[HoosierRon]

Car makers could face 75mpg rules by 2030s, EPA says

DETROIT -- The nation's passenger cars and light trucks may have to average 75 miles per gallon by the 2030s, a top federal environmental official said at the SAE International World Congress.

Margo Oge, director of the Environmental Protection Agency's Office of Transportation and Air Quality, said Monday at the SAE International 2008 World Congress in Detroit that's the level of fuel economy needed to meet a widely backed scientific-community proposal to cut greenhouse gas emissions by 50 to 80 percent by 2050 from 2000 levels.

Congress has mandated automobiles and light trucks average an industry fleet-wide average of 35 mpg by 2020, a 40 percent increase over current requirements.

To meet the low end of the 2050 proposal, automakers would have to average 75 mpg in the 2030s

 

[I-Love-Pontiac]

Oh well that's barely anything at all. GM just needs direct injection and better aerodynamics.

 

[F14CRAZY]

Anyone find that 70 mpg carburetor in their basement yet?

 

[EldoFan]

75MPG?? Good luck trying to get that passed......

If an '88 Honda CRX was able to get at most, 51MPG or so.......I have a hard time believing even the Asian big 3 would be able to meet this, let alone our big 3.

Hell, they'd prolly stand with us in opposition vs. the environazis......

 

[BGH]

I think the only company to not lobby against the new CAFE standard was Honda. Toyota and Nissan where both siding with the rest of the industry.

 

[member12]

Why are we talking about the EPA?

Since when do they matter at all?

They screw us over by limiting highway development funds until pollution is in check (so obviously we can choke in traffic!). They suck.

 

[T-Type]

Relax guys, the Volt is to get what? 150 mpg? They have 20 years to get the rest of fleet up. I don't think this will be a big deal.

 

[prowlerjc]

..with Liberty and Mopeds for all.

 

[HoosierRon]

Now are you guys starting to understand what the "global climate change" movement is really about?

 

[tgagneguam]

The thing I am less clear about is how the government arrived at these figures. For instance, while the announcement was made at the SAE International World Congress, they don't really give too much in the way of feedback from those people who will be responsible for achieving the new standards. Sure, Lutz has responded, for whatever that's worth. But I wonder if engineers of some worth have weighed in. GM's director of powertrain systems research, J. Gary Smyth, simply commented on the number of vehicles that are on the road now and the projected number of vehicles that will be on the road in 2030.

...Oge said the auto industry should be able to meet the 35 mpg standard by 2018 with the same size fleet, with cost-effective technology improvements, based on an internal EPA study.

Well that's fine and good, Margo, but who helped to drive the internal EPA study? I'm not saying she's full of ****, yet, but were the numbers developed in part with the consultation of engineers who could comment more intelligently on the goals? It seems to me that if the proposals were supported by the SAE (or some other like organization), I'd be more convinced that they're achievable. But having the government mandate something-"your cars need to achieve 75 mpg, now have at it, folks"-without convincing evidence that it can be achieved isn't particularly inspiring.

Do any of the engineers who visit this site know more?

 

[Rocket 88]

Now are you guys starting to understand what the "global climate change" movement is really about?

I heard it was just a myth. In all those commerials my Hummer looks like it is friends with the enviornment. How on earth could a bunch of scientist figure out that dumping tons of pollution in a closed enviornment could be bad for the environment. Surely you jest.

Personally I'd rather chock to death on exhaust fumes then allow some crazy "book smart" person to stop me from my god given right to drive two plus tons worth of steel! After all thats what America is all about!

Kidding.

 

[Joevette]

so by 2020 it needs to be '35' mpg but 10 years after that it has to go up to 75... sure

 

[Ambalanche]

Now are you guys starting to understand what the "global climate change" movement is really about?

Oh yes, some of us understand clearly, but some may need to have it explained and It'd take a page for me to do it. Why don't you do the honors HoosierRon?

 

[jman196]

Exactly why is Co2 bad for the environment again?

 

[soloyosh]

Where the GHG come from:
http://cait.wri.org/figures/US-FlowChart.pdf
Road traffic is the largest source, but not the only source. I suspect that the Director's comments were weighted towards WOW factor and that she may have laid the burden of the GHG reduction entirely on the automotive fleet. She could have said it a different way by saying the only way to hit those targets was to limit the US automotive fleet to roughly half what it is today. But then that wouldn't score any points with her boss now would it?

 

[logansowner]

Exactly why is Co2 bad for the environment again?

The rest of our exhaust gas is bad to breath, the C02 is the only one that actually hurts the environment. Traps heat. But I refuse to believe that it does so at any meaningful level. Read somewhere that man creates less than 5% of the C02, the rest is natural. So we will just ruin our economy over that 5%. Sounds great.

And how exactly do they think we are going to meet 35 MPG in 2020, but in 2030, that's going to jump to 75MPG...Year frickin right.

Only way that is possible is for electric vehicles to improve, and catch on. And if that happens we need a whole new electrical infrastructure to provide the extra power demand.

This in the western world, technology HAS to change to meet what we want, we do not have to change to meet technology. What I mean is that new discoveries are only going to matter if they can be implemented to our lifestyle, and not if our lifestyle needs to change to make it work.

That's why trucks will never die, we want what we want, regardless of what that guy who can't type proper sentences thinks. If 60 MPG Micro cars from Europe would work here, we'd ****ING HAVE THEM HERE.

I'm not changing my lifestyle to drive some piddly ass-ed car.

 

[FenwickHockey65]

What if we just stick E-Flex into every single car?? 150 MPG all around, with gas and diesel and possibly hydrogen still in the mix.

 

[VibenPontiac]

Hell, they'd prolly stand with us in opposition vs. the environazis......

A little unknown fact is that they have been standing with the Big 3. They opposed the new standards, they opposed California setting their own standards etc...yet somehow it never gets reported...I can't imagine why .

 

[eaton53]

The thing I am less clear about is how the government arrived at these figures.

They were lodged so far up the bunghole they required one of these to extract them...

 

[PhishPhood]

Remember that the EPA has nothing to do with CAFE. That's under the bailiwick of the NHTSA. The EPA however does have responsibility for monitoring and controlling CO2 and GHGs since the Supreme Court told it to do so.

This may be a shot in some intramural warfare between agencies. IOW a tempest in a teapot.