Is CTP Responsible for Retail Increases?

  1. Welcome to GM Inside News Forum – General discussion forum for GM

    Welcome to GM Inside News Forum - a website dedicated to all things GM.

    You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, at no cost, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, Join GM Inside News Forum today!
     
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 18

Thread: Is CTP Responsible for Retail Increases?

  1. #1
    News Editor Premium Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    Toronto, Ontario
    Posts
    1,602
    Thanks
    1,179
    Thanked 1,851 Times in 734 Posts

    Is CTP Responsible for Retail Increases?



    It’s a party line from the General we’ve all come to know well, “reduce fleet sales to rental companies because retail is more profitable.”

    But as Mrs. Mary sings the virtues of the strategy, it would seem some share is more equal than others.

    “Our rental reduction strategy is clearly divergent from our key competitors,” Kurt McNeil, GM’s vice president of sales operations said to Automotive News “It’s playing a critical role in our efforts to strengthen our brands, improve our residual values and build the fundamental health of our business.”

    When May numbers dropped last week, GM said retail share is up more than 1 percent through May and that retail share had risen 0.6 percentage points. GM called it “the largest retail share increase of any full-line automaker.”

    But according to some dealers, it’s all just a surface dance.
    continued on the homepage
    GMI News Editor

  2. The Following User Says Thank You to GM Insider News For This Useful Post:

    Ed753 (06-08-2016)

  3. Remove Advertisements
    GM Inside News
    Advertisements
     

  4. #2
    R2-D2 Astromech Droid bballr4567's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Evansville, IN
    Posts
    17,793
    Thanks
    2,211
    Thanked 4,751 Times in 2,674 Posts
    My Ride
    2020 Pacifica Touring L Plus

    Re: Is CTP Responsible for Retail Increases?

    Every single car maker does this. Every one. The BMW dealer in town has at least 10 different "courtesy transportation vehicle" stickers on the back of the cars.

    The telling part is there are no numbers on how many CTP vehicles are allowed at each dealer each month.

    Personally, I HATE HATE HATE the old way of doing it through a rental company. Hate it. Hate. We took the Flex in for a recall and got stuck in a 2009 HHR that was beat to high hell.

  5. The Following User Says Thank You to bballr4567 For This Useful Post:

    AMERICA 123 (06-09-2016)

  6. #3
    News Editor Premium Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    Toronto, Ontario
    Posts
    1,602
    Thanks
    1,179
    Thanked 1,851 Times in 734 Posts

    Re: Is CTP Responsible for Retail Increases?

    Quote Originally Posted by bballr4567 View Post
    Every single car maker does this. Every one. The BMW dealer in town has at least 10 different "courtesy transportation vehicle" stickers on the back of the cars.

    The telling part is there are no numbers on how many CTP vehicles are allowed at each dealer each month.

    Personally, I HATE HATE HATE the old way of doing it through a rental company. Hate it. Hate. We took the Flex in for a recall and got stuck in a 2009 HHR that was beat to high hell.
    Indeed, not saying GM is the only one who does this.

    From what I understand GM allows 50 at any given time, but unclear if there is a cap to how many they can churn in and out each month...
    GMI News Editor

  7. The Following User Says Thank You to GM Insider News For This Useful Post:

    Ed753 (06-08-2016)

  8. Remove Advertisements
    GM Inside News
    Advertisements
     

  9. #4
    Corvette C7 AMERICA 123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    15,633
    Thanks
    7,955
    Thanked 1,575 Times in 1,094 Posts
    My Ride
    The Toyota Rat Catcher

    Re: Is CTP Responsible for Retail Increases?

    Geez..... Retail May and future prospects must have been and look to be worse than realized... very likely @ Toyota ( who has made an art form out of this sort of thing - and more, including with the Ports ( both sides ) and Boats 'in transit', and Ford.

    Good on GM for correcting this out.

    What a cheap shot btw, on the Vehicles On Hold from the parts disruptions via the mid April Quake in Japan.

    Toyota claimed the same ironically, so for these sources obviously it must be so.

    Evidently, those On Hold and their future Retail Prospects are a big part of why 'somebody' is all bent.

    --

    Definitely got some strong Spin Doc presence in the comments.

    Why do we not rate the same quality / quality of effort for ours here ?

    Seriously
    Last edited by AMERICA 123; 06-08-2016 at 03:09 PM.
    "From tech stocks to high gas prices, Goldman Sachs has engineered every major market manipulation since the Great Depression — and they're about to do it again."
    "The world's most powerful investment bank is a great vampire squid wrapped around the face of humanity, relentlessly jamming its blood funnel into anything that smells like money."
    "If America is circling the drain, Goldman Sachs has found a way to be that drain — " Matt Taibbi

  10. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to AMERICA 123 For This Useful Post:

    inrick1 (06-08-2016),SierraGS (06-08-2016)

  11. #5
    R2-D2 Astromech Droid bballr4567's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Evansville, IN
    Posts
    17,793
    Thanks
    2,211
    Thanked 4,751 Times in 2,674 Posts
    My Ride
    2020 Pacifica Touring L Plus

    Re: Is CTP Responsible for Retail Increases?

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Accardi View Post
    Indeed, not saying GM is the only one who does this.

    From what I understand GM allows 50 at any given time, but unclear if there is a cap to how many they can churn in and out each month...
    The cars and trucks stay in the rental fleet for either 90 days or 7,500 miles, whichever comes first. Dealers can provide the cars to service customers or loan them out for test drives of up to three days. Or they can rent them to customers who want to drive them longer.
    So, if they allow 50 at most (which seems kind of high for most dealers) then that would allow around 17 units a month if you go by the 90 days.

  12. #6
    R2-D2 Astromech Droid Ed753's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    19,540
    Thanks
    12,929
    Thanked 8,812 Times in 5,145 Posts
    My Ride
    2018 GMC Sierra Crew 6 1/2'

    Re: Is CTP Responsible for Retail Increases?

    Quote Originally Posted by bballr4567 View Post
    So, if they allow 50 at most (which seems kind of high for most dealers) then that would allow around 17 units a month if you go by the 90 days.
    How many GM dealers? 3,000 would give you 51,000. I don't think they flush them through that fast, but I know GM adds in sweeteners when they need some volume.


    Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App
    Current: Hidden Content Hidden Content

    Past: '17 Cruze; '15 F150; '14 Volt; '13 MKX; '13 Silverado; '13 Fusion; '11 Ram; '10 Commander; '08 Sierra; '07 Rendezvous; '05 Ram; '04 Grand Cherokee; '03 F150; '01 Silverado; '00 Jimmy; '99 Sierra; '97 Ram; '96 Mustang GT; '96 Jimmy; '90 Escort GT; '89 Ranger; '84 Omni; '76 Malibu; '78 LeMans; '85 Escort; '82 Lynx; '75 Sierra

  13. #7
    7.0 Liter LS7 V8 AMcA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    4,850
    Thanks
    200
    Thanked 540 Times in 296 Posts

    Re: Is CTP Responsible for Retail Increases?

    Quote Originally Posted by bballr4567 View Post
    Every single car maker does this. Every one. The BMW dealer in town has at least 10 different "courtesy transportation vehicle" stickers on the back of the cars.

    The telling part is there are no numbers on how many CTP vehicles are allowed at each dealer each month.

    Personally, I HATE HATE HATE the old way of doing it through a rental company. Hate it. Hate. We took the Flex in for a recall and got stuck in a 2009 HHR that was beat to high hell.
    Recently got an Audi A8 diesel courtesy car. One they couldn't sell. They had shaved off the TDI badges, though.

  14. #8
    6.2 Liter LS9 Supercharged V8 Premium Member Extreme4x4's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Payson, AZ
    Posts
    6,218
    Thanks
    6,216
    Thanked 3,031 Times in 1,303 Posts
    My Ride
    2013 Ford Explorer Sport

    Re: Is CTP Responsible for Retail Increases?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed753 View Post
    How many GM dealers? 3,000 would give you 51,000. I don't think they flush them through that fast, but I know GM adds in sweeteners when they need some volume.


    Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App
    Since they keep them for up to 90 days, I guess we can be optimistic and figure an extra 17,000 retail sales per month possible.

    That will sure jack up your retail numbers nicely.

    The funny thing is, some folks think that some companies are so dishonest with their numbers, and others are nothing but honest. In reality, they all play some games, and the ones we think are the worst probably are not, and the opposite is probably also true.
    The resident "girl"

  15. #9
    R2-D2 Astromech Droid Ed753's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    19,540
    Thanks
    12,929
    Thanked 8,812 Times in 5,145 Posts
    My Ride
    2018 GMC Sierra Crew 6 1/2'

    Re: Is CTP Responsible for Retail Increases?

    Quote Originally Posted by Extreme4x4 View Post
    Since they keep them for up to 90 days, I guess we can be optimistic and figure an extra 17,000 retail sales per month possible.

    That will sure jack up your retail numbers nicely.

    The funny thing is, some folks think that some companies are so dishonest with their numbers, and others are nothing but honest. In reality, they all play some games, and the ones we think are the worst probably are not, and the opposite is probably also true.
    I don't think they run 50K a month through the program, but with 50 per dealer and 3,000 dealerships (I have no idea how many dealers GM has) that is 150,000 car possible in the program, so a 1/3 coming out every month could be +/-50K a month............ (again I don't think it is anywhere near that high)
    Current: Hidden Content Hidden Content

    Past: '17 Cruze; '15 F150; '14 Volt; '13 MKX; '13 Silverado; '13 Fusion; '11 Ram; '10 Commander; '08 Sierra; '07 Rendezvous; '05 Ram; '04 Grand Cherokee; '03 F150; '01 Silverado; '00 Jimmy; '99 Sierra; '97 Ram; '96 Mustang GT; '96 Jimmy; '90 Escort GT; '89 Ranger; '84 Omni; '76 Malibu; '78 LeMans; '85 Escort; '82 Lynx; '75 Sierra

  16. #10
    1.8 Liter ECOTEC
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    49
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 42 Times in 17 Posts

    Re: Is CTP Responsible for Retail Increases?

    Quote Originally Posted by bballr4567 View Post
    So, if they allow 50 at most (which seems kind of high for most dealers) then that would allow around 17 units a month if you go by the 90 days.
    This is not an accurate description of the program. First, depending on sales and service volume a dealer can have a lot more than 50 units in the program. Second, the unit has to have at least 2000 miles and be 90 days in service or at least 3000 miles and it doesn't matter how many days to come out of service.

    So if you can run up miles quickly, you can rotate the units more often.

  17. #11
    R2-D2 Astromech Droid Premium Member paul8488's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Shanghai, China
    Posts
    23,621
    Thanks
    4,145
    Thanked 4,186 Times in 2,403 Posts
    My Ride
    1983 Opel Corsa TR coupe

    Re: Is CTP Responsible for Retail Increases?

    Sales down for a mass-market auto manufacturer needs to be counteracted with big big price increases. Is that happening at GM?
    Automotive stories and pictures for the rest of us:

    Hidden Content

  18. #12
    R2-D2 Astromech Droid Ed753's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    19,540
    Thanks
    12,929
    Thanked 8,812 Times in 5,145 Posts
    My Ride
    2018 GMC Sierra Crew 6 1/2'

    Re: Is CTP Responsible for Retail Increases?

    Quote Originally Posted by Oscuro View Post
    Is GM the most criticized automaker on this forum for having identical practices utilized by all other automakers or am I in some sort of dream land?

    Furthermore, is a great deal of this criticism thrown out at GM because it has reduced fleet sales to a point of its demise or that they have gotten to a point of retail autonomy, no longer dependent on fleet to move metal and fulfilling a promise made to shareholders years ago of maximized profits, higher average transaction prices, and realized margins per vehicle of +12% (gross) consistently?

    What I have seen in the last year is GM expanding profit margins per vehicle considerably, while at the same time pushing out more and more advanced architectures that allow for same or more vehicles with less in the number of platforms. In Q4 of 2015, GM is on record as expanding its gross profit margin to 16.7% from 14.1% in Q4 of 2014. Net profit margins to 6.4% vs 2.5% in 2014 (possibly due to the recall issue). I would think that this progress would be looked upon favorably, especially considering the fact that its closest foreign rival, Toyota, yields higher profit margins by taking advantage of, unavailable to Detroit makers, currency manipulation, labor rates and legacy costs factors and not really doing anything to advance their vehicles beyond what they have done since 2006. See Camry, LS460, or even Prius for proof.
    You are missing the point; GM sells a car "to the dealership" and it is booked as a retail sale, the car gets used for service loaner/rental. Ford sells a car to Enterprise it gets booked as a fleet/rental sale and it get used for a service loaner/rental.

    The only difference is in the bucket each sale is reported. (retail vs. rental)




    Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App
    Current: Hidden Content Hidden Content

    Past: '17 Cruze; '15 F150; '14 Volt; '13 MKX; '13 Silverado; '13 Fusion; '11 Ram; '10 Commander; '08 Sierra; '07 Rendezvous; '05 Ram; '04 Grand Cherokee; '03 F150; '01 Silverado; '00 Jimmy; '99 Sierra; '97 Ram; '96 Mustang GT; '96 Jimmy; '90 Escort GT; '89 Ranger; '84 Omni; '76 Malibu; '78 LeMans; '85 Escort; '82 Lynx; '75 Sierra

  19. #13
    6.2 Liter LS9 Supercharged V8 Premium Member Extreme4x4's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Payson, AZ
    Posts
    6,218
    Thanks
    6,216
    Thanked 3,031 Times in 1,303 Posts
    My Ride
    2013 Ford Explorer Sport

    Re: Is CTP Responsible for Retail Increases?

    You forgot to add................... this is then looked at as Ford stupid and GM smart................. when they are doing the exact same thing.
    The resident "girl"

  20. #14
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Posts
    4
    Thanks
    5
    Thanked 46 Times in 16 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by paul8488 View Post
    Sales down for a mass-market auto manufacturer needs to be counteracted with big big price increases. Is that happening at GM?
    Yes. Gm pricing may just be some of the highest for each segment. Look at the Camaro

  21. #15
    6.2 Liter LS9 Supercharged V8 Jesda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    THE D
    Posts
    6,093
    Thanks
    1,262
    Thanked 1,516 Times in 1,159 Posts
    My Ride
    MX5, STS

    Re: Is CTP Responsible for Retail Increases?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed753 View Post
    You are missing the point; GM sells a car "to the dealership" and it is booked as a retail sale, the car gets used for service loaner/rental. Ford sells a car to Enterprise it gets booked as a fleet/rental sale and it get used for a service loaner/rental.

    The only difference is in the bucket each sale is reported. (retail vs. rental)

    Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App
    The difference is the impact on consumer perception which affects resale values and brand image.
    My blog: Hidden Content

  22. Remove Advertisements
    GM Inside News
    Advertisements
     

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v4.1.2