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Discussion Starter · #1 ·

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I have no idea what the opening post meant.

But since you brought up the idea of fantasy lineups, I will make this comment on them - I'm sick of them. I'm sick of how GM is the only car company that needs its fans to come up with car ideas for them, while all other car companies already have perfect lineups that nobody complains about and hence, needs no fantasy lineups.
 

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I have no idea what the opening post meant.

But since you brought up the idea of fantasy lineups, I will make this comment on them - I'm sick of them. I'm sick of how GM is the only car company that needs its fans to come up with car ideas for them, while all other car companies already have perfect lineups that nobody complains about and hence, needs no fantasy lineups.
I imagine that every company has fans that want changes made. The most obvious is Ford: everyone (inaccurately) seems to be insisting that the answer to Ford's problems is to sell their European and/or Australian lineup in the States.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I have no idea what the opening post meant.

But since you brought up the idea of fantasy lineups, I will make this comment on them - I'm sick of them. I'm sick of how GM is the only car company that needs its fans to come up with car ideas for them, while all other car companies already have perfect lineups that nobody complains about and hence, needs no fantasy lineups.
If you guys actually followed my simple direction (read the last two words in this thread under the link...), you would have had a clue.
Clueless.
Anyway. I agree with your post. I don't understand the reason behind all these 'fantasy lineup' threads. GM already has the best lineup in the industry. That is, of course, you people want to axe the following cars:
  • Corvette Z06
  • Enclave/Outlook/Acadia
  • Malibu
  • Tahoe Hybrid
  • Cobalt/SS
  • CTS
  • Lucerne/V8
  • Escalade (s)
And want a list that looks more like this:
  • Corolla
  • Camry
  • 4-Runner
  • Fit
  • Pilot
  • IS 350
  • ES 330
  • RL
  • TL
It's this:






Or this:




 

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It seems to me that you've taken liking GM to a whole new level...
GM is NOT perfect. A lot of cars in its lineup don't deserve the GM Mark of Excellence by the door. Cars like the Pontiac G5 and Chevy Aveo. Every company, and I mean EVERY company has room for improvement. We here on GMi see that and understand it. From what I've seen, GM fans are more willing to criticize GM than toyota fans or honda fans are willing to criticize their companies. I find it interesting to see what people want to see come out of GM. Remember, if you don't listen to the buyers, you'll never sell anything.
 

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If you guys actually followed my simple direction (read the last two words in this thread under the link...), you would have had a clue.
Clueless.
Dude, the words "Last one"...............yeah, very clear and concise! :rolleyes: If you said "check out the last one", then provided the link....I would have gotten it. Putting the link, then saying "last one" might make perfect sense in your brain. :yup:

I thought it meant "last one".......as in no more crazy ass threads started by you. Honestly. :cool:
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
It seems to me that you've taken liking GM to a whole new level...
GM is NOT perfect. A lot of cars in its lineup don't deserve the GM Mark of Excellence by the door. Cars like the Pontiac G5 and Chevy Aveo. Every company, and I mean EVERY company has room for improvement. We here on GMi see that and understand it. From what I've seen, GM fans are more willing to criticize GM than toyota fans or honda fans are willing to criticize their companies. I find it interesting to see what people want to see come out of GM. Remember, if you don't listen to the buyers, you'll never sell anything.
I'm not really taking anything to a whole new level; I just don't understand any of this critisizm or rallying cries to change. I just can't figure out for the life of me why everyone wants their fantasy lineups, when the current lineups are already the best in the industry!
Shouldn't we instead be focusing on critisizing the competitors' lineups, in light of the fact that they're so comparably flawed? Shouldn't we be focusing on the undue attention they have been getting from the motoring press? Shouldn't we be focusing on elements that stand to damage GM's current lineup, such as those from Consumer Reports?
You people are like Roman warriors critisizing each others' armor and weapons as you march toward battle with Persia!
 

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I'm not really taking anything to a whole new level; I just don't understand any of this critisizm or rallying cries to change. I just can't figure out for the life of me why everyone wants their fantasy lineups, when the current lineups are already the best in the industry!
Shouldn't we instead be focusing on critisizing the competitors' lineups, in light of the fact that they're so comparably flawed? Shouldn't we be focusing on the undue attention they have been getting from the motoring press? Shouldn't we be focusing on elements that stand to damage GM's current lineup, such as those from Consumer Reports?
You people are like Roman warriors critisizing each others' armor and weapons as you march toward battle with Persia!
Well, the problem with that logic is that we already hate the competitor's lineups...therefore we already think (and know...:D) that they suck. We also already know that CR is a biased piece of crap.
However unfair automotive magazines and publications are to GM, GM's lineup is still not perfect. When we get rid of blatant rebadges like the Pontiac G5, when we finally get a subcompact that looks decent and gets better fuel economy than the car slated above it, then GM's lineup will be much better.
And if you think that the Aveo can be considered a part of the best lineup in the industry...well...:rolleyes:
Believe it or not, GM still has a long way to go. We're getting better, products like the Lambdas, Malibu, and CTS serve as evidence of that, but we're not quite there yet. I'm seeing more and more promising vehicles coming out of GM in the future.
By the way, what I meant by you taking liking GM to a whole new level is that you like them so much that you seem to believe that they're incapable of making any mistakes and that they're perfect in every way. That kind of thinking got GM in trouble in the first place. Every automaker gets arrogant once they reach the top, a simple look back at American automotive history reveals that, starting with Ford, to GM, and now to toyota. When the fans and buyers are able to offer constructive criticism and voice what they would like to see from GM in the future, they help GM by showing what they want and what GM needs to produce to create an even better lineup.
 

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^ Why have I never seen that commercial till now?? I have seen the part where the two Vette's cross in the air in the "Then and Now" one but I always thought that was it... I never knew there was more.
 

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As FenwickHockey65 was saying, PMC the 1st, it is as damaging to lose introspection as it is to ignore your customers. Evolution comes from exterior stimulus. Evolve or die.
Whilst Holdens lineup is very broad, it still isn't perfect. There is no 2 seater, no real trucks and no true 4x4 (as opposed to suvs) wagons. I can see the value in its breadth, but for it to remain as is, would be diabolically foolish.
 

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Come on, even cars that are best in class still have aspects that can be improved. When someone writes a dream lineup, they are just molding the cars to what they like. It does not have to be taken so seriously.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Come on, even cars that are best in class still have aspects that can be improved. When someone writes a dream lineup, they are just molding the cars to what they like. It does not have to be taken so seriously.
When we're discussing these fantasy lineups, were aren't expressing the addressing of cars that are slated to come out, we're actually expressing disappointment in the current lineup. And in GM's case, we are unjustified for doing that.
There's no sense in expressing the future lineup of GM, as the engineers are already way ahead of us in that regard. It's their job. That's what they're paid to do.
By suggesting in our fantasy lineups that the GM engineers change the Corvette's engine layout to a mid/rear engine configuration (a-la Lamborghini Gallardo), we are expressing our current irritation with the Corvette's mid/front engine configuration.
By suggesting Cadillac go with a AWD V8 roadster instead of the current RWD expresses dissatasfaction with the current XLR. It has nothing to do with forward-looking thinking, and I think this is why I don't like these ridiculous fantasy lineup threads.

I do, however, agree that the Aveo has to go bye-bye. I likewise believe Hummer should get retooled for some serious hybrid powertrains without marketing them as hybrids or likewise go bye-bye (Hummer, IMHO, should not be sold, because they look so rugged and military. They represent America better than any other vehicle, as far as I can tell). There has to be a lineup of Smart-for-Two-like vehicles in GM's current lineup.

Aside from that I can't really see anything wrong with GM's lineups.
GM's competitors are alot easier to critisize. For that reason, we should be focusing our efforts there rather than post suggestions for future GM cars. That's the Engineer's job.
 
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