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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
http://www.caranddriver.com/photo-gallery/2015-porsche-cayenne-v-6-and-gts-photos-and-info-news

Never thought I'd say it, but the XT5 could actually compete as a lesser Cayenne:

The base Cayenne carries over the proven naturally aspirated 3.6-liter V-6. Rated at 300 horsepower, it propels the SUV to 62 mph in a claimed 7.7 seconds, a figure that drops to 7.6 seconds with the optional Sport Chrono package.
I would guess the XT5 will get the LTG as standard equipment with the new 3.0TT from the CT6 as the optional engine. Be nice if they put the LF3 in as a Vsport AWD option to compete with the new GTS:

Porsche is also adding the new GTS, a more powerful variation of the Cayenne S. It's no longer propelled by a lusty V-8, but rather a twin-turbocharged 3.6-liter V-6 that makes an impressive 440 horsepower and an even more remarkable 443 lb-ft of torque.
I think doing that with dynamic styling could creep the XT5 up the prestige ladder and quell some of the forthcoming sticker shock from SRX loyalists...
 

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That 3.6 shouldn't be in a Porsche and I don't think the XT5 will be able to compete with the Cayenne. Not with FWD that is.
 

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I want the smaller than SRX cuv from Cadillac to have 300 hp turbo 4 and a 420 turbo v6 wouldn't be too bad either...both mated to the 8L90..

That would be pretty cool from Cadillac...
 

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This notion that CUVs need to be RWD-based is a bit of a falacy. With well over 4000 lb weights, high centers of gravity and mainly AWD, it makes little difference if a CUV started out as a FWD or RWD platform. It's not like these are really performance machines and AWD can get all the power to the ground anyway.

That said, Porsche has polished the platform shared with VW and Audi quite nicely. No other CUV is going to have the bandwidth the Cayenne on or off road. And, the niche for this kind of capability and price is pretty small.

The real question is whether whether or not whatever platform lies under the XT5 is premium and capable enough to be a proper Cadillac. Hardly anybody faults the LR Evoque because it looks great and preforms well - even if its platform is FWD based.
 

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This notion that CUVs need to be RWD-based is a bit of a falacy. With well over 4000 lb weights, high centers of gravity and mainly AWD, it makes little difference if a CUV started out as a FWD or RWD platform. It's not like these are really performance machines and AWD can get all the power to the ground anyway.

That said, Porsche has polished the platform shared with VW and Audi quite nicely. No other CUV is going to have the bandwidth the Cayenne on or off road. And, the niche for this kind of capability and price is pretty small.

The real question is whether whether or not whatever platform lies under the XT5 is premium and capable enough to be a proper Cadillac. Hardly anybody faults the LR Evoque because it looks great and preforms well - even if its platform is FWD based.
There is CUV and then there is luxury CUV's. If Cadillac wants street creds, and to be in the conversations, they have to spend money on credibility.

There is a huge difference between lets say my Equinox and an X5 in both price and profitability to the automaker... The reason Cadillac does not need to play in the RX ($35,000.00 to $55,000.00 FWD based CUV's) territory is simple. GM has multiple brands that can price themselves in that space. They include
Vauxhall
Chevrolet
Opel
GMC
Buick
Holden


Why then oh why does Cadillac need to pile on? the denali brand well executed could easily take down an RX, so can Buick. You do not need Cadillac for that.
 

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XT5 won't have a chance against the Cayenne IMHO.

Not many CUV's have a chance against Cayenne.
Perhaps at the lower end, sure. But Cayenne runs the gamut.

Who knows what market the XT5 is aiming for. We don't really have enough information at this stage.
But, FWD + larger vehicle ≠ Cayenne competitor.

It may be closer to an ML competitor. But then again, ML/GLE isn't a romp in the park either, as it too runs the gamut.

Whatever the case may be, XT5 will need a version at 550HP. :D
 

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Hardly anybody faults the LR Evoque because it looks great and performs well - even if its platform is FWD based.
That's because it comes from a car maker where off-road capability HAS to be taken for granted, even on "shopping" models where manicured lawns are as far as they go off-road.

Porsche and Cadillac each have different sorts of heritage.
 

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agree, no matter what Cadillac designs, it will be impossible to beat 1-gen Cayenne in ugliness.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
My point was that the 3.6L has zero point being in a Porsche. On paper, it's actually a worse engine than GM's 3.6L and waters down the Cayenne. With Cayenne moving itself downmarket, it opens the door to competition that wasn't initially there.

But, FWD + larger vehicle ≠ Cayenne competitor.
In current form, the Cayenne is an inch longer than the SRX. We know the XT5 is going upmarket, but even still, they will likely be in the same weight class. If the XT5 starts at $42K w/2.0T, $52K w/3.0T, and $60K w/3.6TT topping off at $70K, it makes a pretty decent argument against the lower trim Cayennes. As far as drivetrain, the AWD sytem from the Envision sounds like it should be pretty engaging to drive, so we'll see how it performs with Cadillac's heightened emphasis on driving dynamics.

Make it good looking, give it good driving dynamics, give it a knockout interior and the new XT5 could be a game changer that competes with everything from the Lexus RX to the lower trim X5/GLE/Cayennes...
 

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Not many CUV's have a chance against Cayenne.
Perhaps at the lower end, sure. But Cayenne runs the gamut.

Who knows what market the XT5 is aiming for. We don't really have enough information at this stage.
But, FWD + larger vehicle ≠ Cayenne competitor.

It may be closer to an ML competitor. But then again, ML/GLE isn't a romp in the park either, as it too runs the gamut.

Whatever the case may be, XT5 will need a version at 550HP. :D
I'll tell you what market the XT5 is going for:

It's the MDX/QX60/MKX crowd. Instead of going right after BMW/MB/Porsche, they're playing it safe and going up against the weaker cars in that class. XT5 is going to be a good car and most likely be better than the MDX or QX60, but it just won't do much to increase their reputation or brand cache against the likes of BMW/MB/Audi/Porsche. A missed opportunity IMHO.

XT5 won't be able to hold the ML's jockstrap.
 

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The big volume is in the MDX/RX class. And that's exactly where SRX and I assume XT5 plays and it too sells in good volume. They're not direct competitors but the Cadillac that's closest to the Cayenne in the marketplace is the Escalade IMO.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
the Cadillac that's closest to the Cayenne in the marketplace is the Escalade IMO.
Maybe tangentially b/c of price and prestige, but if the XT5 is allowed to stretch with a Vsport package and dynamic handling AWD package, it will be much more of a Cayenne competitor for less money. Positioning the XT5 as a budget Cayenne will give Cadillac more upward mobility in the future.
 

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Why a "budget" Cayenne? Why not a full on Cayenne killer? They have the tools, knowledge, and skill, they just refuse to use them. :(
Because Cadillac doesn't have the appropriate platform to do it?
Unless Alpha+ is that extensible?

I'd be less concerned about Cayenne, but Cadillac really needs to determine which SUV is the primary target. XT5 really should re-focus on X5, like the Gen1 SRX did.
 
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