[cdp326]

Seems weird the AWD is only 110 lbs. more.

The 2009 Pontiac Vibe, (exact same sized car), is 2,975 for FWD and 3,285 for AWD.

That base FWD weight might have been for the 1.8L, and/or a manual. The 2nd gen AWD Vibe came with the 2.4L/auto.

For reference, the Equinox seems to be between 150-170 lbs heavier for AWD depending on trim.

 

[syr74]

That will throw fits to Ford who brags so much about their EcoBoost (EcoBoast) LOL.

I think that might be more than a little optimistic. The Escape is larger, heavier, and noticeably more powerful even in 1.6L EB trim and still manages to knock down an identical highway fuel economy rating and only 2mpg worse city rating as compared to the Encore. To be fair I don't really think that fuel economy rating will seriously hurt the Encore either, at some point good enough is good enough for a segment and, given the positioning of this little cute-ute I think it'll fare alright in terms of perceived fuel efficiency.

That said, I think power to weight could be a bigger issue. Another .2L to .3L of engine certainly wouldn't hurt, particularly given the upscale image Buick is trying to cultivate here, the sooner GM gets a little more engine in this the better IMO. My only other issue with this little trucklet is that I think it would fare better as a Cadillac. In fact, I'm increasingly seeing less reason to have both Buick and Cadillac in the lineup as the brands develop and the Encore only serves to convince me that there really isn't room in town for the both of them.

edit: and, I thought it worth mentioning, I rather like the way the Buick family styling works on this little crossover.

 

[bballr4567]

$20K - $25K? I'd be surprised if was that low in the range.

The thing I struggle with this car, is the reasons most people buy small cars............

If its not cheap and doesn't get great MPG's what is the point!? Two-tone, soft-touch, fake stitched dashboards!?

The Verano has obviously hit a great spot in the market. People want to downsize from luxury vehicles yet still get those features. The Evoque (18/28, 3900lbs (!?!?!)) is there too. Obviously Im not comparing the Encore to those two vehicles but there is a shift towards smaller vehicles that dont have the penalty of being cheap. Its a small segment but its growing very fast.

 

[syr74]

^ This is where premium brand growth is going to be happening over the next several years. I will be very surprised if both Lincoln and Cadillac don't have offerings in both the B and C segments, in both car and crossover trim with respect to the latter segment, within the next five or six years. Cadillac Astra, Lincoln Focus, Cadillac Encore, Lincoln Escape, and potentially Lincoln EcoSport here we come. And everybody else is going there as well including BMW, MB, and AUDI.

 

[andyk]

I want it with Chevy bow on it *

 

[Ed753]

The Verano has obviously hit a great spot in the market. People want to downsize from luxury vehicles yet still get those features.

IMHO its more to do with affordability, the Verano is doing quite well compared to the Regal, but that car is selling at a 1/3 of what it was suppose to be selling.

The Verano are leasing very well.

The Evoque (18/28, 3900lbs (!?!?!)) is there too. Obviously Im not comparing the Encore to those two vehicles but there is a shift towards smaller vehicles that dont have the penalty of being cheap. Its a small segment but its growing very fast.

Funny you mention the Evoque, my wife really had an eye for that vehicle, we had only saw it in ads and on-line media, when we finally got down to the LR dealer, she couldn't have been more disappointed, complete disgust and denial, we only got out of the car to peek in-side, never even made it in the dealer, "this thing is dinky!" is the phrase she used.

Again, I'm not buying the "cheap penalty" most Chevy's or Ford's or Chrysler's are nice enough and have the creature features we want and enjoy, you can make a small car as nice as you want, you'll never be able to overcome space or lack thereof, the center armrest the size of a 8-track tape, 2 cup-holders, a shifter, an e-brake and storage spots all under 2-elbows fighting for the same piece of real-estate overshadows a padded double-stitched dash-board in my book a 100 to 1. Having just returned from a 4 day 1,300 mile trip in a Cruze RS 2LT only reinforced my thinking.

 

[bballr4567]

Your smallest car is a Grand Cherokee, I can see why she didn't like it.

The market is shifting towards it. Even BMW thinks that the US is ready for the X1 now.

 

[Ed753]

Your smallest car is a Grand Cherokee, I can see why she didn't like it.

It's actually the mother-in-laws, but since we take it over for a portion of the year, when she goes to AZ, I track it when I use it.

Far from efficient, but if it was a car, its about the size of a Malibu. An older lady with millions of dollars that drives about 3,000 miles a year, gas usage, much less gas cost is an afterthought.

The market is shifting towards it. Even BMW thinks that the US is ready for the X1 now.

Is BMW going to then stop selling the other X's, or is it just expanding its N.A. offering as it continues to stack them up and knock them down?

Does Hyundai think the market is shifting towards larger/full size sedans, or is it just expanding its offering, in search of additional sales, MS and margin?

Its simply about margin, a tarted-up Chevy Cruze with Buick badges and a $30,000 window sticker. (and yes I know they are different, only GM would offer 2 almost identically sized cars, yet different, that only experts would know is not the case). < One of the most in-effiecint forms of badge engineering.

 

[bballr4567]

It doesn't matter the size but the packaging. There is no comparing a Verano and Cruze. Plus, there is nothing like the Encore out. GM is making a segment here. You don't agree with it but the market is shifting towards smaller vehicles and luxury cars need to shift as well.

 

[goblue]

Best MPG from a domestic manufacturer?

If you have to include that qualifier you shouldn't even say it. Just makes the domestics look weak. Most people don't even consider whether a vehicle is from a domestic or foreign manufacturer. Time to compete with the world GM.

 

[Ed753]

It doesn't matter the size but the packaging. There is no comparing a Verano and Cruze. Plus, there is nothing like the Encore out. GM is making a segment here. You don't agree with it but the market is shifting towards smaller vehicles and luxury cars need to shift as well.

Size doesn't matter? Packaging!? as I stated: "you can make a small car as nice as you want, you'll never be able to overcome space or lack thereof, the center armrest the size of a 8-track tape, 2 cup-holders, a shifter, an e-brake and storage spots all under 2-elbows fighting for the same piece of real-estate overshadows a padded double-stitched dash-board in my book"

No comparing the Verano to the Cruze!? Is that opinion or fact?

Which is what exactly? An over-priced Mini-CUV?

Pricing isn't out yet, but I'm guessing based on recent history the majority are going to think its over-priced, it'll get some absurd residual and lease well, ignoring the front & back-end fees.

I get it, but I'm not buying it.

Is being cramped suddenly hip!? - Unless you are the one that has the compact space at the apartment complex, what reasons do people want smaller cars other than cheaper to buy and better on gas?

Best MPG from a domestic manufacturer?

If you have to include that qualifier you shouldn't even say it. Just makes the domestics look weak. Most people don't even consider whether a vehicle is from a domestic or foreign manufacturer. Time to compete with the world GM.

I was going to bring that up, but I'm a big enough hater without that comment, but that could be perceived by some to be right out of the Toyota and/or Farley play-book, only its GM, so it a feather and gold star.

This car is a Pontiac Vibe with a 3" lift.

 

[John Galt]

Surprised that the EPA MPG estimates weren't better, this is the same drivetrain as the Cruze ECO that gets 42 hwy MPG.

Also, the much larger Theta's will probably get 33 hwy MPG once they have the new 2.5l ECO. Thought the Encore would achieve at least 35 hwy MPG.

 

[InvictaMan]

If you had been given a choice, which would you choose? Personally, I prefer the larger, economical hybrid, with better looks, more Buick DNA and more style.

 

[osbornk]

I never imagined that Buick would become GMs small car division.

 

[cdp326]

Size doesn't matter? Packaging!? as I stated: "you can make a small car as nice as you want, you'll never be able to overcome space or lack thereof, the center armrest the size of a 8-track tape, 2 cup-holders, a shifter, an e-brake and storage spots all under 2-elbows fighting for the same piece of real-estate overshadows a padded double-stitched dash-board in my book"

Well yes, the packaging of the vehicle for the size does matter more. This is the problem GM has run into with a number of past models, ending up with bigger cars that aren't necessarily bigger (maybe even smaller) inside.

But I'd tend to share your concern. The Cruze example - for all its space, doesn't necessarily feel that big inside to me (maybe because they're always dark interiors). Small cars continually go for more space by shifting it up, taller, but then you still have the center console area that feels scrunched and narrow, even compared to other small cars.

There's absolutely a shift toward smaller vehicles, and crossovers, and smaller crossovers. I have no doubt Buick dealers are eager for another crossover considering the only one they have is the Enclave and they're probably seeing every other brand's crossovers driving by all day long. But my issue with the Encore is that it still seems to leave a huge space where they need a crossover, maybe even moreso since they're the only GM brand without a more conventional crossover.

"GM is making a segment here, there's nothing like the Encore" - okay, but what about segments that are already out there that they're not in? What about the segments they've already been in? Like compact hatches (Astra/Vibe/HHR), or roomy-on-the-inside CUVs (Rendezvous). If those are coming eventually, how did we get this before them?

And what's going to get people in the showrooms to look at this, compared to the number of other little crossovers that get over 30 mpg for under $30k? Encore may be by itself, but then it has to establish itself too. Verano is a small Buick, but even though for the last 15 years Buick didn't sell anything physically smaller than a LaCrosse, the Verano is still an efficient sedan for $23k. Buick has always been able to sell that. I think they'll probably sell Encores just on a similar note - people find a taller, more comfortable 33 mpg Encore at a similar price to other Buicks.

And I worry about using the "small cars that don't feel cheap" line for Buicks because I'd hate for those kinds of statements to discount the improvements made in small "regular brand" vehicles like Chevrolet.

 

[58482]

Funny that my 2003 Impala LS (3800 SII) gets about the same mileage....it's 3600lbs stock plus me and misc. It's probably 3800-4000 lbs on average. Still the same mileage.

 

[Ed753]

"Nicely Equipped" starting at MSRP: $24,995.00

 

[hrcslam]

Funny that my 2003 Impala LS (3800 SII) gets about the same mileage....it's 3600lbs stock plus me and misc. It's probably 3800-4000 lbs on average. Still the same mileage.

Try application of Aerodynamics. Your car is longer and lower which equals better aerodynamics. I can throw any American football father than any soccer ball. They weigh about the same, but the American Football is far more aerodynamic.

 

[andretti]

Best MPG from a domestic manufacturer?

If you have to include that qualifier you shouldn't even say it. Just makes the domestics look weak. Most people don't even consider whether a vehicle is from a domestic or foreign manufacturer. Time to compete with the world GM.

Yes the qualifier "from a domestic manufacturer" is disingenuous at best. Isn't the Encore a Korean import rebadged as a Buick? I don't think GM should open the foreign versus domestic "can of worms" on this model.

 

[58482]

Thanks for the basic physics lesson.....I am well aware of that, I'm saying that after 9 years they shove this tiny engines in cars for better economy, but the issue is that they aren't developing the bigger engines to do so. My dad had an 08 Malibu LTZ 4 banger and I got better mileage than it in both city and hwy.