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Speculation has been mounting for some time now that Hyundai could spin off a luxury division, and those rumors have finally been confirmed. But while Toyota, Nissan and Honda initially targeted its luxury brands (Lexus, Infiniti and Acura, respectively) at the American market, emerging reports suggest that Hyundai's premium marque will make its debut in China.
Hyundai is currently the second most popular import in the rapidly-growing Chinese auto market, trailing only Toyota for sales in the country. With five different models, Hyundai sold 24,000 vehicles in China last year, and manufactures more in joint ventures locally. Eying the emerging luxury car market in China – Lexus sales increased 160 percent last year and was projected at 80% growth this year – Hyundai has confirmed it is preparing to launch its own premium brand there. However, while it would seem that the establishment of a luxury badge would allow the mainstream Hyundais to move downmarket, the Korean automaker is also attempting to take its standard models upmarket along with it. One of its most popular models in China, the Matrix minivan, is being withdrawn as Hyundai tries to increase its brand image as a premium automaker. In its place, Hyundai is bringing in the new Santa Fe, Azera, a larger, more expensive Coupe and a new premium crossover.
The luxury division – complete with its own name and badge – is expected to be officially launched in 2010. Whether the new brand will make the trip around the world and land on American shores remains to be seen, but we certainly wouldn't discount the possibility.
[Source: Gasgoo via Motive]

Hmmm, maybe a good marketing, move, test the brand on China because Americans are very picky these days on new cars
 

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This is it.
The one barrier that stood between Hyundai and the luxury market -- a luxury brand name.

Now let's see how Buick and Cadillac weather the storm in China.
it's only a matter of time before Hyundai enters the US market with the new luxury brand. Best Cadillac be prepared.
 

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and no sigma product, half-baked attempts with nice badge engineering and dated dealerships is NOT the way to do it! Nor is not being able to sell a car well north of 50k without a boatload of incentives!

CobaltSS

PS: I thought Hyundai was trying to become the luxury flagship themself and have kia take their current place in america?
 

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and no sigma product, half-baked attempts with nice badge engineering and dated dealerships is NOT the way to do it! Nor is not being able to sell a car well north of 50k without a boatload of incentives!
Well, at least in China, Cadillac has done a commendable job in selling its "american-ness" and have high class dealerships.
Cadillac has a fighting chance in China.

It will be far tougher in America... ironically enough.

PS: I thought Hyundai was trying to become the luxury flagship themself and have kia take their current place in america?
I dunno. I don't follow Hyundai.
 

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isn't that sad that in the USA buick/cadillac have MUCH tougher time selling their new vehicles than in China. I understand why, but isn't it saddening to you? It is to me.

Thats what I heard about Hyundai, remember reading about it.

Maybe since Cadillac/Buick aren't polluted or 'damaged' brands outside of NA they will have a better showing? I know they don't sell well in Europe but thats what rebadges and cars not tailored to market tastes and lack of a credible dealership network and limited if any advertising does to you. Plus, a culture that is pro-patriotism unlike most of USA...

CobaltSS
 

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This is it.
The one barrier that stood between Hyundai and the luxury market -- a luxury brand name.

Now let's see how Buick and Cadillac weather the storm in China.
it's only a matter of time before Hyundai enters the US market with the new luxury brand. Best Cadillac be prepared.
I agree, but I think that asian luxury brands, especially Acura, will have just as much to fear from the Korean foray into the luxury market.

Since GM let Buick and Cadillac fall into disrepair for so long they may have a slightly harder time winning over new customers as opposed to a flashy new luxury brand offering style and value without the baggage of negative brand equity.

This will be interesting.
 

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I don't know about China, maybe Hyundai will hit it big in China, but as for US, a new luxury brand of Hyundai may not succeed. At least on its first year. GM and Japanese luxury brands need not worry, for they have huge fan-base already, of loyal customers, and I doubt anyone will spend as much money and buy the new, un-heard of new brand, especially made by the company formerly known as synomous as, highly breakable, pain in the ***, cheap appliance car maker. I don't think so.
 

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Plus, a culture that is pro-patriotism unlike most of USA...
I'm all for patriotism, but I'm also all for spending money on a car that works and is reliable. And let's be honest, over the past 50 years Japanese makes have proven to be far superior to Detroit in both those areas. Maybe you have enough money to just buy **** because it's American made, but I work hard for my money, so best believe I plan on getting the most bang for my buck.
 

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I'm all for patriotism, but I'm also all for spending money on a car that works and is reliable. And let's be honest, over the past 50 years Japanese makes have proven to be far superior to Detroit in both those areas. Maybe you have enough money to just buy **** because it's American made, but I work hard for my money, so best believe I plan on getting the most bang for my buck.
You have not looked at american cars lately? They are much better than before. Many equal or surpass the Japanese in quality. I'm not saying to not buy Nissans, but I am saying you should keep your mind open and drive a few GM offerings.

Drive an Astra, CTS, Malibu, Enclave, G8, Vue or Corvette (to name a few) and see how far GM has come in just a few short years.

BTW, I've owned two Nissans and three Hondas. My Nissans were great but one of my Hondas (2000 Accord coupe) was a lemon. Like American cars, Japanese cars are not always perfect.
 

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isn't that sad that in the USA buick/cadillac have MUCH tougher time selling their new vehicles than in China. I understand why, but isn't it saddening to you? It is to me.

May be the Chinese people should become patriots (just like you want American to be) and ditch everything American and buy only Chinese. Uhh, that hurts your feeling, right? See, patriotism doesn't mean you have to buy your own crap.
 

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You have not looked at american cars lately? They are much better than before. Many equal or surpass the Japanese in quality. I'm not saying to not buy Nissans, but I am saying you should keep your mind open and drive a few GM offerings.

Drive an Astra, CTS, Malibu, Enclave, G8, Vue or Corvette (to name a few) and see how far GM has come in just a few short years.

BTW, I've owned two Nissans and three Hondas. My Nissans were great but one of my Hondas (2000 Accord coupe) was a lemon. Like American cars, Japanese cars are not always perfect.
I can appreciate that. And in one of my earlier posts (I forget which thread) I actually commended GM by saying the current-gen Silverado is possibly the best half-ton ever, and the Malibu would be the best mid-size sedan were it not for the perfection that is the new Accord. I love the CTS, and I actually came close to pulling the trigger on one before deciding on my G35. But my comment was more about how historically the Japanese make superior cars to Detroit, which I don't really think can be disputed. And I know this thread is about Hyundai, but I took the post by CobaltSS as a shot at Americans for not buying American (and since most cars on the road are Japanese, I just inferred that's what he meant).
 

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I can appreciate that. And in one of my earlier posts (I forget which thread) I actually commended GM by saying the current-gen Silverado is possibly the best half-ton ever, and the Malibu would be the best mid-size sedan were it not for the perfection that is the new Accord. I love the CTS, and I actually came close to pulling the trigger on one before deciding on my G35. But my comment was more about how historically the Japanese make superior cars to Detroit, which I don't really think can be disputed. And I know this thread is about Hyundai, but I took the post by CobaltSS as a shot at Americans for not buying American (and since most cars on the road are Japanese, I just inferred that's what he meant).
Well, for the record, yet again. :rolleyes: UNLESS YOU ARE PURCHASING A beetle/prius/niche product that offers no domestic product THERE IS NO REASON TO PURCHASE A FOREIGN NON-DOMESTIC VEHICLE. PERIOD. AT ALL.:yup: if you like the styling / design of a japanese product fine go buy it.

BUT to DISMISS domestics b/c of bull s*** quality/reliability/gas mileage (outside of hybrids) is just hogwash rationalization that reeks of the 'want something for nothing don't care about your neighbor its my money i'm shopping at walmart for lowest possible price even if long term it hurts us-economy b/c of my myopic thinking' type-person.

I can't stand that.

You are damn right I'm EMBARRASSED and think its PATHETIC that American's become import intending sheep that are bankrupting the former backbone of this economy for decades, the Big Three. If people crosshop ALL domestic/japan vehicles and objectively come to the conclusion that the japan product indeed DOES fit their needs (and not their rationalization keep up with jone's in LA type-folk) then I'm ALL for it. But to blindly buy Camry/Corolla/Accord/Civic/(insert model here) from Japan 'just because Fred and Mary down the street got one and laud it at every PTO mtg for the kids and at the soccer games while in their Sienna' is just wrong. Its WRONG. It SHOULD NOT HAPPEN.

I'm all for this country, I was born work and live here and purchase products from here (to the greatest extent possible).

Take notice of history that EVERY country/entity that has outsourced its manufacturing (majority) wise has fallen, be it Rome or the UK etc.

Most cars on the road are not Japanese. The past 50 years have NOT been owned by Japan. 1900-1976 was all US Big Three. They "pwned" if you know what that means. 1977-1999 is when Japan was superior. I've contended for years the year 2000 was the 'mark' of splitting hairs between quality and reliability. Its like if you earn a 97% or a 99% on an exam, they both in A to A+ range, its splitting hairs and for most purpose's its neglible. That gap has just kept closing 2000-2007 and style/design/mpg/quality/reliability gap is not there, not beyond splitting hairs. Furthermore in some instances it is closed and arguably not there CTS/Malibu in certain product lines.

American's and Canadians all over North America need to get off their haughty over-weight arses and collectively realize just how good Big Three, particularly GM products are. Cross-shop, investigate, compare and make an informed choice. As you point out me taking a 'shot' at American's I'm just pointing out the fact that Import INTENDERS just disgust me and they are destroying this country's famed and historical auto industry one car payment at a time.

Competition is good for everyone, but just like anything, too much of a good thing becomes a bad thing very quickly. Be it politics, religion, economy, auto's, electronics, people in your life, sports, etc.

CobaltSS

PS: I work damn hard for my money too, I'd just rather send it to someone who works and lives here that produces arguably the best product and not some non-US corp/culture/person. Thats why I don't shop at Wal-mart, do buy Kodak/Dell/Apple/Chevy/Hon/etc. and its sad when people forget the core value of patriotism in their life.
 

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I'm not going to quote your whole piece, CobaltSS. But let me summarize it by saying "blah blah blah I'm a redneck blah blah..."
I never said ANYTHING about buying Japanese to keep up with the "Joneses." I said I buy Japanese because in my opinion (and until very recently the opinions of Consumer Reports, Edmunds.com, Motor Tred, et al) Japanese cars ARE superior. Point blank. I didn't say domestics were junk (although we can leave Dodge-Chrysler out of this LOL), however, as a country of origin Japan makes superior cars. In the 2008 Consumer Reports auto guide, their 10 Best consists of: 7 Japanese cars, 2 Korean cars, and 1 domestic (their first domestic pick in three years - the Silverado). They score every model, and of their five highest scores, four were Japanese (the fifth was a Porsche). All five of their lowest scores were domestic. Of their 10 best used car values, all were Japanese. Worst: 8 were domestic. Best fuel economy (small car): 6 of 6 were Japanese; worst: 3 of 5 were domestic. Midsize best: 5 of 7 were Japanese, worst: 5 of 7 were domestic. SUVs best: 8 of 9 were Japanese, worst: 5 of 7 were domestic. Best vehicles under $25k (varying segments): 18 of 27 were Japanese (two were domestic - the Fusion and the Milan). Most reliable model: Toyota Yaris. Least reliable: Pontiac Solstice. Most reliable brand: Honda. Finally, the overall automaker standings: 1. Honda, 2. Toyota, 3. Subaru, 5. Nissan,...12. Ford, 13. GM, 15. Chrysler.

Anything else Cobalt?
 

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PS: I work damn hard for my money too, I'd just rather send it to someone who works and lives here that produces arguably the best product and not some non-US corp/culture/person. Thats why I don't shop at Wal-mart, do buy Kodak/Dell/Apple/Chevy/Hon/etc. and its sad when people forget the core value of patriotism in their life.
Now state one reason WHY anyone would ever buy anything American made anywhere in the world but America? Or do you want everyone else to ditch their patriotism for American products?
 

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I'm not going to quote your whole piece, CobaltSS. But let me summarize it by saying "blah blah blah I'm a redneck blah blah..."
I never said ANYTHING about buying Japanese to keep up with the "Joneses." I said I buy Japanese because in my opinion (and until very recently the opinions of Consumer Reports, Edmunds.com, Motor Tred, et al) Japanese cars ARE superior. Point blank. I didn't say domestics were junk (although we can leave Dodge-Chrysler out of this LOL), however, as a country of origin Japan makes superior cars. In the 2008 Consumer Reports auto guide, their 10 Best consists of: 7 Japanese cars, 2 Korean cars, and 1 domestic (their first domestic pick in three years - the Silverado). They score every model, and of their five highest scores, four were Japanese (the fifth was a Porsche). All five of their lowest scores were domestic. Of their 10 best used car values, all were Japanese. Worst: 8 were domestic. Best fuel economy (small car): 6 of 6 were Japanese; worst: 3 of 5 were domestic. Midsize best: 5 of 7 were Japanese, worst: 5 of 7 were domestic. SUVs best: 8 of 9 were Japanese, worst: 5 of 7 were domestic. Best vehicles under $25k (varying segments): 18 of 27 were Japanese (two were domestic - the Fusion and the Milan). Most reliable model: Toyota Yaris. Least reliable: Pontiac Solstice. Most reliable brand: Honda. Finally, the overall automaker standings: 1. Honda, 2. Toyota, 3. Subaru, 5. Nissan,...12. Ford, 13. GM, 15. Chrysler.

Anything else Cobalt?
Core9797, I think you're wasting your time here. There is a cult that lives in this corner of the forum. No amount of logic or fact is ever enough for them to realize the truth. Surprisingly, for them, what makes a domestic superior can be the exact reason why an import is garbage (Malibu is the best since it's COTY but Camry is garbage because Toyota paid MT to make it the COTY!!).

I wouldn't worry about these guys too much. I mean, think about this: even the KKK guys think their cause/purpose is noble, and there isn't enough intelligence in them to realize that it's not. They are BLIND. So are these guys.
 

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I'm not going to quote your whole piece, CobaltSS. But let me summarize it by saying "blah blah blah I'm a redneck blah blah..."
I never said ANYTHING about buying Japanese to keep up with the "Joneses." I said I buy Japanese because in my opinion (and until very recently the opinions of Consumer Reports, Edmunds.com, Motor Tred, et al) Japanese cars ARE superior. Point blank. I didn't say domestics were junk (although we can leave Dodge-Chrysler out of this LOL), however, as a country of origin Japan makes superior cars. In the 2008 Consumer Reports auto guide, their 10 Best consists of: 7 Japanese cars, 2 Korean cars, and 1 domestic (their first domestic pick in three years - the Silverado). They score every model, and of their five highest scores, four were Japanese (the fifth was a Porsche). All five of their lowest scores were domestic. Of their 10 best used car values, all were Japanese. Worst: 8 were domestic. Best fuel economy (small car): 6 of 6 were Japanese; worst: 3 of 5 were domestic. Midsize best: 5 of 7 were Japanese, worst: 5 of 7 were domestic. SUVs best: 8 of 9 were Japanese, worst: 5 of 7 were domestic. Best vehicles under $25k (varying segments): 18 of 27 were Japanese (two were domestic - the Fusion and the Milan). Most reliable model: Toyota Yaris. Least reliable: Pontiac Solstice. Most reliable brand: Honda. Finally, the overall automaker standings: 1. Honda, 2. Toyota, 3. Subaru, 5. Nissan,...12. Ford, 13. GM, 15. Chrysler.

Anything else Cobalt?
Core9797,
I agree with you in general. However, Consumer Reports is a poor example because they use some biased methods for their calculation. Edmunds, Road and Track, Car and Driver, and a large number of other automotive magazines and journalists tore almost every domestic vehicle they reviewed to pieces five years ago, but basically every one except Consumer Reports has found some newer products to praise from Ford and GM. Dan Neil in the LA Times positively shredded the Pontiac G6 but was very positive for the Saturn Aura and new Malibu.

For a smaller statistical base but better sampling method, I think truedelta.com is a fantastic spot for vehicle reliability information. The owner there also does car reviews at epinions.com, and I think his reviews are pretty good.

I think CobaltSSCrazy is just furious because American domestic manufacturing on the whole has been ruthlessly crushed over the past decade and a half, and this is his way of expressing it. I disagree with his main point - buying domestic products when they are not competitive is clearly not going to help anything in the long term. But I share his frustration at the erosion of our manufacturing base and the decent jobs that disappeared with it.
 

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Now state one reason WHY anyone would ever buy anything American made anywhere in the world but America? Or do you want everyone else to ditch their patriotism for American products?
Well... What American products sell well outside of America?
Computers... Shoes... Planes... solid state devices... jeans... rice... and a few other things.

Welcome to a free market.
The consumer is free to choose whatever product they feel is the best... or what is best for them.

People aren't gonna go out and buy an inferior product -- or something that is perceived as inferior.
 

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As I have been saying, be prepared.
 
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