2016 Chevrolet SS Sedan: The New Benchmark Sport Sedan

NeverEnough · May 25, 2016

sfbreh said:
Tone said:

I imagine the M5's buyer profile want a luxury sedan that also goes fast as opposed to a focused sports car that happens to have four doors.

Click to expand...

That's all I want. Handling is pretty low on my list of priorities.

1) stylish exterior
2) speed
3) AWD
4) spacious interior
5) luxury accoutrements
6) stylish interior
7) room for my bug collection
8) room for my Beanie Babies
9) precise handling

Precise handling comes after my bug collection and Beanie Babies. Let that sink in.

It's actually disgusting to think that any car enthusiast would rate their needs like that.

Envoy4Life · May 25, 2016

NeverEnough said:
It's actually disgusting to think that any car enthusiast would rate their needs like that.

For most people, Straight line speed > Handling prowess.

I completely agree with him. I'm going to floor the accelerator a lot more often than I'm going to carve a canyon.

Tone · May 25, 2016

NeverEnough said:
It's actually disgusting to think that any car enthusiast would rate their needs like that.

Car enthusiasts can like something other than sports cars. While my tastes run towards small, light and balanced, the world would be a boring place if the only options were Camrys and Miatas!

paul8488 · May 25, 2016

Interesting thread. And it's obvious that there's a huge gap between 'precise handling' and 'handling like a Chevy Express', so having handling low on your priorities list doesn't mean you want a poor handling car. This notion that Mercedes (or any luxury player) is making couches on wheels is silly.

goatgary · May 25, 2016

steve333 said:
If they really wanted to sell them they would change out that hideous front end and call it the Chevy Caprice, Chevelle or Nova.
It could be Chevy's halo car.

So you would have it look more insipid, non-descript and invisible than it already is? Figures. For the definition of "hideous" see almost any Lexus model.

Jesda · May 25, 2016

SAngelo said:
I haven't read all of the comments in the thread but does everyone realize this car is on the old heavy Zeta rwd platform that is going away ? The question is will this car move to the Alpha platform and essentially be a four door Camaro ?

It seems inevitable that GM would offer a four-door Alpha sport sedan to Buick and Chevrolet, especially considering the need to spread platform development costs among more products.

Tone said:
Car enthusiasts can like something other than sports cars. While my tastes run towards small, light and balanced, the world would be a boring place if the only options were Camrys and Miatas!

Indeed, though the latter would satisfy 90% of my requirements.

sfbreh · May 25, 2016

MonaroSS said:

Can't get over the ovoid DLO or the rear quarter kink. Too old mannish. Otherwise looks pretty good.

NeverEnough said:
It's actually disgusting to think that any car enthusiast would rate their needs like that.

Get outta here. I spend $50k+ on a car, I have needs that begin with speed and end with comfort. How a car handles is at the absolute bottom of the list.

Tone said:
Car enthusiasts can like something other than sports cars. While my tastes run towards small, light and balanced, the world would be a boring place if the only options were Camrys and Miatas!

I sat in a Miata, figured what the hell. OY. Tiny, not worth anywhere near $30k.

My ideal car: midsize coupe, 4-6s 0-60, attractive.

Envoy4Life said:
For most people, Straight line speed > Handling prowess.

I completely agree with him. I'm going to floor the accelerator a lot more often than I'm going to carve a canyon.

You're never going to. Nobody ever is. For all commercials depicting people doing so (ATS vs the world), the creative teams need to be publicly executed.

It's not 1995, it's not 1975, it's not anywhere in between. Handling prowess is a DYING niche feature.

Envoy4Life · May 25, 2016

sfbreh said:
You're never going to. Nobody ever is. For all commercials depicting people doing so (ATS vs the world), the creative teams need to be publicly executed.

It's not 1995, it's not 1975, it's not anywhere in between. Handling prowess is a DYING niche feature.

Right?

Like, what am I going to carve with razor sharp handling in Michigan? Potholes?

sfbreh · May 25, 2016

Envoy4Life said:
Right?

Like, what am I going to carve with razor sharp handling in Michigan? Potholes?

You've inspired me:

ZIP ZOOP WATCH THE POOP
A PILL IN YOUR DRINK, A BILL IN YOUR CHUTE

-a tribute to Bill Cosby

My point is that you need to be DODGING potholes, so precise handling is probably more necessary than you think. /s

In all seriousness, I've cracked at least one rim because I hit a crater with my Audi.

paul8488 · May 25, 2016

And for those of us that DO find tight corners and switchbacks to carve, I'd argue that a poor-handling car is more entertaining to drive. Give me a crap car you need to wrestle through a corner in the hopes of not dying over a finely-honed skidpad machine any day... not knowing if you'll survive the next corner is the best thrill I can think of behind the wheel.

Envoy4Life · May 26, 2016

sfbreh said:
You've inspired me:

ZIP ZOOP WATCH THE POOP
A PILL IN YOUR DRINK, A BILL IN YOUR CHUTE

-a tribute to Bill Cosby

My point is that you need to be DODGING potholes, so precise handling is probably more necessary than you think. /s

In all seriousness, I've cracked at least one rim because I hit a crater with my Audi.

Lol!

My ATS has already gone through three tires. I actually lost one recently on 4/20, and of course I had a huge presentation I had to do that morning that I was late for as a result...

chinamonty · May 26, 2016

ponchoman49 said:
I would love to see a next generation version of this car with the award winning Alpha chassis, more expressive and less bland styling, a real name sitting behind those two letters and a less expensive V6 model in the 32K starting range. The new LT1 engine would be the icing on the cake along with some additional interior colors.

I find it funny that the people on SS forum are often saying how much people like the look of their cars. maybe it is bland but likable. There was absolutely no reason why the US couldn't have had a V6 version of the SS as it is made here as the Commodore. GM just didn't think it fitted in with their plans. If they continue with a vehicle called just SS then they should stop using SS as a package designator on Camaro.

Tone · May 26, 2016

handling is more than just loads of lateral grip (and the rubber band tires that deliver it). A fine handling car with talkative steering, easily modulated brakes, good balance and proper damping can be a ton of fun to run at 8/10 on the street, even on tires that can take a pothole or deal with actual weather. That's why so many enthusiast wax poetic about the Miata and older BMWs. They are actually fun to drive on real roads at speeds you might actually see without going immediately to jail.

That all said, people like me clearly ARE a niche -- even BMW seems to think so!

Ironically, Cadillac seems to be building cars to appeal to people like me. But on my list, great handling ranks high as does design. Luxury, on the other hand is way below the beanie babies for me. My ideal Miata would be the sports stuff only -- all fun, no frills. Clearly, I ain't no Caddy buyer!

BBDOS CV8 · May 26, 2016

b4z said:
I'm not understanding Sal's disappointment. M5 was $70k brand new in 2001 and the SS is $53k in 2016. m5s are over $100k now. It doesn't have anything to do with Chevy building a 2001 E39 in 2016( not that that's a bad thing) its that's its building a better car that will be way cheaper to own for $20k less 15 years later.

Even back then, HSV had an answer for the M5.
http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/holden-hsv-gts-r-300-vs-bmw-m5-comparison-tests

Considering the humble origins of the Holden Commodore, and the complete boltin nature of it's transformation into a HSV, it's more remarkable it's even on the same page, let alone seriously contended and knocked the BM off in enough categories for Car and Driver to consider a win for it.

I think there's about 300 total HSV GTS or SV300s with the Callaway C4s made - the total budget for this model including making all of them is probably less than BMW spent on the wheels and brakes of the E39 M5.

On the BMW M5board, someone scanned the old article from Motor Magazine in 2000 where they took a M5 and CL55 AMG to the 'ring, along with a HSV GTS to be used as a backup and camera vehicle. They had a young Mark Skaife (V8 Supercars driver) and a Swedish Rally champ who was head of Toyota Motorsports including F1.

They were amazed to find the GTS which was a Walkinshaw eval car for England, was ten seconds faster then the BM and fifteen seconds faster than the AMG on a wet track. Andersson said the main issue was the German cars, you couldn't shut off the driver aids - the HSV didn't need them even in the wet, and it's Racelogic traction control used a dial to increment it from on to off - his comment was it was much more a driver's car, lighter and even though less powerful plain quicker.

isszy · May 26, 2016

I can't imagine owning a poor handling car. Even my 1974 Holden had uprated springs, shocks and anti roll bars. In fact, I would probably put handling feel slightly higher than the look of a car, in that if there were two cars I liked but one handled like blancmange and the other was awesome but was uglier, I would take the one that could handle.

All my cars handle well, not all of them are fast. I am also much more interested in circuit racing and rallying than I am in drag racing.

BBDOS CV8 · May 26, 2016

isszy said:
I can't imagine owning a poor handling car. Even my 1974 Holden had uprated springs, shocks and anti roll bars. In fact, I would probably put handling feel slightly higher than the look of a car, in that if there were two cars I liked but one handled like blancmange and the other was awesome but was uglier, I would take the one that could handle.

All my cars handle well, not all of them are fast. I am also much more interested in circuit racing and rallying than I am in drag racing.

I remember (when I were a lad) when RTS Holdens came out. Even with sick smog motors, they were a revelation. Holden never looked back, even things like the Gemini were fun to drive.

As a (ahem) former bike racer I like to hang it out, wet or dry. If I can't break the speed limit, at least I can take corners at speed....

I wouldn't own any car that didn't have some modicum of handling. Missus hates me driving her 118 - I bang it straight in sport, so it holds gears in straights and corners and the steering sharpens up nicely. Plus, locking out 7th and 8th and the overrev dropping through the box....

The new SV limited HSVs they've announced are a bit interesting with the 340Kw LS3, especially the track edition - sounds like it's most of the hardware of the GTS as far as brakes without the MRC (which I wouldn't have) and the big brakes with sharper handling. Don't know about not having the HSV buckets, though. I reckon these would be more of a collectors item then the LSAs which are a dime a dozen.

steve333 · May 26, 2016

goatgary said:
So you would have it look more insipid, non-descript and invisible than it already is? Figures. For the definition of "hideous" see almost any Lexus model.

How did what I say even remotely translate to that?
I want it to look at least attractive. That front end looks like it was designed by a blind man

sfbreh · May 26, 2016

paul8488 said:
And for those of us that DO find tight corners and switchbacks to carve, I'd argue that a poor-handling car is more entertaining to drive. Give me a crap car you need to wrestle through a corner in the hopes of not dying over a finely-honed skidpad machine any day... not knowing if you'll survive the next corner is the best thrill I can think of behind the wheel.

Little bit of a stretch.

Envoy4Life said:
Lol!

My ATS has already gone through three tires. I actually lost one recently on 4/20, and of course I had a huge presentation I had to do that morning that I was late for as a result...

Celebrating the Führer's birthday a little too vigorously?

I went through at least two tires until I swapped out the whole set for I wanna say Defenders. Been a long ass time.

paul8488 · May 26, 2016

sfbreh said:
Little bit of a stretch.

Perhaps. But what are all these modern cars that have 'awful' handling?

(General question, not aimed at you, you were clear about where you rank handling.)

VS Ute 5Litre · May 26, 2016

paul8488 said:
Perhaps. But what are all these modern cars that have 'awful' handling?

(General question, not aimed at you, you were clear about where you rank handling.)

IMO just about every front wheel drive car on the market

But mainly the FWD CUV or SUV crowd

They all suck

2016 Chevrolet SS Sedan: The New Benchmark Sport Sedan

NeverEnough

Envoy4Life

Tone

paul8488

goatgary

Jesda

sfbreh

Envoy4Life

sfbreh

paul8488

Envoy4Life

chinamonty

Tone

BBDOS CV8

isszy

BBDOS CV8

steve333

sfbreh

paul8488

VS Ute 5Litre

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