GM Inside News Forum banner
21 - 40 of 85 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
329 Posts
View attachment 65182


Impressive results!

Just to get some general ideas, I took the base price of each model and multiplied it by the 2021 sales, so this represents more than $15B in sales. Just for kicks I wanted to see what their profits are if they average $5k per vehicle, $1.2B. I have no clue how much profit they make and certainly more on a fully equipped Escalade than a base Tahoe - just spit balling before anyone gets upset.
The estimated profit column appears to multiply base price by $5000. Should it be the units sold by $5000? Or am I looking at this wrong?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
19,658 Posts
The estimated profit column appears to multiply base price by $5000. Should it be the units sold by $5000? Or am I looking at this wrong?
Oh crap! Good catch! I forgot that I flipped around the columns after I input the equations.

Coincidentally, the hash total of the base price is 230,000, which is close to the 2021 sales volume of 279,000, so the total end result isn't far off, new est profit is $1.4B vs. my incorrect $1.2B. Not that it makes my mistake anything else but a mistake.

To repent for my sins, I spent time to go through each model to get their highest price. Note that I didn't check every little option, just the bigger ones, so I rounded up to account for the little things. Note that I made the assumption that certain packages, like Denali, is the costliest package - I didn't test out the AT package to see if somehow that could be optioned higher. Just all spitball/curiosity. Eye popping numbers!


Rectangle Font Material property Number Pattern
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,741 Posts
Excursion was good, just killed by outraged environmentalist groups…
The Extended Expedition is a lighter Excursion hiding in plain sight, I think it deserves its own name
I have heard a lot of environmentalist complaints about the Hummer and large American cars in general. I have not heard a single environmentalist complaint about the Excursion. The Excursion did not die at the hands of environmentalists. The Excursion died because it was a dumb idea produced by a company that did not understand the competition or why the competition was successful.

All that Ford saw was that the Suburban and Yukon XL were full-size pickup truck-based station wagons (now called SUVs). It thought that if GM could produce full-size truck-based SUVs, then Ford would produce a bigger truck-based SUV. So Ford based the Excursion on its HD pickup truck. The only thing that the Excursion had over the Suburban was size. It was larger. Being larger than the Suburban may have appealed to a certain demographic. In the absence of other compelling features, however, it was a turn-off to the demographic that made the Suburban a success for these many decades. The historic Suburban demographic is upscale--very upscale. Ford's Expedition and Lincoln Navigator had found great success with certain target audiences. There was no compelling reason for Ford to produce the Excursion. Having done so, it screwed-up massively.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
590 Posts
Absolutely no surprise here. My dealer has zero of the GMC/Chevy units and a waiting list.......Meanwhile over at the Jeep store they STILL have the first Cherokee L they got over 3 months ago.
I am familiar with the list. Still sitting at 1100 on my Yukon order since August/Septembe. Next allocation at the small GMC store for a Yukon is mine.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
590 Posts
Glad to see that T1XX continues GM's tradition as the "gold standard" in this segment, like you said RamJet502. :cool:

Note to GM executives: Please keep "zero, zero, zero" away from this success story as long as possible.
That will be critically important… Or you lose sales to folks like me. Hoping to have one more ICE V8 powered Yukon after I finally get my 2022.
 
  • Like
Reactions: gkr778

·
Registered
Joined
·
375 Posts
I remember Bill Maher doing a 5 minute rif on the Excursion calling it the Exxon Valdez.

I think Hummer and Excursion where done in by environmentalist pressure.

Ford could bring it back as a BEV or PHEV.

Range Rover is doing a '23 PHEV with 50 miles of real world electric range and doing a long wheel base version that is 207" long with a third row. Haven't confirmed they will do PHEV drivetrain with long wheel base though. Lincoln already does an Aviator with 21 miles of all electric range.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
329 Posts
I remember Bill Maher doing a 5 minute rif on the Excursion calling it the Exxon Valdez.

I think Hummer and Excursion where done in by environmentalist pressure.

Ford could bring it back as a BEV or PHEV.

Range Rover is doing a '23 PHEV with 50 miles of real world electric range and doing a long wheel base version that is 207" long with a third row. Haven't confirmed they will do PHEV drivetrain with long wheel base though. Lincoln already does an Aviator with 21 miles of all electric range.
Even wikipedia mentions it in their article on the Excursion:

The large size of the Excursion led to it being dubbed the Ford Valdez by The Sierra Club in 1999 (in reference to the Exxon Valdez supertanker).[12] In 2007, TIME Magazine selected it as one of the Fifty Worst Cars of All Time.[13]
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
239 Posts
He Probably seen a new shipment of the same kind of GCL...

Also Wagoneer's 7,892 units almost beat Escalads sales. whats interesting, STLA seperate's Wagoneer and G. Wagoneer sales so that number is combined.
What a shame, they "almost" beat Escalade. Should've been easy since GM/Caddy dealers lots are just overflowing with inventory, right?

And yeah, its the same GC-L my local dealership has had, not a new shipment. Maybe its that amazingly bland styling that helping this thing fly off the shelf?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
11,409 Posts
I have heard a lot of environmentalist complaints about the Hummer and large American cars in general. I have not heard a single environmentalist complaint about the Excursion. The Excursion did not die at the hands of environmentalists. The Excursion died because it was a dumb idea produced by a company that did not understand the competition or why the competition was successful.

All that Ford saw was that the Suburban and Yukon XL were full-size pickup truck-based station wagons (now called SUVs). It thought that if GM could produce full-size truck-based SUVs, then Ford would produce a bigger truck-based SUV. So Ford based the Excursion on its HD pickup truck. The only thing that the Excursion had over the Suburban was size. It was larger. Being larger than the Suburban may have appealed to a certain demographic. In the absence of other compelling features, however, it was a turn-off to the demographic that made the Suburban a success for these many decades. The historic Suburban demographic is upscale--very upscale. Ford's Expedition and Lincoln Navigator had found great success with certain target audiences. There was no compelling reason for Ford to produce the Excursion. Having done so, it screwed-up massively.
Environmentalists blast Ford's giant new SUV
February 28, 1999
Web posted at: 6:34 p.m. EST (2334 GMT)


Detroit (CNN) -- An environmental group is speaking out against Ford Motor Company's
plans to roll a gigantic sport utility vehicle off the assembly line this fall.
The 2000 Excursion will weigh in at 3.5 tons, 6 1/2 feet wide and nearly 19 feet long
-- almost 9 inches longer than its nearest rival, the Chevy Suburban.

The Sierra Club calls it "a garbage truck that dumps into the sky."

This will be the most polluting truck on the road and will set a new low for Detroit," said Dan Becker, director of the club's global warming program.
But Ford defended its new creation.
"It produces 43 percent less hydrocarbons than the government requires," said Ford spokesman J.C. Collins. "So we've taken a leadership position in creating a vehicle that not only fulfills a market need but is as environmentally friendly as we can make it given today's technology."

Dangerous size?

Ford is designing the Excursion's engines -- actually, those of all of its 1999 sport utility vehicles -- to meet California's low-emission standard for light trucks.
But, environmentalists point out, California's benchmarks address smog-producing emissions and not carbon dioxide. Excursion's poor fuel economy -- 11 to 12 miles per gallon with a V-10 engine, 15 to 18 mpg with a V-8 -- will make it one of the worst contributors to global warming.
"It will produce enormous amounts of pollution out of the tail pipe and will jeopardize the future of your children and hurt the health of our planet," said Becker.
Aside from pollution concerns, road watchers also fear the Excursion's sheer bulk will make it a menace to drivers of smaller vehicles.
But Ford said it has addressed those issues as well, with its innovative "blocker beam" designed to prevent smaller cars from slipping beneath the Excursion in case of collision.
"It's designed to be right on level with passenger car bumpers," said Paul Mayer.
Still, Excursion is a very big vehicle, and will be an imposing sight in a driver's rear view mirror when it hits the road October 1.
And by all accounts, drivers will be lining up to shell out $35,000 to $50,000 to take home one of the SUV behemoths.

End of the line for Ford's mammoth Excursion?
Ford Motor Co. will kill off the Ford Excursion, its largest sport utility vehicle and a lightning rod for criticism from environmental groups, next year, a source familiar with the plan said on Monday.

Dec. 14, 2004, 4:07 AM AEST / Source: Reuters
Ford Motor Co. will kill off the Ford Excursion, its largest sport utility vehicle and a lightning rod for criticism from environmental groups, next year, a source familiar with the plan said on Monday.
The mammoth vehicle will stop rolling off the assembly line in September, as Ford moves to free up production capacity for the refreshed Super Duty pickup truck, said the source, on condition of anonymity.

The Excursion and Ford Super Duty F-Series pickups are assembled at the automaker's Louisville, Kentucky, truck plant.
A Ford spokesman declined to comment on the product plan.
Ford sources had said in 2002 that the company would discontinue the 19-foot Excursion, but it wound up getting an extended lease on life.

The second-largest U.S. automaker is planning to fill the gap in its full-size product lineup with an extended version of its Expedition SUV, the source said.
U.S. sales of the Excursion, which was launched in 1999, are down 25 percent so far this year. The Sierra Club, which dubbed the Excursion the "Ford Valdez" after the infamous Alaskan oil spill, called it an environmental disaster because of its poor fuel economy rating.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
19,658 Posts
Regarding the Excursion. I remember reading something about Ford engineering an extra 1,000 lbs into one of their big trucks to get it into the next weight class to avoid more environmental rules. I'm pretty confident of my memory being right, but don't know what Ford vehicle or when - could have been the 1990's or 2000's. But, something like that is certain to raise the hackles of environmentalists and could very well have been the Excursion.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
35,334 Posts
This is the biggest difference between GM and Ford, where GM pressed harder building volume sales for full sized SUV built in a dedicated plant, Ford really only has Expedition and Navigator.

I think Ford missed their mark with the LWB versions of Expedition and Navigator, they should have made them heavy enough to be above CAFE and have 7.3 V8 or even the 6.7 Powerstroke
The truth is, GM owns the Truck and SUV space, even Ford doesn’t outsell GM trucks. They know the customer, they engineered the best vehicles in the segment.

Ford knows what they can sell. No need to flood the market with stuff they need to pile incentives on to move.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,741 Posts
Environmentalists blast Ford's giant new SUV
February 28, 1999
Web posted at: 6:34 p.m. EST (2334 GMT)


Detroit (CNN) -- An environmental group is speaking out against Ford Motor Company's
plans to roll a gigantic sport utility vehicle off the assembly line this fall.
The 2000 Excursion will weigh in at 3.5 tons, 6 1/2 feet wide and nearly 19 feet long
-- almost 9 inches longer than its nearest rival, the Chevy Suburban.

The Sierra Club calls it "a garbage truck that dumps into the sky."

This will be the most polluting truck on the road and will set a new low for Detroit," said Dan Becker, director of the club's global warming program.
But Ford defended its new creation.
"It produces 43 percent less hydrocarbons than the government requires," said Ford spokesman J.C. Collins. "So we've taken a leadership position in creating a vehicle that not only fulfills a market need but is as environmentally friendly as we can make it given today's technology."

Dangerous size?

Ford is designing the Excursion's engines -- actually, those of all of its 1999 sport utility vehicles -- to meet California's low-emission standard for light trucks.
But, environmentalists point out, California's benchmarks address smog-producing emissions and not carbon dioxide. Excursion's poor fuel economy -- 11 to 12 miles per gallon with a V-10 engine, 15 to 18 mpg with a V-8 -- will make it one of the worst contributors to global warming.
"It will produce enormous amounts of pollution out of the tail pipe and will jeopardize the future of your children and hurt the health of our planet," said Becker.
Aside from pollution concerns, road watchers also fear the Excursion's sheer bulk will make it a menace to drivers of smaller vehicles.
But Ford said it has addressed those issues as well, with its innovative "blocker beam" designed to prevent smaller cars from slipping beneath the Excursion in case of collision.
"It's designed to be right on level with passenger car bumpers," said Paul Mayer.
Still, Excursion is a very big vehicle, and will be an imposing sight in a driver's rear view mirror when it hits the road October 1.
And by all accounts, drivers will be lining up to shell out $35,000 to $50,000 to take home one of the SUV behemoths.

End of the line for Ford's mammoth Excursion?
Ford Motor Co. will kill off the Ford Excursion, its largest sport utility vehicle and a lightning rod for criticism from environmental groups, next year, a source familiar with the plan said on Monday.

Dec. 14, 2004, 4:07 AM AEST / Source: Reuters
Ford Motor Co. will kill off the Ford Excursion, its largest sport utility vehicle and a lightning rod for criticism from environmental groups, next year, a source familiar with the plan said on Monday.
The mammoth vehicle will stop rolling off the assembly line in September, as Ford moves to free up production capacity for the refreshed Super Duty pickup truck, said the source, on condition of anonymity.

The Excursion and Ford Super Duty F-Series pickups are assembled at the automaker's Louisville, Kentucky, truck plant.
A Ford spokesman declined to comment on the product plan.
Ford sources had said in 2002 that the company would discontinue the 19-foot Excursion, but it wound up getting an extended lease on life.

The second-largest U.S. automaker is planning to fill the gap in its full-size product lineup with an extended version of its Expedition SUV, the source said.
U.S. sales of the Excursion, which was launched in 1999, are down 25 percent so far this year. The Sierra Club, which dubbed the Excursion the "Ford Valdez" after the infamous Alaskan oil spill, called it an environmental disaster because of its poor fuel economy rating.
Certain people have a remarkable way of finding obscure references and blowing them up into something big. Ford stopped selling the Excursion in the US in 2005 after just six years on American roads. GM killed the Hummer--a brand that had environmentalists wetting the bed at night--in 2010. First hitting the showrooms under GM in 1992, Hummer had been the bane of environmentalists for 18 years when it was snuffed-out. It was generally understood that for all of Hummer's opposition, it was the need for GM to cuts brands in order to secure Federal bankruptcy help, not environmalists, that killed Hummer.

I have to wonder the color of the sky over the planet in which environmentalists killed the Excursion after only six years, but they needed 18 years and the Global Financial Crisis to put Hummer to its grave. Mercy, mercy:rolleyes::rolleyes:
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
35,334 Posts
Certain people have a remarkable way of finding obscure references and blowing them up into something big. Ford stopped selling the Excursion in the US in 2005 after just six years on American roads. GM killed the Hummer--a brand that had environmentalists wetting the bed at night--in 2010. First hitting the showrooms under GM in 1992, Hummer had been the bane of environmentalists for 18 years when it was snuffed-out. It was generally understood that for all of Hummer's opposition, it was the need for GM to cuts brands in order to secure Federal bankruptcy help, not environmalists, that killed Hummer.

I have to wonder the color of the sky over the planet in which environmentalists killed the Excursion after only six years, but they needed 18 years and the Global Financial Crisis to put Hummer to its grave. Mercy, mercy:rolleyes::rolleyes:
Excursion died its natural death. It was Fugly
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
11,409 Posts
Certain people have a remarkable way of finding obscure references and blowing them up into something big. Ford stopped selling the Excursion in the US in 2005 after just six years on American roads. GM killed the Hummer--a brand that had environmentalists wetting the bed at night--in 2010. First hitting the showrooms under GM in 1992, Hummer had been the bane of environmentalists for 18 years when it was snuffed-out. It was generally understood that for all of Hummer's opposition, it was the need for GM to cuts brands in order to secure Federal bankruptcy help, not environmalists, that killed Hummer.

I have to wonder the color of the sky over the planet in which environmentalists killed the Excursion after only six years, but they needed 18 years and the Global Financial Crisis to put Hummer to its grave. Mercy, mercy:rolleyes::rolleyes:
Which is why I question the veracity of environmental groups going after Hummer vs Excursion, Hummer having a military version certainly helped with community perception and longevity with GM buyers as did stars like Arnold owning one…..

Ford axed Excursion but replaced it with an extended wheelbase Expedition that continues today, Bill Ford is a bit greeny at heart but one of his desires was to continue a vehicle that size but in a more efficient package that didn’t run the gauntlet with environmentalist. I never understood why they didn’t push the SD diesel option to improve economy in such a large and heavy vehicle.
 
21 - 40 of 85 Posts
Top