Road & Track c7 z51 vs cayman s vs M4 ..one of them is considered by R &T an assassin

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Thread: Road & Track c7 z51 vs cayman s vs M4 ..one of them is considered by R &T an assassin

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    Road & Track c7 z51 vs cayman s vs M4 ..one of them is considered by R &T an assassin


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    Re: Road & Track c7 z51 vs cayman s vs M4 ..one of them is considered by R &T an assa

    Boy have times changed.
    "More powerful, quicker and outright faster than a comparable BMW, Cadillac’s newest model is the best reason to skip the letter M and head all the way down the alphabet to V."
    Current Rides: 13’ Audi A3 Hatch TDI
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    Re: Road & Track c7 z51 vs cayman s vs M4 ..one of them is considered by R &T an assa

    Quote Originally Posted by Cobaltss_King View Post
    Boy have times changed.
    Nice to not hear the automotive media whine about the interior...lol



    Been decades since we didn't have to hear about that in a corvette comparison test with its German rivals...


    Performance superiority has always been a benefit of corvette...

    Now the German s can't justify their inflated pricing with stories of higher quality dashboards and transmission tunnels....

    I still think gm should up the hp to over 500 for the grand sport but I guess gm looks at it and says why?

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    Re: Road & Track c7 z51 vs cayman s vs M4 ..one of them is considered by R &T an assa

    There is absolutely no reason to have a C7 in this fight. This is a fight for Mustang and Camaro.

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    Re: Road & Track c7 z51 vs cayman s vs M4 ..one of them is considered by R &T an assa

    Quote Originally Posted by mbukukanyau View Post
    There is absolutely no reason to have a C7 in this fight. This is a fight for Mustang and Camaro.
    When this article was written in October of 2014, I don't think the SS would have competed nearly as well as the 6th Gen SS would have or the C7 did, considering this review valued feel above all out performance. Plus price wise the Corvette was already 20K cheaper than the competitors, so an even cheaper Camaro doesn't necessarily make sense.

    Plus the Cayman is also 2 seater sports car, so the M is the "odd man out" seats wise, but as the article mentions, that's sort of the history of the M3 (and by extension the M4), it's been able to do pure sports car things while being a sedan. So the grouping makes sense.
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    Re: Road & Track c7 z51 vs cayman s vs M4 ..one of them is considered by R &T an assa

    When building a car, how important is it to appease those already on your side? How necessary is consistency—what buyers have come to expect from a driving experience? In its quest for performance, BMW is building faster and more capable sport sedans but straying from what made us love BMWs in the first place. Porsche is crafting ever-sharper sports cars but losing some of the company's traditional feedback and small-brand charm. Sales for both firms are strong, but if you listen to the car clubs, the diehards aren't thrilled. Which is odd, because the diehards are always thrilled.
    GM needs to do targeted offerings to some specific people posting on the car clubs - the ones that are very active with loud opinions (meaning the trendsetters). And what I mean by targeted offerings is offer these handful of people test drives in Corvettes, Camaro and ATS-V's. Sway a few of these people and it may do more than a ton of advertising.

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    Re: Road & Track c7 z51 vs cayman s vs M4 ..one of them is considered by R &T an assa

    Quote Originally Posted by Cphelps View Post
    When this article was written in October of 2014, I don't think the SS would have competed nearly as well as the 6th Gen SS would have or the C7 did, considering this review valued feel above all out performance. Plus price wise the Corvette was already 20K cheaper than the competitors, so an even cheaper Camaro doesn't necessarily make sense.

    Plus the Cayman is also 2 seater sports car, so the M is the "odd man out" seats wise, but as the article mentions, that's sort of the history of the M3 (and by extension the M4), it's been able to do pure sports car things while being a sedan. So the grouping makes sense.
    Doh! I didn't notice the date. Either way, the comment I made above still stands.

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    Re: Road & Track c7 z51 vs cayman s vs M4 ..one of them is considered by R &T an assa

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackGTP View Post
    GM needs to do targeted offerings to some specific people posting on the car clubs - the ones that are very active with loud opinions (meaning the trendsetters). And what I mean by targeted offerings is offer these handful of people test drives in Corvettes, Camaro and ATS-V's. Sway a few of these people and it may do more than a ton of advertising.
    Who do they offer what to? Offer a BMW guy an ATS-V. ATS is not 100% as good as or better than a 3 or 4. The 4 coupe is substantially better-looking than the ATS coupe and the sedans are a matter of taste with the interiors being arguably the same (matter of taste).

    When you confront someone with something that challenges their beliefs you create what's called cognitive dissonance, which is not necessarily a good thing for you.

    Some wikipedia fo yo ass:
    In psychology, cognitive dissonance is the mental stress or discomfort experienced by an individual who holds two or more contradictory beliefs, ideas, or values at the same time, performs an action that is contradictory to one or more beliefs, ideas, or values, or is confronted by new information that conflicts with existing beliefs, ideas, or values.

    Leon Festinger's theory of cognitive dissonance focuses on how humans strive for internal consistency. An individual who experiences inconsistency (dissonance) tends to become psychologically uncomfortable, and is motivated to try to reduce this dissonance—as well as actively avoid situations and information likely to increase it.
    Belief disconfirmation paradigm

    Dissonance is felt when people are confronted with information that is inconsistent with their beliefs. If the dissonance is not reduced by changing one's belief, the dissonance can result in restoring consonance through misperception, rejection or refutation of the information, seeking support from others who share the beliefs, and attempting to persuade others.
    TL;DR: when confronted with something that challenges your core belief (ie Cadillac is better at being BMW than BMW) there's a chance you'll basically lie to yourself or nitpick and say that it sucks for whatever reason, you'll simply disagree, and/or you'll go back to the circlejerk you came from and entrench yourself further into your initial position.

    That's why people can react violently when confronted with facts that challenge their beliefs. It's also related to why you see people in movies shower after doing something they find distasteful (think Crying Game).



    I'm not comparing Cadillac to transsexuals or suggesting BMW fans would react with physical violence, but I am saying that even with a car markedly better than its competitors in every way, you'll still have a difficult time convincing a diehard fan to change his beliefs about his favorite car/brand (see: pushback on GMI against the C-Class).

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    Re: Road & Track c7 z51 vs cayman s vs M4 ..one of them is considered by R &T an assa

    The corvette z51 is an assassin...hehehehe

    First time I've seen the article so I thought I'd share with you guys...

    Pretty dam impressive and the new grand sport for 3 or 4 grand more is a hell of a bargain with bigger tires, different suspension settings and brakes...

    Wish the grand sport got a hp jump to over 500 hp but can't have everything ..

    I guess we will have to be happy that the LT1 has the same tq curve as the ls7 up to 4500 rpm
    Last edited by JBsZ06; 05-02-2016 at 10:41 PM.

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    Re: Road & Track c7 z51 vs cayman s vs M4 ..one of them is considered by R &T an assa

    What a strange selection of cars for a comparison. Everybody knows the C7 is a great car and it would be an epic embarassment if it didn't win going away.

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    Re: Road & Track c7 z51 vs cayman s vs M4 ..one of them is considered by R &T an assa

    Quote Originally Posted by SP1966 View Post
    What a strange selection of cars for a comparison. Everybody knows the C7 is a great car and it would be an epic embarassment if it didn't win going away.

    Really? Even with the fact it's tens of thousands less expensive?

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    Re: Road & Track c7 z51 vs cayman s vs M4 ..one of them is considered by R &T an assa

    Quote Originally Posted by Cphelps View Post
    When this article was written in October of 2014, I don't think the SS would have competed nearly as well as the 6th Gen SS would have or the C7 did, considering this review valued feel above all out performance. Plus price wise the Corvette was already 20K cheaper than the competitors, so an even cheaper Camaro doesn't necessarily make sense.

    Plus the Cayman is also 2 seater sports car, so the M is the "odd man out" seats wise, but as the article mentions, that's sort of the history of the M3 (and by extension the M4), it's been able to do pure sports car things while being a sedan. So the grouping makes sense.
    The Camaro 5 1LE will more than hold its own against those two, and with ease


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    Re: Road & Track c7 z51 vs cayman s vs M4 ..one of them is considered by R &T an assa

    Quote Originally Posted by JBsZ06 View Post
    Really? Even with the fact it's tens of thousands less expensive?
    Yes. The Cayman is underpowered to protect the 911 while the 911 has more power and weight. The M4 will seat four far more comfortably than your typical Camaro/Mustang. The three cars are so completely different from each other in damn near every way, the article even points out the M2 is the real spiritual successor to the old M3's performance crown.

    The price difference comes down to the badge, not the capabilities. I stand by my statement, the Vette going against an entry level Porsche and four seater M4 with half the displacement damn well better be the better performance car.

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    Re: Road & Track c7 z51 vs cayman s vs M4 ..one of them is considered by R &T an assa

    Tens of thousands of dollars more expensive than the corvette z51 is the m4 and cayman S....

    You can choose a more expensive model further if it makes you feel better...

    The corvette still wins the comparo..

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    Re: Road & Track c7 z51 vs cayman s vs M4 ..one of them is considered by R &T an assa

    Quote Originally Posted by JBsZ06 View Post
    Tens of thousands of dollars more expensive than the corvette z51 is the m4 and cayman S....

    You can choose a more expensive model further if it makes you feel better...

    The corvette still wins the comparo..
    The C7 Z51 is the ultimate performance car bargain. No other car can touch the C7's cost/performance competitive advantage.

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