Sonata SE x 2

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Thread: Sonata SE x 2

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    R2-D2 Astromech Droid Premium Member Neanderthal's Avatar
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    Sonata SE x 2

    TIMING CHAIN EDIT: H dealer was incorrect. Both the 2.4 and 2.0t use chains.
    First, to deal with the timing chain/belt issue.
    According to the local Hyundai service department, the 2.4 runs a timing chain and the 2.0t a belt. They said "they're in the process of changing (chainging?) over to a chain" and expect the 2012 2.0t to have timing chains. The only other Hyundai product running a chain at present is the new Elantra 1.8. According to the dealer.

    Not to infringe on bballr, who also wrote up a 2.0T, but I thought I'd write this up separately since I got to drive a pair.
    The first one was a silver SE 2.4. It stickered at $26,530 and had gadgets like sunroof but no dual zone. Weird.
    It's raining and about 40 degrees, but that presented no driving problems, only visibility problems.
    The car is quiet, the steering light. The seat is invisible, i.e. no noticeable lumps or pains so I give it a good-to-go. The brake is a bit touchy, not sure if that's the brakes or the wet but after a couple of blocks it feels OK.
    Both SEs had 18" rubber. The SE 2.4 rides firmly, like the Optima I drove. I don't think the 18s in the Hyundai are any firmer than the 17s in the Kia.

    Funny dash, in that the two-pod has two tiny inner pods (maybe 1 1/2" diameter) inside the tach and speedo, housing the temp and fuel gauges. Not sure I like this, I prefer larger not-so-cute gauges.
    Acceleration is stong and linear. There's no dead zone at the bottom and no drop-off at 6000~. Smooth motor, smooth trannie. It kicks down with no protests, it just does its job.
    At 60 MPH on the busy interstate we're showing around 1900 RPM. The wipers work well, the car shows no squirrely behavior, it's firm and controllable.
    Very little lean, and as with the KIA the ride is firm, firmer than the GXP I brought along as a comparo. Well, that and I didn't feel like walking 10 miles to the dealership.
    Very fine car, it should make a fine daily driver for someone who like to go around corners fast.

    The 2.0t has the same dash, but it had dual zone. I like dual zone, every car should have it. This silver car stickers at $27,790.
    Steering feels a little heavier here, perhaps some artificial weight. Can't tell much difference in the mill. Maybe what sounds like a little induction roar.
    Merging onto the interstate, we get stuck in a truck pod and have to go a few miles, exit, and turn around to clear traffic.
    We stop at the long uphill entrance ramp and let the slugs clear out in front. I nail it from a standing start and the revs climb swiftly to 6000+ and shifts clip off at about 40 and 65, don't recall exactly. The car is smooth and quick, but not overpowering and torquey like the GP GXP. We're up to 75 in no time. A bit of intake roar but no whine or other indicators to me that this motor is anything out of the ordinary.
    RPM at 60 are about 1750. Will have to check, not sure if these cars are geared differently or if one of the tachs is off.
    To accelerate, even slightly, the car kicks down a gear or kicks out of lockup. Not sure which, my guess is kickdown.
    This turbo has an instant MPG gauge. These are of limited use outside of the World of MPG Geeks, IMO. Whatever.
    So...a bit heavier steering, some features differences, but essentially flat-cornering, smooth-running, reasonably quick or pretty quick cars with all the modern amenities.

    I could live with either. More interior space than the GP, a sounder structure, suspensions feel a little firmer, and the cars feel quite a bit more agile/less ponderous than the 3600 lb. Grand Prix.

    The salesman even gave me a special 2011 Hyundai Sonata 2.0T brochure.

    No, there was nothing that could make me buy today.
    Last edited by Neanderthal; 04-19-2011 at 08:21 PM.
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    Firebird Concept (the turbine one) Amphibian's Avatar
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    Re: Sonata SE x 2

    Nice review as you always do. I'm really diggin' the new Sonata/Optima. I think if I could have either it'd be an Optima SX. It's so good looking I'd create some mystery by putting the Korean optional K5 badges on it:


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    R2-D2 Astromech Droid Premium Member Neanderthal's Avatar
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    Re: Sonata SE x 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Amphibian View Post
    Nice review as you always do. I'm really diggin' the new Sonata/Optima. I think if I could have either it'd be an Optima SX. It's so good looking I'd create some mystery by putting the Korean optional K5 badges on it:

    Thankyuhhverruhhmuchh.

    I think I'd take one of the three listed Optimii listed in my Optima test. I prefer the Optima cockpit to the Hyundai. And surprisingly, I really like the pushbutton starter gadget. Addictive.

    Probably
    1. EX turbo
    2. EX
    3. LX with some fancy-pants package that includes dual zone and a backup cam.

    I forgot to mention that I felt no torque steer with either car, and I did run them both WFO up a couple of gears.

    Either the GXP has provided immunity to TS, or these cars just don't have it. That they all had under 100 miles on them might also be a factor. Need some loosening up.
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    Re: Sonata SE x 2

    I still havent driven a 2.4 model but I want to. I want to really see what is different.

    Also, do you think they are "better" than the GP? I found the quality to not be bad at all, just a little off in certain areas, and the ride was pretty good for a family car.

    I wonder if they have changed the calibration of the steering. I certainly felt a lot of torque steer on my drive especially in the middle RPM range only to have it disappear in the higher RPM. Weirdness.

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    Firebird Concept (the turbine one) Amphibian's Avatar
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    Re: Sonata SE x 2

    Quote Originally Posted by bballr4567 View Post
    Also, do you think they are "better" than the GP? I found the quality to not be bad at all, just a little off in certain areas, and the ride was pretty good for a family car.

    I wonder if they have changed the calibration of the steering. I certainly felt a lot of torque steer on my drive especially in the middle RPM range only to have it disappear in the higher RPM. Weirdness.
    I thought I read somewhere that the Kia has revised steering compared to the Sonata, and the SX even more so. Maybe I'm dreamin'.

    I too am interested in his view of comparing an Optima Turbo to the GXP.

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    Re: Sonata SE x 2

    Better than the GP?

    Let me say this. If you hear and feel the doors and trunk slam, if you want a user-friendly control board, if you want a tighter-feeling car, the H/K have it all over our GXP.

    They drive tighter, things slam tighter, and giving general grades for how it feels, I'd defitely pick the Optima and Sonata over the Grand Prix. After all, the W-body is uhhh stone age compared to the newer cars.

    The Poncho 5.3 V8 will surely take the turbo in a drag race, perhaps even on a handling course, but not in the quality control department.

    That said, I'm not one who makes an issue over dashboard grain, or even the styling of the Hyundai vs. the KIA since I find them both attractive swoopy designs.

    I'm a meat and potatos guy. Give me a straightforward, easy-to-interpret dashboard without a bunch of blasted gadgets that just confuse things, and a car that drives well, and I can overlook things that I see others here go OC-nuts over.

    As I told one of the salesmen who was extolling the virtues of bluetooth, XM, and various other fancy-pants this-n-thats, I do not use bluetooth I use speakerphone on the extremely rare occasions when I use the phone while driving, the XM on the Grand Prix was useless because there was nothing I wanted to hear--no matter how many channels it gets--and all the nav does is piss me off. If I need to navigate somewhere, I move the Garmin 265 over from the Spectra. The "$2000" GM nav unit is the most user-unfriendly POS I've seen in years. No, decades.

    I told him, "Give me a turbo without half the gadgets that I'll never use and don't need to pay for, with AM radio only and roll-up windows, for 18 grand and I'm driving it out of here today." Of course, he couldn't do that so I was pretty safe.
    Last edited by Neanderthal; 03-16-2011 at 03:05 AM.
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    Re: Sonata SE x 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Amphibian View Post
    It's so good looking I'd create some mystery by putting the Korean optional K5 badges on it:

    That badge looks kinda like someone took certain liberties with an Infinity badge.
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    Re: Sonata SE x 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Amphibian View Post
    I thought I read somewhere that the Kia has revised steering compared to the Sonata, and the SX even more so. Maybe I'm dreamin'.

    I too am interested in his view of comparing an Optima Turbo to the GXP.
    Based on the reviews, the Optima does have better steering feel than the Sonata, with the Optima SX even more so.

    Interestingly enough, the non-SX trim Sportage's steering has been found to be like that of the Tuscon's, not very communicative, but apparently, the SX Sportage's steering feel/feedback is a good bit better.

    Also, generally, reviewers seem to like the suspension tuning in the Optima more so than in the Sonata.

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    Re: Sonata SE x 2

    Perhaps an owner/ex-owner could comment-I've heard the requirements for keeping the Hyundai 10/100k warranty are a little on the extensive side.

    Could just be a rumor.

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    Re: Sonata SE x 2

    Quote Originally Posted by MrCritical View Post
    Perhaps an owner/ex-owner could comment-I've heard the requirements for keeping the Hyundai 10/100k warranty are a little on the extensive side.

    Could just be a rumor.
    We purchased our Spectra March 2008. We have about 15,500 miles on it now. I've actually had the dealer turn me away when I suggested some maintenance because he said it wasn't due.

    Because the car was built Jan/2007, I've had the trannie fluid done and IIRC the radiator juice. I check from time to time with the dealer to make sure I'm not missing anything regarding warranty-essential PM.

    I've heard and read various nightmare stories about KIA and Hyundai dealers screwing customers on warranty work.

    But then I've heard various nightmare stories about GM, Ford, and Chrysler and all other makers' dealerships' underhanded habits, too.

    Do routine maintenance, keep your receipts, you should be good to go.
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    Re: Sonata SE x 2

    ** Two KIA dealer service departments today (17 March) told me both the 2.0t and the 2.4 use timing chains.

    It appears these cars have sealed transmissions. How stupid can you get?

    The Sonata site is not quite as friendly as the Optima site.
    Here are a few differences that are important to me:

    Sonata: Performance suspension (18" wheels) standard/available on SE only.
    Dual zone auto air on SE 2.0t and LTD only. SE (NA & turbo) both have 18" wheels, LTD 17".
    No data on smart key in online specs.
    Side mirror turn indicators on LTD.
    Interior volume 103.8; trunk 16.4. Curb wt. 3338.

    Optima: Performance suspension on SX only. This supposedly consists of more HD shocks and a larger rear anti-roll bar (17 vs. 15 mm).
    Dual zone auto air std. on EX, SX, opt. on LX auto.
    LX=16", EX=17", SX=18" wheels.
    Side mirror turn indicators across the line.
    Smart key/button start EX, EX turbo, SX. LED taillights & projector headlights, SX only.
    Interior volume 102.2; trunk 15.4. Curb wt. 3385.
    Last edited by Neanderthal; 03-17-2011 at 10:03 PM.
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    Re: Sonata SE x 2

    Quote Originally Posted by MrCritical View Post
    Perhaps an owner/ex-owner could comment-I've heard the requirements for keeping the Hyundai 10/100k warranty are a little on the extensive side.

    Could just be a rumor.
    My mom has an 05 KIA Sorento. The dealer doesn't make a fuss about service, as long as it is clear you haven't neglected the vehicle they will honor the warrantee. The service intervals are pretty long though, at 7500 miles.

    On the other hand I have a friend that bought a new Elantra last April, and his dealer said that unless the services are all done at the dealership on time, the warrantee is void. The recommended interval is 3750, and they are considered out of standard maintenance if they go over 4000 miles between services.

    The Kia dealer is part of a Chrysler Jeep dealership, while the Hyundai dealer is part of a Honda Toyota mega lot. I think that is what makes the difference, the individual dealer, rather than the brand.

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    Re: Sonata SE x 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Neanderthal View Post
    ** Two KIA dealer service departments today (17 March) told me both the 2.0t and the 2.4 use timing chains.

    It appears these cars have sealed transmissions. How stupid can you get?

    The Sonata site is not quite as friendly as the Optima site.
    Here are a few differences that are important to me:

    Sonata: Performance suspension (18" wheels) standard/available on SE only.
    Dual zone auto air on SE 2.0t and LTD only. SE (NA & turbo) both have 18" wheels, LTD 17".
    No data on smart key in online specs.
    Side mirror turn indicators on LTD.
    Interior volume 103.8; trunk 16.4. Curb wt. 3338.

    Optima: Performance suspension on SX only. This supposedly consists of more HD shocks and a larger rear anti-roll bar (17 vs. 15 mm).
    Dual zone auto air std. on EX, SX, opt. on LX auto.
    LX=16", EX=17", SX=18" wheels.
    Side mirror turn indicators across the line.
    Smart key/button start EX, EX turbo, SX. LED taillights & projector headlights, SX only.
    Interior volume 102.2; trunk 15.4. Curb wt. 3385.
    For the sonata only the GLS has a key that you have to stick in the ignition. SE & Limited have push starts. I wanted a car with push start but then I figured I would probably lose the fob and was better with a key.
    Current:
    2016 Lincoln MKX 2.7 Reserve AWD

    Former:
    2002 Ford Explorer Xlt V8 4x4
    2004 Nissan Maxima 3.5 SL
    2008 Ford Edge Limited AWD
    2008 Jeep Commander Sport 4x4
    2010 Jeep Liberty Sport 4x4
    2011 Chevy Cruze LT
    2013 Ford Explorer XLT 4x4
    2015 Ford Explorer Sport
    2016 Lincoln MKZ AWD

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    Re: Sonata SE x 2

    Quote Originally Posted by MrCritical View Post
    Perhaps an owner/ex-owner could comment-I've heard the requirements for keeping the Hyundai 10/100k warranty are a little on the extensive side.

    Could just be a rumor.
    As w/ any manufacturer/brand, people will have varying degrees of experience based on the dealership that they frequent.

    According to the latest JD Power CSI rankings (which evaluate customer satisfaction w/ regard to repairs and warranty work within the 1st 3 years), Hyundai is ranked above avg. and quite a bit ahead of Toyota and Nissan.


    Mass Market Brands

    Customer Service Index Ranking
    J.D. Power.com Power Circle Ratings

    (Based on a 1,000-point scale)
    For Consumers

    MINI
    805
    5

    GMC
    803
    5

    Buick
    799
    5

    Chevrolet
    792
    4

    Kia
    784
    4

    Hyundai
    783
    4

    smart
    783
    4

    Volkswagen
    779
    4

    Ford
    773
    4

    Honda
    765
    3

    Mass Market Average
    758
    3

    Mitsubishi
    754
    3

    Mazda
    750
    3

    Chrysler
    749
    3

    Subaru
    744
    3

    Dodge
    743
    3

    Scion
    737
    2

    Toyota
    735
    2

    Ram
    733
    2

    Nissan
    731
    2

    Jeep
    728
    2

    Suzuki
    724
    2

    Power Circle Ratings Legend:
    5 – Among the best
    4 – Better than most
    3 – About average
    2 – The rest
    Quote Originally Posted by Astra RL View Post
    On the other hand I have a friend that bought a new Elantra last April, and his dealer said that unless the services are all done at the dealership on time, the warrantee is void. The recommended interval is 3750, and they are considered out of standard maintenance if they go over 4000 miles between services.

    The Kia dealer is part of a Chrysler Jeep dealership, while the Hyundai dealer is part of a Honda Toyota mega lot. I think that is what makes the difference, the individual dealer, rather than the brand.
    That's completely bogus for that dealership to state/claim that.

    If there's another Hyundai dealership relatively close by, I'd tell your friend to switch dealerships.
    Last edited by YEH; 03-18-2011 at 01:02 PM.

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