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I think it will be, its just most people want what they want when they want it...and when they want it is usually right away.

I like a lot of what I read about Electric vehicles. The thought of buying one soon for our 'second' car has gone through my head a few times. But just as many others, while I want one, I want the range to be just a bit higher, I want charging outside of the home to be just a bit easier and faster, and charging in the home to also be a bit quicker.
In exactly the same boat. Will consider an electric for our second car when its time to replace it, but the SUV will stay ICE for a long time. 500 miles of HWY range - regardless of temp/weather, in a 3 row, 4WD SUV is hard to beat.

Been saying it for years, but solid state batteries will be the inflection point for masses. It will solve the Range/Charging/Safety/Weight issues. Plus the charging infrastructure will be more robust by that time.

Then why are you buying a electric car?
Pretty easy, tax the crap out of gas/fuel and have major incentives for eVehicles - per the wisdom of thte great state of California. People will always be influenced by their wallets - and a lot of people are short sighted.
 

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#1 80% stayed EV and most of the 20% had ONLY 120V "slow charge" access as in they bought a car and will NOT spend the money for charging infrastructure and assumed there driving usage is LESS then it is OR that public charging is better then it is in there area
public charging is NOT a replacement for HOME charging and not seen as such by planners

every "new tech" has early adopters and followers that do NOT understand what they bought into
This. 100% of these folks came from ICE vehicles and only 20% went back. And it sounds like most who went back bought an EV without knowing what they were doing.

If you don't have 240V (or aren't willing to invest in it) at home, an EV doesn't make sense. I can see where people may have bought EVs planning to charge them at work (a lot of companies in CA offer charging, sometimes free, at work) and that wouldn't have worked too well this past year when very few people actually went to work.
 

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Discussion Starter · #26 ·
This. 100% of these folks came from ICE vehicles and only 20% went back. And it sounds like most who went back bought an EV without knowing what they were doing.

If you don't have 240V
(or aren't willing to invest in it) at home, an EV doesn't make sense. I can see where people may have bought EVs planning to charge them at work (a lot of companies in CA offer charging, sometimes free, at work) and that wouldn't have worked too well this past year when very few people actually went to work.
So blame the victims? What are you supposed to "know" when you buy a caah? That a five-minute drop-in at the evillll petrol dispensary is more like...long long time.

And there may be more than 20%, not everyone can or is willing to flip an unsatisfactory vehicle in the blink of an eye. Someone ate some depreciation here.
So only is not a true view. So far is closer to accurate, I'd say.

And how many salesmen told them oh by the way you'll need to invest blah blah blah in 240 otherwise this will take a month of Sundays to charge.

And good point about going to work. How many of these people were stuck at home under modified martial law and after lots of internet time, thought, "Gee whillakers! Mebbe ahh otter git me one uv them eee-lektrikk critters! Carbon!"

Now they're back in the real world.
 
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So blame the victims? What are you supposed to "know" when you buy a caah? That a five-minute drop-in at the evillll petrol dispensary is more like...long long time.

And there may be more than 20%, not everyone can or is willing to flip an unsatisfactory vehicle in the blink of an eye. Someone ate some depreciation here.
So only is not a true view. So far is closer to accurate, I'd say.

And how many salesmen told them oh by the way you'll need to invest blah blah blah in 240 otherwise this will take a month of Sundays to charge.

And good point about going to work. How many of these people were stuck at home under modified martial law and after lots of internet time, thought, "Gee whillakers! Mebbe ahh otter git me one uv them eee-lektrikk critters! Carbon!"

Now they're back in the real world.
Sorry, I don't subscribe to the "victim" mentality. This is like the folks who signed up for variable rate mortgages without knowing the rate will change. People need to educate themselves on what they are getting, especially for a major purchase. I mean, what did they expect? Plug into a USB port for 15 min and the car will be charged?
 

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Sorry, I don't subscribe to the "victim" mentality. This is like the folks who signed up for variable rate mortgages without knowing the rate will change. People need to educate themselves on what they are getting, especially for a major purchase. I mean, what did they expect? Plug into a USB port for 15 min and the car will be charged?
Do you really think the salesperson offered up all the information people needed to know prior to their purchase? Or do you think they glossed over the details to make the sale?

Most people treat a car as an appliance and don't put in all the effort to "understand" it. They just expect to plug it in and it should work. Yes, many people are ignorant and this is going to become part of the problem while transitioning to EVs.
 

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Do you really think the salesperson offered up all the information people needed to know prior to their purchase? Or do you think they glossed over the details to make the sale?

Most people treat a car as an appliance and don't put in all the effort to "understand" it. They just expect to plug it in and it should work. Yes, many people are ignorant and this is going to become part of the problem while transitioning to EVs.
I'm not saying the dealers shouldn't have done a better job (like the loan officers should have done a better job on variable rate mortgages leading up to the housing crash). I'm saying that ultimately it's the buyers fault if they didn't educate themselves about what they are getting into. Those two are not either/or -- they can be both.

I'm also guessing these are not people who simply didn't anticipate the need for a 240V plug and were only planning on 120V charging. Fixing that problem is probably cheaper (probably ~$1000 in most cases) than selling or trading in a new car. I'm guessing these are people who didn't anticipate the need to charge at home at all or had other forms of buyers' remorse.
 

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People don't think things through. I assume most people don't understand the shortcomings of the electric vehicles that are available today and make decisions on the glitzy marketing. If I try to separate what I've read on GMI vs. just what I'd see "on the street", I don't think I'd have a clue that 3rd party chargers cost a fortune and charging on a regular home plug will take forever. Pretty big "oops"!

Side note, I was thinking through the high electric rates using the 3rd party chargers - in CT there is a commercial electric rate and a residential one (which I assume is the same for all states), I believer the commercial rate is a lot more $$, I bet that is part of the higher amount charged at a 3rd party charging station.


People don't think things through. They don't think thru their various scenarios in their daily life. They don't do the math. They don't run thru the calculus of owning an EV.
They also don't think to rework the way they drive or how they drive and how they should charge.

People will drive their 200-300 miles a week and then expect to "fill up" somewhere. Not knowing where to charge. Or charging speeds. Or not installing something in their homes, despite all automakers suggesting you do so. Etc etc etc.

That's just entitled and faulty expectations on the part of the EV buyer.
Why would you buy something without fully understanding the needs of product ownership?

I have use cases in my daily driving where I need 250 mile range, fully usable. Minimum. My weekend trip to Napa resulted in a 20 minute detour last nite due to some "police incident" on my way back home. Looking at the mileage, that would have put me at ~ 238 miles in a day. If I was in an EV and couldn't find a place to charge, that was a "too close for comfort" zone, stuck in traffic. I need a 300 mile range. Or closer to it.
 

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Sorry, I don't subscribe to the "victim" mentality. This is like the folks who signed up for variable rate mortgages without knowing the rate will change. People need to educate themselves on what they are getting, especially for a major purchase. I mean, what did they expect? Plug into a USB port for 15 min and the car will be charged?
Caveat Emptor.

People are inherently stupid and/or entitled. Go to any of the EV websites, it's pretty self explanatory what you need to charge at home.
 

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Caveat Emptor.

People are inherently stupid and/or entitled. Go to any of the EV websites, it's pretty self explanatory what you need to charge at home.
Though I will add that part of it are unscrupulous corporations and salesmen failing to explain shortcomings or future "watch outs". I'm all for owning your actions, but, at the same time, products get pushed onto people that don't belong in them, such as the variable rate mortgages. Sadly, I have a couple of friends that simply don't understand stuff like that and are at the complete mercy of the mortgage broker, a good one will see the lack of understanding and put those people in a safe fixed rate loan.
 

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People don't think things through. They don't think thru their various scenarios in their daily life. They don't do the math. They don't run thru the calculus of owning an EV.
They also don't think to rework the way they drive or how they drive and how they should charge.

People will drive their 200-300 miles a week and then expect to "fill up" somewhere. Not knowing where to charge. Or charging speeds. Or not installing something in their homes, despite all automakers suggesting you do so. Etc etc etc.

That's just entitled and faulty expectations on the part of the EV buyer.
Why would you buy something without fully understanding the needs of product ownership?

I have use cases in my daily driving where I need 250 mile range, fully usable. Minimum. My weekend trip to Napa resulted in a 20 minute detour last nite due to some "police incident" on my way back home. Looking at the mileage, that would have put me at ~ 238 miles in a day. If I was in an EV and couldn't find a place to charge, that was a "too close for comfort" zone, stuck in traffic. I need a 300 mile range. Or closer to it.
These plug in hybrids do allow people to be lazy. They let the faux greenies have the green badge on the car, doesn't matter that they never bother to charge it. Pure battery won't let people get away with that. You forget to plug it in at night, you aren't going anywhere or are paying through the nose for a charging network.

I myself would plug it in - if I buy something I use it properly. They paid a premium for that hybrid drivetrain, use it! But, then again, how many people buy sports cars and never wind them out or just stare at them in their garage? Is this really any different? They have their image car...
 

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Though I will add that part of it are unscrupulous corporations and salesmen failing to explain shortcomings or future "watch outs". I'm all for owning your actions, but, at the same time, products get pushed onto people that don't belong in them, such as the variable rate mortgages. Sadly, I have a couple of friends that simply don't understand stuff like that and are at the complete mercy of the mortgage broker, a good one will see the lack of understanding and put those people in a safe fixed rate loan.
People shouldn't do anything or purchase anything they don't fully understand.
We now live in a country where people want to believe their own "facts."

"I can charge overnight because I have an outlet in my garage" doesn't mean you can get a full charge, especially when EV car makers make it pretty damn clear what you need to charge at home and anywhere else:



As for the variable rate mortgage? I was offered that when I bought my house. I read the paperwork. I did the math. It made no sense to me financially in the long run.
I mean, should companies and mortgage brokers and similar be more straight forward? Sure. But the information is right there on the website and on the paperwork. I don't know how you can be any more clear than that.

Sometimes, you just can't fix stupid.
 

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These plug in hybrids do allow people to be lazy. They let the faux greenies have the green badge on the car, doesn't matter that they never bother to charge it. Pure battery won't let people get away with that. You forget to plug it in at night, you aren't going anywhere or are paying through the nose for a charging network.

I myself would plug it in - if I buy something I use it properly. They paid a premium for that hybrid drivetrain, use it! But, then again, how many people buy sports cars and never wind them out or just stare at them in their garage? Is this really any different? They have their image car...

These PHEVS have a 18-30 mile range. That's what they're made for. It's right there on their respective product webpages.
If people are too lazy or "forget" to charge, then that's on them.

I like the idea of the PHEV because it's a nice bridge product for my urban driving and my longer weekend getaways.
 

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Discussion Starter · #37 ·
Sorry, I don't subscribe to the "victim" mentality. This is like the folks who signed up for variable rate mortgages without knowing the rate will change. People need to educate themselves on what they are getting, especially for a major purchase. I mean, what did they expect? Plug into a USB port for 15 min and the car will be charged?
Yes, that is what they expected. Like plugging in their phones overnight. Easy peezey.

Do you really think the salesperson offered up all the information people needed to know prior to their purchase? Or do you think they glossed over the details to make the sale?

Most people treat a car as an appliance and don't put in all the effort to "understand" it. They just expect to plug it in and it should work. Yes, many people are ignorant and this is going to become part of the problem while transitioning to EVs.
Heck, all my other electric stuff works like a charm! Toaster. Just put the toast down! Refrigerator. Just plug it in! Phone. Charges overnight. Flashlight. Charges in hours.

This is our convenience society. Less effort, more rewards.

I'd like to see a deeper study of why these folks dumped their lektriks. I would personally consider a hybrid, but probably not a pure electric.
 

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People shouldn't do anything or purchase anything they don't fully understand.
We now live in a country where people want to believe their own "facts."

"I can charge overnight because I have an outlet in my garage" doesn't mean you can get a full charge, especially when EV car makers make it pretty damn clear what you need to charge at home and anywhere else:



As for the variable rate mortgage? I was offered that when I bought my house. I read the paperwork. I did the math. It made no sense to me financially in the long run.
I mean, should companies and mortgage brokers and similar be more straight forward? Sure. But the information is right there on the website and on the paperwork. I don't know how you can be any more clear than that.

Sometimes, you just can't fix stupid.
I didn't say my friends were smart :D :D :D
 

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I didn't say my friends were smart :D :D :D

I know a number of people with the ARM. All eventually refinanced to a fixed-rate.
All were also more capable of withstanding the rate adjustment for a period of time as well. (Gotta love Silicon Valley RSUs.)

But that's the thing right? People won't read or not fully understand what it means, even if the piece of paper is right there in front of you. They see 0% or some other attractive number and "fall for it." Often times, it's not even in the fine print either. It's the next line down.

You can't fix stupid. But you can certainly sue and feign ignorance.
 

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2012-18 Model PEVs Survey taken 2016-2019.

1 and 10 Tesla owners defected back to gas.

Most defected car Fiat 500e (84 miles of EPA range) which was leased in California for $59/month.

Much better electric vehicles now with much better charging network.
 
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