EnerDel to deliver Li-Ion batteries to PHEV manufacturers for $1,500

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Thread: EnerDel to deliver Li-Ion batteries to PHEV manufacturers for $1,500

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    EnerDel to deliver Li-Ion batteries to PHEV manufacturers for $1,500

    Boy, if Toyota didn't think it had a problem before...

    Start-up promises to slash the costs of plug-in hybrids

    EnerDel says it will come out with a lithium-ion battery for plug-in hybrids that will cost $1,500, a development that could go a long way to making these cars palatable in terms of price.

    The Indianapolis-based company, which recently received a $6.5 million grant from the United States Advanced Battery Consortium (USABC), hopes to deliver the battery to car manufacturers for their 2010 lineups, according to Charles Gassenheimer, vice chairman of the company. The 2010 model cars will start coming out in September 2009, he said.

    ...

    EnerDel will mostly aim at selling batteries to manufacturers to incorporate into cars coming off the line and not aftermarket modifiers.

    How much cheaper will an EnerDel-energized plug-in hybrid be compared to a regular one? It's hard to say. Gassenheimer, though, asserts that the company's batteries will cost half as much or less as nickel-metal hydride batteries, which are used in some plug-in retrofits these days. The price the company is quoting is fairly cheap. The National Renewable Energy Lab has put out reports estimating that the battery price should be able to come down to $2,500 or more. So if EnerDel could hit its goal--and it's an if--it could help. The grant will be used to drive costs down further.

    ...

    The battery is a lithium titanate battery. Competitor Altair Nanotechnologies uses a similar chemistry. Meanwhile, A123 Systems, which has received millions in venture funds, builds a lithium potassium battery. Gassenheimer stated that his company's lithium titanate batteries run at lower temperatures than potassium ones and thus are more safe. Lower operating temperatures also mean that car manufacturers won't have to include additional cooling systems for the battery alone. (Notebooks use lithium cobalt batteries, which run hotter.)

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    Re: EnerDel to deliver Li-Ion batteries to PHEV manufacturers for $1,500

    I don't know about your Toyota statement. Is EnerDel tied in with any specific manufacturer, or will they sell to everyone?

    Also, a technical question: EnerDel claims these batteries run cooler than A123's... does that mean they are more efficient (i.e. less waste heat)?

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    Re: EnerDel to deliver Li-Ion batteries to PHEV manufacturers for $1,500

    Quote Originally Posted by ronald mcretard
    I don't know about your Toyota statement. Is EnerDel tied in with any specific manufacturer, or will they sell to everyone?
    EnerDel received a huge grant from the U.S. Department of Energy to do work for the US Advanced Battery Consortium, which consist of the Big 3. That is who gets EnerDel's work product. http://www.uscar.org/guest/article_v...rticles_id=175

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    Re: EnerDel to deliver Li-Ion batteries to PHEV manufacturers for $1,500

    The domestics should buy major stakes in all these companies preventing Toyota from getting their hands on all this upcoming battery technology.

    Now's no time to be nice. This is business and when you're down, you have to play a different kind of game.

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    Re: EnerDel to deliver Li-Ion batteries to PHEV manufacturers for $1,500

    Great news. So will GM decide which company to buy batteries from in mid '08 for the production Volt or do they already have a contract with A123?

    Wow, a cheaper battery means a cheaper Volt(hopefully).

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    Re: EnerDel to deliver Li-Ion batteries to PHEV manufacturers for $1,500

    Quote Originally Posted by guitarlix
    The domestics should buy major stakes in all these companies preventing Toyota from getting their hands on all this upcoming battery technology.

    Now's no time to be nice. This is business and when you're down, you have to play a different kind of game.
    Why not?

    Under the appropriate conditions, Toyota should be provided full access to all the batteries produced by the Advanced Battery Consortium.

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    Re: EnerDel to deliver Li-Ion batteries to PHEV manufacturers for $1,500

    See GM should keep their mouths shut because now everyone will match there 2010 date. They will no longer make a splash it will be more like they will be one of many. The only thing now is that they move it up a year but that will never happen.
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    Re: EnerDel to deliver Li-Ion batteries to PHEV manufacturers for $1,500

    Under the appropriate conditions, Toyota should be provided full access to all the batteries produced by the Advanced Battery Consortium.
    Absolutely not.
    They chose to use their Japanese suppliers of their own free will.
    See GM should keep their mouths shut because now everyone will match there 2010 date.
    Now there's a pipe dream. 2010 is only 26 months away... a blink of an eye in engineering terms.

    GM can talk because they have patents and signed agreements. Other people can't just use this stuff unless they want a beatdown in court.
    Last edited by eaton53; 09-29-2007 at 01:02 PM.
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    Re: EnerDel to deliver Li-Ion batteries to PHEV manufacturers for $1,500

    Quote Originally Posted by plane
    Why not?

    Under the appropriate conditions, Toyota should be provided full access to all the batteries produced by the Advanced Battery Consortium.
    Are you insane, or just a traitor? The USABC is an American taxpayer funded group. There is no way in hell Toyota should be given any access to American cutting edge technology!

    What's next? Under appropriate conditions, Iran should be provuded full access to our nuclear power plants?

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    Re: EnerDel to deliver Li-Ion batteries to PHEV manufacturers for $1,500

    Quote Originally Posted by plane
    Why not?

    Under the appropriate conditions, Toyota should be provided full access to all the batteries produced by the Advanced Battery Consortium.
    Just because the liars from Japan have managed to buy off any and every political power in the United States yeah maybe they should be able to steal even more technology and then take total credit for everything.

    Do they want any of the technology they have at home shared here? Heck no. What goes around comes around.

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    Re: EnerDel to deliver Li-Ion batteries to PHEV manufacturers for $1,500

    Quote Originally Posted by HoosierRon
    Are you insane, or just a traitor? The USABC is an American taxpayer funded group. There is no way in hell Toyota should be given any access to American cutting edge technology!

    What's next? Under appropriate conditions, Iran should be provided full access to our nuclear power plants?

    Toyota is a G.M. partner as is Suzuki.
    As long as ABC and GM intellectual property is sufficiently protected.
    And a long-term supply contract is signed by Toyota.
    I would have absolutely no qualms about exporting Volts from Hammatrack in 2010.
    Japan is one of our staunchest allies and should be given the opportunity to experience and use high quality North American products.

    And of course, it's the environmentally responsible thing to do.

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    Re: EnerDel to deliver Li-Ion batteries to PHEV manufacturers for $1,500

    Quote Originally Posted by plane
    Toyota is a G.M. partner as is Suzuki.
    As long as ABC and GM intellectual property is sufficiently protected.
    And a long-term supply contract is signed by Toyota.
    I would have absolutely no qualms about exporting Volts from Hammatrack in 2010.
    Japan is one of our staunchest allies and should be given the opportunity to experience and use high quality North American products.

    And of course, it's the environmentally responsible thing to do.
    If the Japanese want a Volt they can buy one from GM just like everyone else.
    And of course, it's the environmentally responsible thing to do.
    Same answer as above, except substitute "the environmentally responsible" for "the Japanese".
    Toyota can pack sand.
    The 2010 model cars will start coming out in September 2009, he said.
    Anyone else notice this line? Yowza!!!... now it's only 23 months.
    Last edited by eaton53; 09-29-2007 at 02:19 PM.
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    Re: EnerDel to deliver Li-Ion batteries to PHEV manufacturers for $1,500

    plane^^^ ya they are our Ally. And also our Biggest Auto competitor. Our technologies should not be given to them freely. If they want to reverse engineer it, fine. The point of our argument is to keep Toyota behind Gm in terms of technology, so that GM can be the leader and help our country with jobs, money, etc...
    Last edited by Bvonscott; 09-29-2007 at 03:04 PM.
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    Re: EnerDel to deliver Li-Ion batteries to PHEV manufacturers for $1,500

    Why not? Under the appropriate conditions, Toyota should be provided full access to all the batteries produced by the Advanced Battery Consortium.
    Why not? Because GM and other companies that manufacture anything do not have the same access to the Japanese market as they do to ours. Until that changes I say HELL NO!
    Last edited by PRO_USA1776; 09-29-2007 at 07:05 PM.
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    Re: EnerDel to deliver Li-Ion batteries to PHEV manufacturers for $1,500

    Quote Originally Posted by eaton53
    If the Japanese want a Volt they can buy one from GM just like everyone else.
    GM competes in China with only minority stakes in Chinese joint-ventures.
    GM sells virtually no automobiles in Japan.
    Since the Toyota Cavalier was perhaps the most widely discussed example of GM exports to Japan, I would guess that Japanese esteem of GM products is pretty much in the toilet.

    If GM can go it alone in Japan, great. But it doesn't seem like that is how business is played by Japan Inc.

    And if a joint venture is required, why shouldn't GM be able to not only hold on to the battery technology, but use the Toyota or Suzuki as a means to significantly penetrate the Japanese market, expand domestic exports, and actually bring a "balance of trade"?

    And if the Volt was not allowed into Japan? Imagine the hue and cry and negative perceptions North American consumers would have upon realizing that trade with Japan will only ever be one-sided?
    Last edited by plane; 09-29-2007 at 03:22 PM.

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