Sure those are all nice cars, but the ones he mentioned are all priced 35k+.
Aside from the sky/solstice, but those dont sport a v-8.

 

GReek BOy - Patience, my son, patience.

But granted, time does seem to be in limited quantity for GM these days.

 

GReek BOy - Patience, my son, patience.

But granted, time does seem to be in limited quantity for GM these days.

We have been hearing this for 20 years, GM needs to get the ball rolling.

 

Bob, How is a platform specific to Caddy sopposed to spawn new non caddy vehicles?? I have heard the rumors of Sigma-lite, but really...

 

Hmmmmm, what would work here? HOW ABOUT A CAMARO!!! :yup: :yup: :yup:

 

You can't blame him too much though for being all talk and no action because if zeta were to go through it would have to compete with the comparable chrsylers and also some very well off models from foreign automakers in that range. As for a limited zeta for the camaro, i don't think that will materialize for a very very long time.

 

lutz should do more listening, then talking, when it comes to RWD. we all know of the rwd products gm has, but so far, none are high volume and price in mid 20k range.

 

:hyper: :hyper: :hyper: Build a Camaro BOB!! We are getting tired of waiting on this thing

 

I think this rwd/fwd thing misses the point.

The future is four wheel drive. It can work in either transverse or longitudinal engine mounting. The Ford 500 has enjoyed much greater demand than imagined for its 4x4 version; people want this feature and will pay a premium of at least $3000 for it.

Now consider that, on say a FWD Monte Carlo, if you could add a rear electric motor and irs differential with half shafts, you would have a "triple play"

1. 4x4 traction/handling in both winter and 'performance' driving

2. More total power/acceleration via added DC motor torque

3. Increased gas mileage in stop/start city traffic.

Who wouldn't pay more for that? Suddenly the hybrid cost becomes 'rational' by adding performance and capability rather than just subtracting from the gas bill.

It could be added as an option easily, without the need to reconfigure the rest of the drivetrain. As Dodge showed with the Durango hybrid concept the DC power makes it so you don't have to mechanically link the two power sources. The equalization of front and rear wheel speeds simply comes "through the road" as Dodge pointed out.

Even on a conventional, mechanically linked, non-hybrid 4x4 systems, the current FWD cars would enjoy advantages.

If you have a transverse engine V8 Monte Carlo, splitting half the torque to go to the rear gets rid of the torque steer and oversteer problem, and allows lower gearing without breaking components. Wet surface handling is improved markedly of course, but Audi Quattro cars showed that even dry pavement handling can be better too.

 

:hyper: :hyper: :hyper: Build a Camaro BOB!! We are getting tired of waiting on this thing

yeah bob, go build a camaro, then i might be more inclined to listen. go put that on your blog bob!! oh, and sign me up for a rwd v8 impala, thanks bob!

 

We have been hearing this for 20 years, GM needs to get the ball rolling.

I agree. The things he speaks of - about GM knowing the advantages and appeal of RWD - we're all aware of. Of course GM knows that lots of people prefer RWD; but the brass doesn't care. I don't blame Bob for it, because we all know he would have 50% of GM vehicles be RWD if he could (the other half would be AWD ), but he's not really telling us anything new here. I think a new Camaro/Firebird and a solid RWD sedan platform would satisfy 90% of RWD advocates out there. Is that really so much to ask? GM built them for over a CENTURY, but now they can't muster the R&D to go back to what they have 100 years of experience in? I CALL BULLSH*T!!

 

Sure those are all nice cars, but the ones he mentioned are all priced 35k+.
Aside from the sky/solstice, but those dont sport a v-8.

You got that right. Thats great for all the people who can afford 35k+ but the average guy like me can't even dream of having a RWD car with a v8 or even v6 for that matter. If GM ever decides to build a nice RWD 2 door/4 door car with v6 and v8 option at a reasonable price they will do well. What I don't understand is if they can build a large full size truck with two v8 options that they can sell for 20k why can't they do that with a car?

 

You can't blame him too much though for being all talk and no action because if zeta were to go through it would have to compete with the comparable chrsylers and also some very well off models from foreign automakers in that range. As for a limited zeta for the camaro, i don't think that will materialize for a very very long time.

[SARCASM] Yeah, we wouldn't want GM to actually, you know, be competetive. They should just continue building mediocre stuff only a loyalist would want.[/SARCASM]

Jeez, looks like Lutz has been completely assimilated by the GM suits. Just more of the same drivel: "we feel our high end cars are enough for you fans of RWD, so if you don't have $35K+ you better either: like low end pickup trucks, get lucky enough to be one of the 20K/yr Solstice (persuming you can live with a 2 seat roadster in the first place), or settle for FWD because we don't feel like making some affordable RWD offerings." Its scary when even "Mr. Car Guy" is towing the BS company line and resists building what is in demand. If Lutz was a car, he'd be a Pontiac Sunfire. Just like the only thing that sets a Sunfire apart from a Cavalier is gaudy styling, the only thing that sets Lutz apart from the typical GM suit is just a spun image.

 

Before news about Zeta came out, everyone voiced their opinions about how the full size trucks and SUVs at GM were outdated, aged, just plain old. They've taken the steps to deal with that and I know, in a company the size of GM, they should be able to continue developing RWD cars at the same time. I do believe they are developing something. What that is, is anyone's guess.

It's time now, or WITHIN the next two years that GM introduces an affordable and attractive RWD sedan, or coupe. The hourglass is almost finished.

 

I’ll just say that Lori and I appreciate your patience. You won’t be sorry you waited once you have one.

America is tired of waiting Bob... time to deliver

and why not apologize instead of the sarcastic "you won't be sorry"? How about some groveling :rotf:

talk is cheap

 

im starting to think bob is clueless. yes, he has improved quality of vehicles from gm, but without some affordable rwd sedans/coupes, their are still more desirable cars offered by competitors. 300/magnum,350z,mustang.

if chrysler 300/dodge magnum had been available when i was in market for new car, thats what would have made its way to my driveway bob. so get your act together, because our patiance is running thin.

 

talk is cheap

Amen!

Hmm...and what's this with they're STUDYING the PHENOMENON?!

Good night shirt tail. By the time they're done studying, Dodge and Ford will have aced the test....

Aye aye aye.


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I feel that the GM hopeful here on this site are growing tired of the GM line of "its coming, just hold on". Even I, yes me, am getting tired of it.
I understand that GM has to do certain things, but it seems they arent doing the right things to help turn the tide. They are bringing out great product, and its hard to find fault in a lot of the new stuff, but they dont have the BIG product. Solstice will have the impact, but not the production to make a deep enough impact. G6 coupe and hard top vert will be ok, but still leaves something open.
GM needs a WHOLY CRAP! product, and they need people to come in droves. It doesnt have to be RWD (but does seem to be the trendy thing), and it needs ot have style and luxury for a price that most people can afford.

 

im starting to think bob is clueless. yes, he has improved quality of vehicles from gm, but without some affordable rwd sedans/coupes, their are still more desirable cars offered by competitors. 300/magnum,350z,mustang.

if chrysler 300/dodge magnum had been available when i was in market for new car, thats what would have made its way to my driveway bob. so get your act together, because our patiance is running thin.

Didnt GM say that it could not provide a package like the 300/300c in the same price range?

 

Someone at GM should learn Red Forman's moto, "I stick my foot up ur A**" and start kickin GM in gear. If GM wants to succed they better start producing products faster, so that by the time they come out they will not be out of style or underpowered. (HHR, Malibu, Saturn's L series, HHR)

 

I didn't bother clicking the link to continue reading, after I saw him blowing smoke up our asses by listing all of GM's current RWD efforts. A bunch of niche, luxury, and expensive vehicles just don't cut it.

 

Reading that statement from Bob, I am not feeling the warm & fuzzies with his thoughts. Good the GTO is selling on the West Coast but what about other vehicles. The competition is getting hotter and hotter and all we keep hearing is the same junk. I see why the investment analysis has downgraded GM. The primary reason was the GM has NOT given any ideas to its turn around plan. Are there any ground breaking vehicles on the horizon for GM? And as much as I like the Solstice it will not bring GM from the brink!!! Nor is the G6. Sorry but I am losing patience!!!

 

Someone at GM should learn Red Forman's moto, "I stick my foot up ur A**" and start kickin GM in gear. If GM wants to succed they better start producing products faster, so that by the time they come out they will not be out of style or underpowered. (HHR, Malibu, Saturn's L series, HHR)

Why is the HHR in production?? Why is GM going retro when Toyota, Honda, and Nissan is going boxy plus didn't Chrysler already do retro with the PT Cruiser?!!!!!!!!

 

If GM wants to succed they better start producing products faster, so that by the time they come out they will not be out of style or underpowered. (HHR, Malibu, Saturn's L series, HHR)

I also think GM may want to start holding some of these new products close to their vest, so as not to give the competition too much of a heads up as to what they are working on. GM in the 1950's was REAL TIGHT with what imformation came out and when.

But true, GM does need to start getting these products to market faster, instead of 3-4 years. AND I think some of these products need to come out late spring or early summer (SSR, Solstice).

 

I didn't bother clicking the link to continue reading, after I saw him blowing smoke up our asses by listing all of GM's current RWD efforts. A bunch of niche, luxury, and expensive vehicles just don't cut it.

While I certainly don't justify GM's lack of affordable RWD vehicles, there's still logical reasoning as to why the suits are hesitant to bank on anything but FWD. The vast majority of best-selling cars in the U.S. market are FWD. Camry, Accord, Corolla, Civic, Altima; most of those cars that we ourselves in these very forums have insisted that GM gun for are FWD. How many non-luxury RWD cars are even on the market today? Let's review: Mustang, Crown Vic, 300/Charger/Magnum, Miata, RX-7, S2000, 350Z. The closest thing to affordable, non-niche vehicles in that list are V6 Mustang, V6 300/Charger/Magnum, and the Crown Vic (which gets all it's sales from fleet). Even many luxury brands don't offer vehicles that are RWD only (Volvo, Acura, most of Audi). GM is not the only automaker that has banked on FWD, so we should understand that it hard to push for RWD when the market is snatching up FWD cars by the millions.