[Ronald McChevy]

American Electric Power says grid ready for PHEVs

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/07/16/american-electric-power-says-grid-ready-for-phevs/

Michael Morris, Chairman and CEO of American Electric Power, believes that the U.S. electrical grid is capable of supporting up to 60 million plug-in hybrid vehicles right now.

U.S. Electrical Grid Ready for PHEVs, Power Company Chief Says

http://wardsauto.com/electronics/electrical_grid_ready/

“There’s already an infrastructure to deliver electricity,” he adds, “so we can start to produce vehicles to take advantage of that infrastructure. And as it begins to resonate in the marketplace, we can convert over our industry and the utility industry can ramp up.”
In fact, Morris says the nation’s electrical infrastructure would benefit from more demand in off-peak hours, when it is expected owners would charge their vehicles overnight.
“You could argue (the addition of PHEVs) would be ‘impactive’ to the license life of a power station,” he says. “But the fact is (power stations) were made to run, not made to be up and down, up and down. The more they run around the clock, the better they are.”

 

[Saturn69]

Nu-uh! There are dozens of people on this site that say it won't work so these 'experts' are wrong, wrong, wrong!

 

[ColinOpseth]

Pfft, yeah. We can handle electric plug-ins everywhere except California where they're too busy spending money we don't have. We had to borrow 3 billion dollars last year and were STILL three and a half billion dollars overspent.

We are ready for electric cars, sure. Remote controlled ones that run on rechargeable 'D' batteries. My 17 month old son would have a blast with one of those.

 

[Sinner]

Every summer they tell us that power plants in Alberta are running dangerously close to max output and that we should conserve our energy, turn off lights ect. Why? So that a bunch of yuppy tree huggers in California can blast their air conditioning 24/7.

 

[LiNx]

Yeah, our infrastructure can support plug-in hybrids. We'll just have more rolling-blackouts in the suburbs between the draw created from those and A/C running on these days that are in the 90s. Seriously... My fiance doesnt have power just 2 miles away, and it tried to cycle on probably 5 times while I was over there and just fell on its face. But sure, bring on the battery cars.

 

[logansowner]

I have no doubt most places can handle it. But I am doubtful that places in California are capable as of now...or many large cities for that matter. But I can't see it being a problem anyway. The fear mongers toss out their numbers as if every vehicle on the road is going to be a plug in next week, which isn't remotely the case.

Even if every new vehicle was a plug in, the rate of sale on new vehicles to retirement of old cars is still a slow progression.

 

[edsuski]

People need to remember that electric cars can easily be charged at night during off peak times. Yes - even in California. The DOT estimates that 80% of the existing cars and light trucks could be re-charged during off peak hours WITHOUT adding a single wire or power plant to the grid.

The infrastructure exists TODAY to refuel plug-in electric vehicles in virtually everyone’s home. The Volt will plug into a 120V outlet, draw 13 amps or less and recharge in approx. 6 hours.

Approximately 94% of the oil we burn today in the United States is for automotive gasoline. We could reduce our needs for oil to what we can supply domestically (eventually to nearly zero if we wanted to) and not buy another barrel from the Middle East. The technology is available NOW. It is only a political issue. We need the will to make this happen. We can do it.... GM and the Volt will help!

 

[LBTheDawg]

When does your BS detector go off?

Mine does everytime somebody quotes a percentage in a posting.

 

[GG_TECH]

LOGANOWNERS WROTE:

I have no doubt most places can handle it. But I am doubtful that places in California are capable as of now...or many large cities for that matter. But I can't see it being a problem anyway. The fear mongers toss out their numbers as if every vehicle on the road is going to be a plug in next week, which isn't remotely the case.

Even if every new vehicle was a plug in, the rate of sale on new vehicles to retirement of old cars is still a slow progression.

I agree with those assesments. Cali has the most risk of power outages. I have been involved with a few outages back in my days at Silicon Valley. Not fun but scary. Traffic lights go out and it becomes a mess. Most of the country initially should be fine except for a few pockets. As time increases and more electric cars become more availible and become the norm (I hope) then you might see some issues. If the power grid can keep up with the demand with new plants or power sources then we should be fine.

I really like the Volt, I just hope that GM can transfer that technology into a PHSUV.

 

[2002 Caddy]

To understand this question you need to consider how coal, oil, gas and nuclear power plants work. All of these convert heat into steam and the steam into electricity... Here is the important part...

YOU CAN'T TURN THEM ON AND OFF.

You can spool them up and down a bit, but unlike a hydro dam they are either putting power on the grid or they are "venting" off" (aka waisting) heat.

You have to build your power plants to handle max power requirements ... This is known to some power engineers as the "bikini curve". Daily you get two big round power "bumps" one with a peak near 8:00am and one with a peak near 6:00pm

Plug in cars make sense as they enable capture all of the power available at the low parts of the bikini curve. (from about 10:00pm until 5:00am)

There are parts of the country where the grid could have issues... If your state is primarily serviced by hydro power... then these plants are in trouble... actually the plants are fine... But the reservoirs are not sized to be drained "full on" 7/24... Hydro dams need the down time to help "fill up".

 

[steinravnik]

American Electric Power says grid ready for PHEVs

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/07/16/american-electric-power-says-grid-ready-for-phevs/



U.S. Electrical Grid Ready for PHEVs, Power Company Chief Says

http://wardsauto.com/electronics/electrical_grid_ready/

I don't believe it. The oil man told me we will have brownouts if everyone plugs in their cars.

 

[steinravnik]

To understand this question you need to consider how coal, oil, gas and nuclear power plants work. All of these convert heat into steam and the steam into electricity... Here is the important part...

YOU CAN'T TURN THEM ON AND OFF.

You can spool them up and down a bit, but unlike a hydro dam they are either putting power on the grid or they are "venting" off" (aka waisting) heat.

You have to build your power plants to handle max power requirements ... This is known to some power engineers as the "bikini curve". Daily you get two big round power "bumps" one with a peak near 8:00am and one with a peak near 6:00pm

Plug in cars make sense as they enable capture all of the power available at the low parts of the bikini curve. (from about 10:00pm until 5:00am)

There are parts of the country where the grid could have issues... If your state is primarily serviced by hydro power... then these plants are in trouble... actually the plants are fine... But the reservoirs are not sized to be drained "full on" 7/24... Hydro dams need the down time to help "fill up".

Mmmm... Bikini curve...

 

[wildgoosechase]

I'd just like to know if my apartment complex will complain if I run 200 feet of extension cord down the walk to my car?

 

[jlt0x]

Of course the US electrical grid is capable & would benefit from more demand in off-peak hours. That means, in the "off-peak" hours, the electric utility industry would be making as much money as they would during mid-day peak periods. They'd have a constant demand for electricity 24 hours a day. Won't that raise utility rates b/c demand is always fairly high?

If these future electric vehicles will only require 1-2 hours for a full recharge, then maybe that might not make such a huge impact overall. I know it's not like recharging your cell phone or laptop each night, but it shouldn't be like running your A/C, dishwasher, and hair dryer all day either.

 

[CaptainDan]

Of course the US electrical grid is capable & would benefit from more demand in off-peak hours. That means, in the "off-peak" hours, the electric utility industry would be making as much money as they would during mid-day peak periods. They'd have a constant demand for electricity 24 hours a day. Won't that raise utility rates b/c demand is always fairly high? .......

No. That would LOWER your rates since the peak demand is kept low, and a more uniform demand is achieved. The utility would be selling more of it's product (electricity) with no additional infrastructure cost.

 

[TJ95GAGT]

No. That would LOWER your rates since the peak demand is kept low, and a more uniform demand is achieved. The utility would be selling more of it's product (electricity) with no additional infrastructure cost.

I don't see that happening. A more likely scenario would be an increase in rates.

 

[CaptainDan]

Charging electric cars off the grid could actually REDUCE the likelyhood of blackouts and power disruptions.

Similar to the way a lot of utilities offer a seperate (and cheaper) "interuptible" line specifically for your A/C. If there is a heavy spike in electricity demand, the feed to your A/C is interupted (usually just for a few minutes, you'd never even notice). The utility pays to install this setup (it helps them).

Such a line could be even better with a charger, as some power could actually feed back to alleviate a temporary spike.

This would work very well since it also takes time (decades) to add appreciable numbers of electric cars to the fleet. And that time lag allows utilities to keep up and plan ahead, building more capacity.

 

[CaptainDan]

I don't see that happening. A more likely scenario would be an increase in rates.

No. Utilities are not the same as oil companies. Rate increases require public hearings to prove that they NEED to increase the rates. And selling more electricity with the same equipment SAVES them money. Rates would drop (or at least not go up) until there were enough electric cars (millions)to swamp the off peak periods, but that would take decades, which would allow a utility time to build in additional capacity.

 

[Saturn69]

Yeah, our infrastructure can support plug-in hybrids. We'll just have more rolling-blackouts in the suburbs between the draw created from those and A/C running on these days that are in the 90s. Seriously... My fiance doesnt have power just 2 miles away, and it tried to cycle on probably 5 times while I was over there and just fell on its face. But sure, bring on the battery cars.

The plug-ins will mostly be charged at night, when A/C use drops. And 100K plug-ins aren't going to hurt anything, it's not like all 270 million cars are being replaced all at the same time with plug-in hybrids. Everything will be alright.

 

[Knucklehead]

People need to remember that electric cars can easily be charged at night during off peak times. Yes - even in California. The DOT estimates that 80% of the existing cars and light trucks could be re-charged during off peak hours WITHOUT adding a single wire or power plant to the grid.

The infrastructure exists TODAY to refuel plug-in electric vehicles in virtually everyone’s home. The Volt will plug into a 120V outlet, draw 13 amps or less and recharge in approx. 6 hours.

Approximately 94% of the oil we burn today in the United States is for automotive gasoline. We could reduce our needs for oil to what we can supply domestically (eventually to nearly zero if we wanted to) and not buy another barrel from the Middle East. The technology is available NOW. It is only a political issue. We need the will to make this happen. We can do it.... GM and the Volt will help!

Using P= i times e............ that would be around 1.6kw/hr..? Is that right?
Around $.60 at our rates......