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They're going to sell a ton to Chevy fans....and that's about it. I remember back when the first Raptor came out, my supervisor at the time traded in a BMW 535i for a Raptor. There isn't going to be much conquest w/ the ZR2...its a Chevy fan cash grab.

I'm not hating, I just want GM to swing for the fences...with something other than the Corvette, everything else just feels like a solid double or triple, or in the case of the ZR2...a base hit that puts a runner in scoring position....Where are the fender flares? Where's the LT4?
True. I wish that when it came to things like this (or whatever) or say a real TRX like product, that gm could be the first to put the thing out at steal everybody's thunder. Instead a lot of times they end up an also ran albeit with a decent enough product though.
 

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True. I wish that when it came to things like this (or whatever) or say a real TRX like product, that gm could be the first to put the thing out at steal everybody's thunder. Instead a lot of times they end up an also ran albeit with a decent enough product though.
You mean being foist in segments? No, sometimes its better to let someone else do it, then come and do it better.
 

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All that jelly and no toast! You patted yourself on the back and you still are not qualified to design cars.

And no some random person off the street is not doing a better job of automotive design then the people who do it for a living.

Just face it Dude! I am right and you are wrong! Ok Dude!
 

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All that jelly and no toast! You patted yourself on the back and you still are not qualified to design cars.

And no some random person off the street is not doing a better job of automotive design then the people who do it for a living.

Just face it Dude! I am right and you are wrong! Ok Dude!
Nobody here has ever claimed to be able to "design a car" and as I pointed out previously, the people at GM can't either, each engineer or design team work on different pieces.

Our position is that we see a design and note it is eff'd-up, and if anyone was paying attention before development got too far down the road it could have easily been fixed. The fact that GM themselves fix these designs after a few years, in the case of the Camaro, one year; validates this.

Sdotjeezy, brings up an excellent example, the Camaro was a train wreck, I recall seeing in photos, then in-person; WOW - It actually looked worse, how that was signed-off on is beyond baffling!


Point is...you don't have to be a designer with actual cars penned by you on the lot for sale to recognize that something is ****ed up with a design...because we're not actual designers does that mean that when we said the 19 Camaro was bad:
View attachment 64422

that it meant nothing? Because GM realized it and fixed it in less than a year
 

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Exactly. A supercharger can be an easy update if demand warrants.

These are poser trucks. It’s about image and anyone serious about using any of these trucks off-road are going to further modify them from factory. GM was wise to retain much better payload and towing instead of severely handicapping that aspect vs raptor/trx. A full size truck is already too wide for many trails…no sense in making it even wider so I applaud that decision. Approach/departure angles are great and will get better if someone wants to upgrade to 35’s or better.

ZR2 is a winner and retains much more “truck functionality“ as opposed to raptor/trx
Also having dual lockers will help pull it even when it comes to off road capability.
 
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Scottiee can make his case without being so negative. Its just not nice. I do not see why he is getting so unfriendly over the placement of a Chevrolet emblem.
Placement of the emblem is not the problem, it's when a person says I can design cars better then the real professionals.

You can say you don't like it, but saying you can do a better job is ridiculous.

This isn't about weather I like the design it's about weather some random person could design a car from scratch.

Fact is that you can't
 

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Placement of the emblem is not the problem, it's when a person says I can design cars better then the real professionals.

You can say you don't like it, but saying you can do a better job is ridiculous.

This isn't about weather I like the design it's about weather some random person could design a car from scratch.

Fact is that you can't
OMG. Your feeble brain obviously can’t understand simple sarcastic expressions. Nobody meant LITERALLY that they could design a better truck. It’s a figure of speech you freaking Mensa reject. Did you not have any friends in elementary school? Geesh .
 

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OMG. Your feeble brain obviously can’t understand simple sarcastic expressions. Nobody meant LITERALLY that they could design a better truck. It’s a figure of speech you freaking Mensa reject. Did you not have any friends in elementary school? Geesh .
No, this guy actually talked about making sketches on photo shop as if he could fix the problems the original designers made. It wasn't sarcasm at all.

It's like when I hear some random dude say, I can play QB better then (NFL QB) can he's terrible. Ahhhhhh no you can't, in fact none of us can. It's called the truth and sometimes it hurts.

I didn't have any friends that made wild claims I knew they couldn't back up. I made sure that I would call them out on it. If people didn't want to be my friend because I would call them out on their bull****. Then that's on them. Don't make claims you can't backup.
 

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How did the random real professionals get hired / come to do professional-caliber work?
These people have tough jobs and they don't get to do what ever they want. They have parameters that most of us will never see.

If a normal person tried they would fail. Then we would make fun of their designs.
 

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No, this guy actually talked about making sketches on photo shop as if he could fix the problems the original designers made. It wasn't sarcasm at all.

It's like when I hear some random dude say, I can play QB better then (NFL QB) can he's terrible. Ahhhhhh no you can't, in fact none of us can. It's called the truth and sometimes it hurts.

I didn't have any friends that made wild claims I knew they couldn't back up. I made sure that I would call them out on it. If people didn't want to be my friend because I would call them out on their bull****. Then that's on them. Don't make claims you can't backup.
Some people do have real photoshop talent and can "fix" designs the the car designers didn't do so well on. That same sort of thing happened and went all over when the 2016 Malibu hit the print and people got to see it jowls and all. I still feel that if they'd have cleaned up the outer edges of the lower facia where those marker lights were, it wouldn't have needed the whole new nose.
 

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These people have tough jobs and they don't get to do what ever they want. They have parameters that most of us will never see.

If a normal person tried they would fail. Then we would make fun of their designs.
How do you know the failed designs from the good ones? Were you there to see the choices they picked from? Are all GM designs perfect? Was the Aztec a great design that nobody here could beat? Are GM’s designers better or worse than Ferrari, Lamborghini, Rolls? And if they’re better, why are they still at GM instead of a better company or working for themselves. And how do you know a “normal” person couldn’t do better? The only thing GM’S designers have are probably a graphic design degree and a few years experience. That’s not something that a ”normal” person can’t get. Your tendency to put GM and EVERYTHING they do on a massive pedestal is pretty freaking hilarious. Most of us on this site like GM more than most, but you’re a freaking extreme fanboi. It’s ok to admit that GM ain’t perfect. You won’t burst into flames.
 

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Placement of the emblem is not the problem, it's when a person says I can design cars better then the real professionals.

You can say you don't like it, but saying you can do a better job is ridiculous.

This isn't about weather I like the design it's about weather some random person could design a car from scratch.

Fact is that you can't
Instead of repeating myself, I'll just quote myself.............

WHETHER you can comprehend what we are saying; I'm not sure, maybe ask for help?.......

Nobody here has ever claimed to be able to "design a car" and as I pointed out previously, the people at GM can't either, each engineer or design team work on different pieces.

Our position is that we see a design and note it is eff'd-up, and if anyone was paying attention before development got too far down the road it could have easily been fixed. The fact that GM themselves fix these designs after a few years, in the case of the Camaro, one year; validates this.

Sdotjeezy, brings up an excellent example, the Camaro was a train wreck, I recall seeing in photos, then in-person; WOW - It actually looked worse, how that was signed-off on is beyond baffling!
 

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How do you know the failed designs from the good ones? Were you there to see the choices they picked from? Are all GM designs perfect? Was the Aztec a great design that nobody here could beat? Are GM’s designers better or worse than Ferrari, Lamborghini, Rolls? And if they’re better, why are they still at GM instead of a better company or working for themselves. And how do you know a “normal” person couldn’t do better? The only thing GM’S designers have are probably a graphic design degree and a few years experience. That’s not something that a ”normal” person can’t get. Your tendency to put GM and EVERYTHING they do on a massive pedestal is pretty freaking hilarious. Most of us on this site like GM more than most, but you’re a freaking extreme fanboi. It’s ok to admit that GM ain’t perfect. You won’t burst into flames.
True. There are more than just designers out there doing autos. All kinds of products have design studios throwing things out to be used from furniture to clothing, to housing etc., etc. They all came from schools with degrees. And they all started somewhere just doing good sketches and being noticed then taken under some entities wings.
 

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How do you know the failed designs from the good ones? Were you there to see the choices they picked from? Are all GM designs perfect? Was the Aztec a great design that nobody here could beat? Are GM’s designers better or worse than Ferrari, Lamborghini, Rolls? And if they’re better, why are they still at GM instead of a better company or working for themselves. And how do you know a “normal” person couldn’t do better? The only thing GM’S designers have are probably a graphic design degree and a few years experience. That’s not something that a ”normal” person can’t get. Your tendency to put GM and EVERYTHING they do on a massive pedestal is pretty freaking hilarious. Most of us on this site like GM more than most, but you’re a freaking extreme fanboi. It’s ok to admit that GM ain’t perfect. You won’t burst into flames.

Aztek..................

 
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