare).

See http://www.bruneauperformance.ca/intro.html for more information.
 

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Mate, sounds like your mind is set, but from my perspective instead of fighting globalisation why not embrace it and use the resources that it awards you to your advantage? The US car market is in desperate need of a revamp, I'm a GM fan but there's Japanese and German products that are having them for breakfast in terms of build quality/ride/handling/saftey/design/pricing, hell what more is there... I will not call you names for stating your opinion as that's far from my style but instead sugguest you open your mind a little more. Being built 100% in America doesn't neccasarily lead to the best vehicle for Americans. Jethro is dead and not buying cars and isn't who represents the US consumer anymore. The US has a black president and a population of highly educated people.... it might be time to move on as the future is not in the past, smile when you look back, but be excited when you look foward.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Mate, sounds like your mind is set, but from my perspective instead of fighting globalisation why not embrace it and use the resources that it awards you to your advantage? The US car market is in desperate need of a revamp, I'm a GM fan but there's Japanese and German products that are having them for breakfast in terms of build quality/ride/handling/saftey/design/pricing, hell what more is there... I will not call you names for stating your opinion as that's far from my style but instead sugguest you open your mind a little more. Being built 100% in America doesn't neccasarily lead to the best vehicle for Americans. Jethro is dead and not buying cars and isn't who represents the US consumer anymore. The US has a black president and a population of highly educated people.... it might be time to move on as the future is not in the past, smile when you look back, but be excited when you look foward.
I know, I need to lighten up. It's just that, I don't know, whenever it comes to Holden, I get excited and comes outburst like that. I just don't like the idea that Holden is doing business as not themselves and as Pontiac instead. As I said, I have NOTHING against Holden, FPV, or Australia as a whole. I just don't like this re-badging business and the fact that Pontiac is relying on it without working for their paycheck doing the work IN North America. That's part of the reason. Yeah, I DID voted for Mr Obama and I feel great that he won, since it's a new chapter for US, but my view of the Pontiac haven't changed. If they replace EVERY ONE of their models with the Holden's re-badge, I want them dead instead. It's not because I hate Holden, but because of the lazyness of the North American Pontiac workers. I know, it may not be their fault, but the CEO and the head of the company whose really messing like this, but still, I want to see SOME, if not all, AMERICAN models to stay, rather than getting killed for an Aussie replacement, which I heard G6 will be next......
 

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You really need to relax on the anti Holden opinion. Holden have been making RWD cars for a loooong time and have made a decent platform for GM. If it is their to be used then use it. Going back to an outdated platform would ruin the cars feel. GM can't afford to make an entirely new platform for the car, as long as the car goes well, looks the part and handles and is built in America to keep you happy you shouldn't be overly fussed
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I consider this to be an old thread, though it's only about a week or so old. I have a new one I made, but I am not going to post that.

btw, My mind is already set up. Unless they get their acts together, spend some time and money and develop the RWD in-house in US/Canada, that's it. I ain't going to WASTE my money on the imports from down under. That's final for me. I only buy North American BECAUSE they are MADE in North America. I am NOT going to spend money for anything that was made elsewhere. I don't care about other divisions, but if Pontiac DON'T use the drivetrain and stuffs that ARE American, no matter how good or bad, and no matter how old it is, I am not going to bother putting the money into them. I still prefer 20-30 year old technology over anything new that was made OUTSIDE of US/Canada. I prefer the RWD that was on the 02 Firebird, that, to my best of my knowledge, designed and engineered in North America over anything that Holden, Daewoo or WHATEVER have developped that's new and more advanced. I only buy AMERICAN since they are MADE in America. No other reasons, and I don't buy Chevy's since GM favors only them just because they are the volume seller, which to me is a Bullsh** that killed Grand Prix while they kept their 'precious' Impala crap just because that ***** sells better.

Sorry about another outburst like this, but no-one will force me to buy Aussie imports that 'POSES' as Pontiac. G8 is a Holden, NOT a Pontiac, and I will NEVER call it a Pontiac since it is nothing more than a Holden imposter. That's it.
 
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