[rougeriver]

granted.. and I agree on the tarnishing to a degree. Part of the tarnishing was simply not catching up with what the public wanted.. remaining a perceived old mans luxury with no sporting edge brand, while the Germans were elevating themselves into the hybrid Sport Lux that the younger Americans wanted. Even I didn't want what my dad loved in his old Brougham. It was a boat.. it had a LT1 in it yeah.. but hit a corner to hard and U might flip the thing. EFF that. When the Sigma platform arrived I knew I was a potential Cadillac customer. Alpha arrived and I had the handling of a Vette in a Cadillac Sport Lux package. Omega? Best of both worlds. Omega with a V? Best of ever world.. and no need for me to even consider an S-Class.

These platforms are why I started purchasing Cadillacs. For decades, American marques were notorious for stuffing powerful engines into mediocre platforms, adding very stiff suspensions, and calling it a day. Just like in athletics (squats and deadlifts), one must start with a great foundation. And, unlike years ago, the GM platforms are class leading in weight reduction.

 

[CMiatso DaBang]

I didn't know you had trouble with BMW. I do remember your troubles with the Toyota Camry V6 that turned oil into sludge.

Yup. The Camry was a thing.. and in truth I really never posted much about my M5 because I was well known to be a staunch AMERICAN only car guy.. but it was also known that I had dabbled in BMW before.. Nissan.. Mazda.. as well as a classic Spitfire LOL... Toyota before the engine sludge issue and the legal issues concerning getting them to take it back I was less tarnished myself against foreign brands. Then the perception thing hit me.. and I simply no longer needed or subscribed to the illusion. The M5 debacle was a 2 month affair that they actually gave me almost no issue with taking back. I lost only about $1K on that buyback and only because the issues were documented well by them. And keep this in mind.. The M5 still remains my favorite of the German super-sedans.. I just wouldn't own one

 

[CMiatso DaBang]

It's fine as is,.. as a Cadillac, arguably a solid choice for people attracted to the Buick Encore but wanting something a bit larger and more upscale..

They will most likely go to the Envision.. or if the tariff thing effects.. the new Encore GX. Believe me when I say that not many people walk into or out of a Cadillac dealer or Buick Dealer and say... "if they don;t have what I want.. I'm going to their sister brand.." They just don;t associate the two. Its one of the reasons why I really think that GM shouldn't, and I don't even believe they are these days, associate these brands. Let them all be independent unless they are gonna go hard and literally market them each as stepping stone brands

 

[BlackGTP]

granted.. and I agree on the tarnishing to a degree. Part of the tarnishing was simply not catching up with what the public wanted.. remaining a perceived old mans luxury with no sporting edge brand, while the Germans were elevating themselves into the hybrid Sport Lux that the younger Americans wanted. Even I didn't want what my dad loved in his old Brougham. It was a boat.. it had a LT1 in it yeah.. but hit a corner to hard and U might flip the thing. EFF that. When the Sigma platform arrived I knew I was a potential Cadillac customer. Alpha arrived and I had the handling of a Vette in a Cadillac Sport Lux package. Omega? Best of both worlds. Omega with a V? Best of every world.. and no need for me to even consider an S-Class.

And I do agree - Cadillac does in many instances have the best! But they've failed on the marketing side to get the word out. So many people out there still laugh when I say I have a Cadillac - old Bob in an old mans car. I take the jokes (because they won't listen to me when I say my ATS is for all intents a sports car) and then they quickly change their mind when they see my ATS. But why is it 2019 and I'm still getting laughed at? That tarnished image is still there.

The engineers and designers are doing their job for the most part, but marketing is letting the whole division down.

 

[SKH]

It's fine as is,.. as a Cadillac, arguably a solid choice for people attracted to the Buick Encore but wanting something a bit larger and more upscale..

What’s really good about the XT4, is the Premium Luxury (Especially that white one) looks just as good as the Sport version. It would be a tough choice to make, as visually they both bring a very compelling and desirable wrapper to the Premium compact SUV/CUV party. Different, but equal.

 

[CMiatso DaBang]

And I do agree - Cadillac does in many instances have the best! But they've failed on the marketing side to get the word out. So many people out there still laugh when I say I have a Cadillac - old Bob in an old mans car. I take the jokes (because they won't listen to me when I say my ATS is for all intents a sports car) and then they quickly change their mind when they see my ATS. But why is it 2019 and I'm still getting laughed at? That tarnished image is still there.

I hear U.. and I used to get that from people I knew.. but then i showed them what my last 4 Caddys could do. but yeah.. their marketing sucked. The best plan they had for changing the perceptions was the "Break through (Led Zep) period

 

[yamahr1]

Another dipwad lands a job reviewing cars. Pretty much all rubbish. The XT4 is a very solid entry from Cadillac, and is doing well. And it very much is a Cadillac and appropriately priced, IMO, and I've looked it over closely. Hey even back in the heyday, they made a Calais with crank windows. But journalists these days pretty much don't need to know anything except, "make derogatory comments about GM as often as possible and your fellow journalists might take you seriously."

 

[jzchev28]

That’s if Cadillac or GM can justify the cost of developing that engine for transverse applications, based on the numbers they think they might sell. Also do they have a transmission that can handle that much torque in a FWD/AWD vehicle?

I suspect the lack of a suitable transmission is why we don’t have a C1XX based CUV with more than 300 ft/lb of torque, however if they have one, then the XT4 with the 2.7L 4 banger would be a pretty awesome car.

If the 2.7T won't fit, another option would be an optional hi-perf 2.0TT. Say 300hp. That's roughly what Merc has for latest gen 2.0Ts. Then you could have:

CT4/XT4: base 237hp 2.0TT / optional 300hp 2.0TT for Sport/Prem Lux
CT4-V: 320hp 2.7T (would have more torque than 2.0TT yay)
XT4-V: I don't think I'd do it, not performance/track related enough due to FWD/AWD platform. Gotta draw the line somewhere to maintain V prestige. I'm fine with current RWD/AWD CT4-V/CT5-V.

For the record I'd be fine with a hypothetical RWD/AWD XT7-V with +400hp!

Not to nitpick but a inline 4 doesn't need a twin turbo, twin scroll sure but that is not the same thing.

 

[jpd80]

Equinox could be on the XT4 platform for sure, but C1XX already has two wheelbase lengths 112.5-112.7” for the XT5/Envoy/Blazer/Blazer XL and 120.9” for the Enclave/Traverse. I think a third 116” WB would be great, (especially the XT6 for a Goldilocks WB) but the C1XX is probably going to be replaced or slowly phased out in 2-3 years in favor of VSS-F, so any further developments on C1XX are unlikely.

I noticed that the XT4 is on E2XX and just wondered at the cohesion possible if all three were on the same platform but I guess I'm not looking at the logistics of the vehicles being extensions - incremental production at plants already producing other volume proucts on the same platforms,

I like your idea of 116" wheelbase for XT6, that would most definitely change its proportions. the biggest take away for me with regards luxury Utilities s width, that extra 3" over plebian compact utilities makes the XT5 a roomy stand out - almost like a more efficient Edge/MKX.

I am Kind of a fan of the XT4, so glad that Cadillac put the effort in to make something different but I just wonder if it does draw a lot of sales away from XT5.....

 

[bballr4567]

No not suggesting they all be called XT5, consolidate the vehicles on one platform,
Compact XT4 is wider and longer 109.5" wheelbase than Equinox
Mid sized XT5 is on a 112" wheelbase
The XT6 is still on 112" wheelbase but 1" wider, longer rear for3rd row

Seriously, all of these could be one Utility platform in one width but with variable wheelbase and variable tail section. I just don't see why all of these need to be on three different platforms and three different plants.

Because GM.

 

[dannyg]

Not to nitpick but a inline 4 doesn't need a twin turbo, twin scroll sure but that is not the same thing.

Good point, I confused twin scroll with twin turbo. The 3.0 is twin turbo.

With stick shift I always prefer NA for instant throttle response (even if torque is lower). But with automatic might as well give in I guess...

 

[SKH]

I noticed that the XT4 is on E2XX and just wondered at the cohesion possible if all three were on the same platform but I guess I'm not looking at the logistics of the vehicles being extensions - incremental production at plants already producing other volume proucts on the same platforms,

I like your idea of 116" wheelbase for XT6, that would most definitely change its proportions. the biggest take away for me with regards luxury Utilities s width, that extra 3" over plebian compact utilities makes the XT5 a roomy stand out - almost like a more efficient Edge/MKX.

I am Kind of a fan of the XT4, so glad that Cadillac put the effort in to make something different but I just wonder if it does draw a lot of sales away from XT5.....

The XT6 is even wider than the XT5 but it is basically all in the track and the extra sheet metal to cover the wheels. Iirc XT6 and XT5 are basically the same in shoulder and hip room. The extra track width was to give the XT6 a better stance as it is just under 9” longer than the XT5. Without that extra width, it might end up looking very narrow like the proverbial pencil, a common complaint made over the years against countless GM offerings.

The extra width is what saves the XT6 imo. It needed the extra 2-3” of wheelbase, (116”) but the wider track nullified most of that need from an aesthetic standpoint. Clearly Cadillac was watching the pennies with XT6, and perhaps if C1XX wasn’t so near the end of it’s life cycle, it might have gotten that extra helping of WB.

I’m still curious as to why XT6 wasn’t on the 120.9” WB. Perhaps the designers though it made it look too much like a prosaic family hauler, rather than it being hunkered down, dynamic and sporty looking. Perhaps XT7 will get a 116-118” WB on the upcoming VSS-R platform?

My Discovery has 2.3” more WB versus the XT6 and is a couple of inches shorter in length. XT6 likely has more front overhang, and as a result of that extra length being overhang the design still looks quite handsome (especially the Sport on 21” rims) and is proportionally decent. My sister is going to look at the XT6 Sport to replace her Escalade. She wants the gray one with 21” rims like the Sport in the publicity shots. The dealer is already champing at the bit to get her to commit, but Cadillac needs to get their A$$ in gear announce option prices etc. Two months out, and you still can’t build one on Cadillac’s site!

 

[CMiatso DaBang]

Another dipwad lands a job reviewing cars. Pretty much all rubbish. The XT4 is a very solid entry from Cadillac, and is doing well. And it very much is a Cadillac and appropriately priced, IMO, and I've looked it over closely. Hey even back in the heyday, they made a Calais with crank windows. But journalists these days pretty much don't need to know anything except, "make derogatory comments about GM as often as possible and your fellow journalists might take you seriously."

Cadillac Calais roll up windows. Wow.. Blast from the past.. but if I were running Caddy.. I'd re-implement these.. as a option. I bet good money after sitting in them.. people would order the, quite frequently

 

[bmwboy2007]

Another dipwad lands a job reviewing cars. Pretty much all rubbish. The XT4 is a very solid entry from Cadillac, and is doing well. And it very much is a Cadillac and appropriately priced, IMO, and I've looked it over closely. Hey even back in the heyday, they made a Calais with crank windows. But journalists these days pretty much don't need to know anything except, "make derogatory comments about GM as often as possible and your fellow journalists might take you seriously."

Calais did have crank windows as standard equipment the first 2 years of production, as it was a renaming of the old Series 62, but in 1967 Cadillac made electric windows standard across all models. I suspect very few were ordered with crank windows those first two years.

I don't think I've seen crank windows in any Cadillac ever.

 

[rougeriver]

Cadillac Calais roll up windows. Wow.. Blast from the past.. but if I were running Caddy.. I'd re-implement these.. as a option. I bet good money after sitting in them.. people would order the, quite frequently

It just needs Billy Batts in the trunk

 

[SavoieRF]

I forgot your one of those people lol driving by your house and seeing two of the same car out front. I give the head shake and eye roll every time hahahahaha.

Yah but they are different colors and I also have an AT S coupe to bring balance to the force.😉

 

[AMERICA 123]

Well.... whatever.

The only way a Cadillac...... ok, watered down for the 'new reality hoax' - so the only way a Cadillac of at least some token repute should have a three, four, or five banger is as some **** hot, paradigm breaking Two Cycle somethin' or other.

Otherwise..... a Six on the cheap and because Management is clueless...... with an Eight for somethin' proper.

Full Stop.

And this Poster has ( very) 'high respect' ( so far ) for the LB3 -



JdN ... FTW.

 

[CMiatso DaBang]

It just needs Billy Batts in the trunk

That's about right

 

[megeebee]

But it's also doing something else: diluting the brand.

I wonder what he thinks of:

Mercedes CLA/ GLA

Most Lincolns

BMW 1(and arguably the 2)

Lexus NX/UX

 

[megeebee]

Cadillac Calais roll up windows. Wow.. Blast from the past.. but if I were running Caddy.. I'd re-implement these.. as a option. I bet good money after sitting in them.. people would order the, quite frequently

Or...

At least the wood was real.

Designed by Giorgio Giugiaro. A friend had one and it was a very good interior. Seats were very comfortable.