[killerrd2]

Hybrids are no longer a niche market, according to studies by ABI Research, a New York-based research firm.

In a news release, ABI said that by 2006, Toyota and Honda hybrid models alone could account for 10% of the over two million mid-sized passenger vehicle sales in the U.S. This conclusion was based on reports that Toyota will introduce a hybrid version of its Camry model to the U.S. in 2006, with a sales target of 100,000 vehicles, and Honda, which announced that a hybrid version of its Accord model will go on sale in the U.S. for 2005.

"This changes the game," says Dan Benjamin, an ABI Analyst, in a statement. "Honda and Toyota are the market leaders, as the Accord and the Camry are the dominant vehicles in the mid-sized segment. Other automakers will try to keep pace with their own hybrids, but those without proper development will either be forced to license hybrid technology or try and market diesels as a competing technology."

Diesels will be used by manufacturers such as DaimlerChrysler and Volkswagen in lieu of hybrids, ABI says. However, existing diesel offerings in the U.S. market cannot match current hybrids in terms of performance, economy, or cleanliness, and will have to be improved upon to remain competitive. Diesels must also be equipped with expensive exhaust treatment systems to comply with upcoming U.S. Tier 2 emissions standards.

Ford and Nissan will license hybrid technology from Toyota, while GM will use its own. The act of licensing technology can have its limitations, as the licensee may only have access to earlier versions of the technology, the research firm continued.

From Car and Driver. Link:
http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?se...article_id=7928

 

[JeffS]

Hmm, I have a 2004 Jetta TDI 5M, it is no slug. Tthe economy is 46 MPG city/highway average and I can haul four passengers and luggage comfortably. If I did all highway the mileage would be even better. I have read the gasoline/electrics have great mileage on paper but in the real world they cannot even come close to those figures. Maybe these rags should have a face off between the two technologies and see which one really is really liveable.

The only gottcha with the diesel is the emissions. The only smell I can detect is when it is first started. Other than that you would not be able to tell it was a diesel.

In the future there will be low-sulfur and bio-diesel which will make this a mute point. The battery life in the hybred is 100k miles, or what they are warranted for. But will happen when they do get replaced or tossed out. Will themselves become the polluters?

 

[bakerna]

diesels are the way to go...the only problem is particulate emissions....hybrids are a waste of time and money, batteries need replacing...and I dont care how high quality the electronics are they will burn out....anyway...diesels rock, hybrids suck....in general...thank you for your time..

 

[Ming]

Problem is, California, New York, and now Canada(?) are constantly pushing for ever stricter emissions standards, and these markets can't be ignored.

California seems determined to stick with the SULEV Gasoline-electric hybrid type design, and knowing the number of Japanese import fans there, I'm sure they are happy that Toyota and Honda are the only ones offering this type of car.

Besides, I've heard no info on GM offering diesels in small cars recently.

I'd say this is a lose-lose situation for GM. And hydrogen dreams aren't going to make it all better, nor are a few mild hybrid fleet sales pickups.

 

[NewMexico_Sunset_On_RT66_Yep]

hmm, first we had 'politically correct speech', now we have the 'politically correct automobile'.

hmmm.......yea, sadly, hmm........

the environmental movement is just a modern, 'nice', form of collectivism. F.A. Hayek speaks about it in his book 'The Road to Serfdom'. It's just another attack on individualism.

Our Liberty diminishes, not all at once, but slowly.

<_< <_< :angry: <_< <_<

 

[NewMexico_Sunset_On_RT66_Yep]

The Soviet Union cracked down on its people with the iron fist. Here in Amercai it is happening with regulations, and putting a nice smiley, nice touchy-feely face to it. But it is still the same thing.

<_< :angry: <_<

 

[usa1]

I'm no fan of regulations, but you guys make it sound like there is no upside to having cars with ever improving emissions.

Mark

 

[BatBoy]

The real problem facing us with our vehicles isnt the emissions. americans as a whole obviously dont care about emissions considering we keep buying bigger more powerfil SUV's and such. the real issue is the fact that we are eventually going to be forced to move away from gasoline or greatly increase the efficiency of gasoline engines considering that, at our current rate of consumption, the world's known reserves of oil will be GONE in around 40 years. scary, considering that is well within my lifetime.

 

[bakerna]

I was just listening to the radio...Canadian government is getting rid of the "drive clean" program for smaller cars trucks and SUVs but it's maintaining the practice and increasing the strictness (is that a word?) of the regulations regarding diesels. How aggravating....ACK! :argue: :zippy:

 

[69nova]

Say what you will but the 2 most influencial organiztions are the government and the rental agencies. Nobody buys more cars than these 2 groups. And when Uncle Sam says that all the governmment vehicles can only put out so much pollution and the sales orders are in the millions-guess what? The mfrs will comply.

While on this thread, I was thinking about rental agencies. Also cab companies. The 2 businesses move people. And these 2 businesses must move people as economically as possible. This means that the auto that they purchase must deliver the lowest cost regarding price, fuel usage and maintenance (maintenance especially for cab companies which don't sell their vehicles). Bottomline of operating a vehicle in that year is of prime concern.
So, a mfr having its vehicles selected for these 2 companies is somewhat an honor rather than a stain.

 

[Ming]

Originally posted by bakerna@Mar 23 2004, 07:32 AM
I was just listening to the radio...Canadian government is getting rid of the "drive clean" program for smaller cars trucks and SUVs but it's maintaining the practice and increasing the strictness (is that a word?) of the regulations regarding diesels. How aggravating....ACK! :argue: :zippy:

This seems to confirm what I thought. Governments, Politicians as well as Hollywood types have decided that they like the Toyota Prius approach, and are going to do all that they can to push this kind of vehicle.

GM's Hydrogen Dreams had better be more than that, or they are going to be on the wrong side of history...again.