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http://www.cnbc.com/id/27098637/site/14081545?__source=yahoo|headline|quote|text|&par=yahoo

If you are GM CEO Rick Wagoner, what do you do? The man in the top job at the struggling automaker is pulling every move possible to keep his company from collapsing.

And by all accounts, he's done a hell of a job. Even his critics in the industry have told me Wagoner and his top lieutenants don't get enough credit for the job they're doing in Detroit.

Still, investors keep betting that GM[GM 6.91 --- UNCH (0) ] won't make it. Wednesday, they pushed the stock under $7 a share to lows last seen in 1953. Even more amazing is GM's dwindling market cap. It's $3.9 billion, which is less than GM's market cap back before the crash of 1929. Anyway you look at it, GM's edging closer to really scary territory.

In a practical sense, GM's lower stock has only a few implications. But the larger impact is on the morale of employees and dealers. It's hard to get people to believe in a company's future when investors don't.

Against this backdrop, Wagoner is taking his message of hope for GM to YouTube. In a no nonsense, straight forward clip posted by GM, Wagoner makes the case for GM. I'll admit that when I first called it up, I thought it was an unusual approach, but it's not a bad idea. GM's positives are being drowned out by the cascading effect of a weak auto market, a shrinking cash cushion, and investor skepticism.
 

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http://www.cnbc.com/id/27098637/site/14081545?__source=yahoo|headline|quote|text|&par=yahoo

If you are GM CEO Rick Wagoner, what do you do? The man in the top job at the struggling automaker is pulling every move possible to keep his company from collapsing.

And by all accounts, he's done a hell of a job. Even his critics in the industry have told me Wagoner and his top lieutenants don't get enough credit for the job they're doing in Detroit.

Still, investors keep betting that GM[GM 6.91 --- UNCH (0) ] won't make it. Wednesday, they pushed the stock under $7 a share to lows last seen in 1953. Even more amazing is GM's dwindling market cap. It's $3.9 billion, which is less than GM's market cap back before the crash of 1929. Anyway you look at it, GM's edging closer to really scary territory.

In a practical sense, GM's lower stock has only a few implications. But the larger impact is on the morale of employees and dealers. It's hard to get people to believe in a company's future when investors don't.

Against this backdrop, Wagoner is taking his message of hope for GM to YouTube. In a no nonsense, straight forward clip posted by GM, Wagoner makes the case for GM. I'll admit that when I first called it up, I thought it was an unusual approach, but it's not a bad idea. GM's positives are being drowned out by the cascading effect of a weak auto market, a shrinking cash cushion, and investor skepticism.

YouTube. The new television.
 

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This is just incredible.

GM stock is approaching $ 5.00 per share.

The market is betting GM is not going to make it.
 

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So what are the short term or long term consequenses of going bankrupt? We all fly with airlines that were previously bankrupt. It could certainly have an effect on consumer confidence but the company wouldn't just disappear would it? All of us probably own a small amount of stock, even if it is just in a mutual fund so we'd certainly lose out there. Would it give them additional leverage against the unions to cut costs?

It seems more and more likely they will go bankrupt so how does everyone think that will impact the company and workers (salaried and union). I still think they have a chance of surviving but it looks slimmer and slimmer. This huge economic mess we're in might just do them in.
 

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So what are the short term or long term consequenses of going bankrupt? We all fly with airlines that were previously bankrupt. It could certainly have an effect on consumer confidence but the company wouldn't just disappear would it? All of us probably own a small amount of stock, even if it is just in a mutual fund so we'd certainly lose out there. Would it give them additional leverage against the unions to cut costs?

It seems more and more likely they will go bankrupt so how does everyone think that will impact the company and workers (salaried and union). I still think they have a chance of surviving but it looks slimmer and slimmer. This huge economic mess we're in might just do them in.

are there any car companies in existence that have gone thru bankruptcy? i think most of the buying public would lose any and all confidence in them after that kind of thing.
 

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This is just incredible.

GM stock is approaching $ 5.00 per share.

The market is betting GM is not going to make it.

It's funny though. There are articles left and right about Apple being Wall Street's whipping boy.
Computer sales will be lower. No one will buy iPods. No one will buy iPhones. The CEO is dead. Whatever.

And the stock is beaten down for really no apparent reason.

Mac sales have remained steady. Foot traffic at Apple Stores are high. iPhones have most likely exceeded the 10M goal set a year ago.

There's a lot of market irrationality right now. And people are afraid.


However, when one looks at GM, while there is a lot of market irrationality, some of it has a basis in fact. Buying a computer is one think. Buy a car requires a greater amount of credit to be doled out. And that's just not happening. How many people put a car on their credit card?
Plus everyone knows the legacy financial burden GM bears. Apple? Zero debt and billions in cash.

GM needs to innovate out of this downturn. It will be extremely bad. And that's the only way to do it. So once the upturn begins, GM can hit the ground running.
 

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This maybe like when AK Steel fired their chief executive, Richard M. Wardrop Jr., and its president, John G. Hritz in September 2003. AK Steel's board said the company was sound but that it expected a better financial performance. The company appointed James L. Wainscott, senior vice president and chief financial officer, to serve as interim chief executive. Its stock tanked; it almost went to nothing, then within a couple of years it increased 20 times.
 

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A lot of the turmoil in the market is a result of a simple factor that, of course, still needs to be accounted for: fear. Even Dubya presented the $700 billion Corporate Welfare Bill that recently passed with the blessing of Democrats and Republicans-of course only after lots of pork was added for each side-in the context of fear: "If we don't rush to pass this bill we'll end up in another Great Depression! The economy will fall off a cliff" Kinda like going to the used car lot and believing the salesman: "You gotta buy this car now, now, NOW! Don't have it inspected. Don't read the fine print on the sales agreement. Just sign the contract now! If not, someone else's gonna get the deal of the century."

Funny, it never really turns out the way we're told, huh?
 

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For once GM may actually have the cars they need to make it through a tough period. They were planning to bring out their new cars in 2009 and 2010.

After years of bad planning, bad luck, and worse it seems something will finally go GM's way. At least, let's hope it goes their way...
 

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There's a lot of market irrationality right now. And people are afraid.
There is a lot of truth in that... I have a wack of cash, over 1/2 of my portfolio. EVERYONE will tell you that when the market is afraid, it is time to buy.

This time I'm not in any great hurry to pour some money into the market. This is worse then fear... This is PANIC... There is a difference. After 9/11 there was fear, and before the gulf war there was fear, after the dot.com crash there was fear, when we had out of control government spending and 15% interest in the early 80's there was fear... but in all of the above there was hope too.

Right now I don't see the hope.
When I see a glimmer of hope... I'll buy back in... In the mean time I'm going to sit on my cash.
 

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For once GM may actually have the cars they need to make it through a tough period.
GM may have the cars but they don't have the cash.
To ride out whats coming they need BOTH!
 

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http://www.cnbc.com/id/27098637/site/14081545?__source=yahoo|headline|quote|text|&par=yahoo

If you are GM CEO Rick Wagoner, what do you do? The man in the top job at the struggling automaker is pulling every move possible to keep his company from collapsing.

And by all accounts, he's done a hell of a job. Even his critics in the industry have told me Wagoner and his top lieutenants don't get enough credit for the job they're doing in Detroit.

Still, investors keep betting that GM[GM 6.91 --- UNCH (0) ] won't make it. Wednesday, they pushed the stock under $7 a share to lows last seen in 1953. Even more amazing is GM's dwindling market cap. It's $3.9 billion, which is less than GM's market cap back before the crash of 1929. Anyway you look at it, GM's edging closer to really scary territory.

In a practical sense, GM's lower stock has only a few implications. But the larger impact is on the morale of employees and dealers. It's hard to get people to believe in a company's future when investors don't.

Against this backdrop, Wagoner is taking his message of hope for GM to YouTube. In a no nonsense, straight forward clip posted by GM, Wagoner makes the case for GM. I'll admit that when I first called it up, I thought it was an unusual approach, but it's not a bad idea. GM's positives are being drowned out by the cascading effect of a weak auto market, a shrinking cash cushion, and investor skepticism.
BY ALL ACCOUNTS!!!! are you nuts?
 

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Dark Shadows
Jim Dollinger
Monday, December 12, 2005

WAKE UP

On a sweltering summer day, an old man went down into a cool cellar for some relief. The moment he entered, he was blinded by the darkness. Don't Worry, said another man in the cellar, it is natural that when you go from light to darkness, you're unable to see. But soon enough, your eyes will grow accustomed to it, and you will hardly notice that it is dark.

My dear friend, replied the old man, turning to leave, that is exactly what I am afraid of. Darkness is darkness, the danger is convincing your self that it is light.


As I said everyone should wake up as each day goes by Wagoner is piling dirt on the exit from the cellar. I.E. everyone is in they dark, they just think it's light.
 

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Dark Shadows
Jim Dollinger
Monday, December 12, 2005

WAKE UP

On a sweltering summer day, an old man went down into a cool cellar for some relief. The moment he entered, he was blinded by the darkness. Don't Worry, said another man in the cellar, it is natural that when you go from light to darkness, you're unable to see. But soon enough, your eyes will grow accustomed to it, and you will hardly notice that it is dark.

My dear friend, replied the old man, turning to leave, that is exactly what I am afraid of. Darkness is darkness, the danger is convincing your self that it is light.


As I said everyone should wake up as each day goes by Wagoner is piling dirt on the exit from the cellar. I.E. everyone is in they dark, they just think it's light.
I don't mind your GM-bashing posts so much. I don't like your attitude and the constant need to fill threads with your Anti-Wagoner rhetoric. Get off your single-sided, close-minded high horse and shed some positive light on the subject!
 

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I don't mind your GM-bashing posts so much. I don't like your attitude and the constant need to fill threads with your Anti-Wagoner rhetoric. Get off your single-sided, close-minded high horse and shed some positive light on the subject!
ok, I'm positive they're out of business by year end (and it's Wagoner's fault!)
 

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I've thought about what it usually takes for a CEO to get fired.

Usually it takes failed turnaround plans, bad bets, and a falling stock price.

Bob Nardelli, the new guy across town at Chrysler, got forced out from his CEO post at Home Depot for "growing criticism from shareholders for what some of them called a very "generous" compensation package relative to the stock's weak performance, slowing profits and a regulatory probe about its options practices.

But to his credit, Nardelli's tenure also coincided with one of the most profitable periods for the company." (quoted from CNNMoney.com)

Nardelli actually got Home Depot's operations humming and a mature business to post growth numbers again. But he still got forced out by the board when the stock didn't perform and criticisms grew about his inability to lead going forward. Take those failings and compare it to what Wagoner has done, and not done.

Rick rushed the GMT 900 program and bet that the SUVs would sell and bet that gas prices would remain stable. He bet wrong. When you bet wrong, you lose. Why hasn't Rick lost?

The stock price, even before this year's poor market conditions, was above $40. Is that good? Not considering GM's stock price in early 2000 was above $90.

I think Rick made the right move by bringing Bob Lutz in. I think some of the cars and trucks GM has made in the last 5 years have been some of the best the company has ever produced. I think going forward, we have some great stuff coming, like the Volt and the Cruze (and the Camaro!)

But I can't get over the board's resistance in getting rid of Wagoner. Yeah, the whole auto market is in the dumper right now and a lot of that is beyond GM's control, but how many things can go wrong at a company before its enough is enough? Rick has not performed to the necessary expectations.

Want to reassure investors? Generate some confidence in the market? Save GM? Time for a management shake-up.

Will the board do it? I doubt it.

I honestly don't know how GM is going to make it to 2010 and beyond with the way the new car market is seizing up and the still-not-right condition GM's overall financial and cost structure is in.

This feels like the perfect storm to send this ship into bankruptcy. Will that finally take care of those lingering issues GM has been facing for years? Forget being too big to fail, is it too big to survive?
 

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I've thought about what it usually takes for a CEO to get fired.

Usually it takes failed turnaround plans, bad bets, and a falling stock price.

Bob Nardelli, the new guy across town at Chrysler, got forced out from his CEO post at Home Depot for "growing criticism from shareholders for what some of them called a very "generous" compensation package relative to the stock's weak performance, slowing profits and a regulatory probe about its options practices.

But to his credit, Nardelli's tenure also coincided with one of the most profitable periods for the company." (quoted from CNNMoney.com)

Nardelli actually got Home Depot's operations humming and a mature business to post growth numbers again. But he still got forced out by the board when the stock didn't perform and criticisms grew about his inability to lead going forward. Take those failings and compare it to what Wagoner has done, and not done.

Rick rushed the GMT 900 program and bet that the SUVs would sell and bet that gas prices would remain stable. He bet wrong. When you bet wrong, you lose. Why hasn't Rick lost?

The stock price, even before this year's poor market conditions, was above $40. Is that good? Not considering GM's stock price in early 2000 was above $90.

I think Rick made the right move by bringing Bob Lutz in. I think some of the cars and trucks GM has made in the last 5 years have been some of the best the company has ever produced. I think going forward, we have some great stuff coming, like the Volt and the Cruze (and the Camaro!)

But I can't get over the board's resistance in getting rid of Wagoner. Yeah, the whole auto market is in the dumper right now and a lot of that is beyond GM's control, but how many things can go wrong at a company before its enough is enough? Rick has not performed to the necessary expectations.

Want to reassure investors? Generate some confidence in the market? Save GM? Time for a management shake-up.

Will the board do it? I doubt it.

I honestly don't know how GM is going to make it to 2010 and beyond with the way the new car market is seizing up and the still-not-right condition GM's overall financial and cost structure is in.

This feels like the perfect storm to send this ship into bankruptcy. Will that finally take care of those lingering issues GM has been facing for years? Forget being too big to fail, is it too big to survive?
I think what you (and people like buickman) do is falsely link GM financial health to Rick Wagoner. While he is responsible for making GM into a profitable company and thus far has been unsuccesful, you really need to look at the actual reasons for this. What decisions has he made that have led to GM going downhill? You think redesigning the GMT-900 and releasing it a bit early hurt GM? I guess the Toyota CEO is even stupider since the Tundra came out even later.

What this author states is true, most people can see how good of job GM management has done despite their being no financial growth per se. Wagoner didn't create or even worsen one of GM's greatest liabilities and that is the perception that their vehicles suck. If anything, new GM vehicles prove just the opposite. Wagoner has cut back a lot of debt, which is another huge hurdle GM needed fixed and more importantly he got considerable Union concessions. All of these things put GM in a much stronger position overall but people still don't trust GM vehicles. Until he or someone can convince people that GM makes reliable cars and trucks, they will continue to lose money. I don't care who the CEO is, this is a monumental task.

Mullaly is considered to be a good CEO yet Ford still suffers just as GM does. You guys need to realize things aren't as black and white as you think.
 

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I think what you (and people like buickman) do is falsely link GM financial health to Rick Wagoner. While he is responsible for making GM into a profitable company and thus far has been unsuccesful, you really need to look at the actual reasons for this. What decisions has he made that have led to GM going downhill? You think redesigning the GMT-900 and releasing it a bit early hurt GM? I guess the Toyota CEO is even stupider since the Tundra came out even later.

What this author states is true, most people can see how good of job GM management has done despite their being no financial growth per se. Wagoner didn't create or even worsen one of GM's greatest liabilities and that is the perception that their vehicles suck. If anything, new GM vehicles prove just the opposite. Wagoner has cut back a lot of debt, which is another huge hurdle GM needed fixed and more importantly he got considerable Union concessions. All of these things put GM in a much stronger position overall but people still don't trust GM vehicles. Until he or someone can convince people that GM makes reliable cars and trucks, they will continue to lose money. I don't care who the CEO is, this is a monumental task.

Mullaly is considered to be a good CEO yet Ford still suffers just as GM does. You guys need to realize things aren't as black and white as you think.
Wagoner has cut debt? what planet are you from?

and he's lost 94% of the company's value since taking over. where else but GM could such a terrible performance be tolerated?
 
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