Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary...1/2 of US manufactures moving supply chain out of China

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Thread: Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary...1/2 of US manufactures moving supply chain out of China

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    Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary...1/2 of US manufactures moving supply chain out of China

    GM, don't be caught with your pants down........again.


    https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/p...s-out-of-china
    Pandemic accelerates push to move supply chains out of China
    by Sean Higgins
    | March 13, 2020 12:00 AM



    The coronavirus pandemic has businesses and lawmakers intensifying efforts to move their supply chains out of China.

    Businesses will never pull out of China completely since it represents too large of a market in itself to ignore. But the virus has put many businesses on notice that they need to diversify their supply chains. At the same time, President Trump and members of Congress are providing additional incentives by vowing to change trade rules to discourage Chinese sources.

    [Click here for complete coronavirus coverage]

    The trend of manufacturers rethinking China as a source began well before the virus, said Michael Dunne, director of ZoZo Go, a China-based automotive consulting group. Tariffs sparked by the Trump administration's trade war with Beijing forced many companies to realize that they depended too much on one region and were vulnerable if the terms of trade were altered. Many were well into a search when the year started for other places in Asia and the Pacific region to source materials or to establish manufacturing.

    "Now, with the coronavirus, the urgency surrounding that has been amplified. Manufacturers and suppliers find themselves really hostage to events inside China and that, without sources outside of China, they are vulnerable," Dunne said in a podcast hosted by the Detroit-based think tank Center for Automotive Research.

    The nonprofit Institute for Supply Management reported Thursday that 62% of companies report delays in receiving orders from China and that 53% report having a difficult time even getting information regarding what is happening inside China. The ones who are dealing with the virus best are the ones that diversified their supplier base previously, ISM chief Thomas Derry told the Washington Examiner.

    "The move to diversify definitely accelerated in the fall when the 25% U.S. tariffs on Chinese goods became apparent. Getting alternate sources of supply became the primary strategy for many companies," Derry said. "The combination of the tariffs and now the coronavirus outbreak has accelerated it even further. Companies that were on the fence and saying, 'One of these factors we could deal with,' are now saying this is too much."

    It isn't that China is now viewed as toxic by businesses, Derry added. It still has a lot of advantages, such as modern infrastructure. But the days when companies thought that China was a one-stop source have passed.

    Just over half of all manufacturers are planning changes to their supply chains in the coming months as a result of the pandemic, according to a survey released Thursday by the National Association of Manufacturers. "Many mentioned having to find 'alternative suppliers,' and while disruptions are characterized as 'minor now,' they are expected to become more serious 'if slowdowns continue beyond next quarter,'Ē the report found.

    Potential new legal issues may give companies that do business with China additional reasons to rethink their current arrangements. White House trade policy adviser Peter Navarro said Wednesday the administration was planning a new "buy American" executive order intended to decrease U.S. reliance on Chinese-produced medicine and supplies. Health and Human Services Secretary Alex Azar said at a congressional hearing last month that a key problem in responding to the virus was that medical supply chains "are very much globalized and entwined with China" and that the current crisis should serve as a wake-up call.

    Republican Sen. Marco Rubio and Democratic Rep. Jim McGovern introduced legislation Wednesday to force importers to prove to the U.S. government that imports from China were not produced using forced labor. The legislation was prompted by reports that Muslim minorities were being put into forced labor in China's Xinjiang region. It would presume all goods from the region are made with forced labor until proven otherwise.

    Talking about moving away from China represents a sharp about-face for many companies. Globalization brought the United States and Chinese economies steadily closer over the last two decades. In 1998, U.S. imports from China totaled $71 billion in goods, not adjusted for inflation, while the U.S. exported $14 billion back. By 2018, imports from China totaled $540 billion, and exports came to $120 billion. U.S. supply chains now commonly extend to China.

    The long-held assumption that the connection of the two economies was irreversible has crumbled under the Trump administration, with both the U.S. and China describing the move as a "decoupling" of economic ties. The White House has placed 7.5% tariffs on $120 billion worth of Chinese goods and 25% tariffs on another $250 billion worth of products despite reaching the "phase one" of a trade deal with China in December. As a consequence of the dispute, China's imports dropped $59 billion in 2019, while American imports fell $42 billion.


    The business community expects the tariffs to be around for a while and so must factor them into future plans. The White House is adamantly opposed, and hopes have faded that the tariffs would be removed following the "phase one" trade deal with Beijing or, more recently, to counter the economic impact of the virus. "This is not just about public health and safety. Itís about our very national defense,Ē Navarro said.
    Last edited by Z284ever; 03-14-2020 at 06:46 PM.
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    Re: Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary.... 1/2 of US manufactures moving supply chain out of

    GM needs to get out of its Chinese JV's and control its own destiny in China. I hope Mother gets it.

    There is lack of patriotism in the Davos crowd

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    Re: Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary...1/2 of US manufactures moving supply chain out of Ch

    What - they bringing it back to country that has 50,000 deaths a year from flu. maybe they should put some reality glasses on! I don't have a problem with them bringing supply chains back or even having more countries involved just use a reason that has some basis.

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    Re: Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary.... 1/2 of US manufactures moving supply chain out of

    White House trade policy adviser Peter Navarro said Wednesday the administration was planning a new "buy American" executive order intended to decrease U.S. reliance on Chinese-produced medicine and supplies. Health and Human Services Secretary Alex Azar said at a congressional hearing last month that a key problem in responding to the virus was that medical supply chains "are very much globalized and entwined with China" and that the current crisis should serve as a wake-up call.

    It's a #1 national security matter that ALL pharmaceuticals be produced in the USA. This should be obvious to anyone over six years old.

    Quote Originally Posted by mbukukanyau View Post
    GM needs to get out of its Chinese JV's and control its own destiny in China. I hope Mother gets it.

    There is lack of patriotism in the Davos crowd
    The Davos crowd is New World Order types. Patriotism is essentially neanderthal thinking in their limited minds.

    Unfortunately "patriotism" was replaced long ago by "greed" and "progressive, modern thinking" which saw the US as the bad player, China as the good player on the world stage, and that China would and should replace the US as THE world power as nothing but good. That's what's being taught in the schools. I remember way back when, I'd run into teachers and perfessers who equated communism and republic-based capitalism. Essentially equal, very similar. Usually communism was seen more favorably.
    I recall a 7th grade geography or civics teacher stating unequivocally that by 1980 Brazil would replace the US as THE most advanced and powerful nation in the world.

    What of 75 years of Pax Americana? Meh! Anybody could have done that. RWR fell short of stopping this slide, Poopy Bush was a China-lover who was a "pragmatist," his successor/BFF was cheap and easy to purchase...on and on it goes.

    Former president instrumental in developing Sino-American relations

    DOMINIC FAULDER, Associate Editor, Nikkei Asian Review
    DECEMBER 01, 2018 23:20 JST
    BANGKOK -- "He was a very good friend of China," said Terry Branstad, the U.S. ambassador in Beijing, when news arrived of the death of former U.S. President George H.W. Bush on Friday.


    People who revere God and Country are seen as primitive, dimwitted, throwback hicks who will eventually die off. And the world will be a better place when modern minds completely dominate.

    As I've said about "the inevitable electrical revolution" that's been mandated by The Wise Ones in Washington, Bruxels, Peking, and other thought-leading shipping containers, mandated Central Planning revolutions in thinking, industry, and transportation typically are train wrecks. Unforeseeable bumps in the road to All Lektrik All The Time are there, and they could well be encountered at high speed.

    The Model T Revolution was genius- and consumer-driven. There are relatively very few geniuses, and consumers--other than consumers who've been convinced or brainwashed into thinking so--who are pushing hard for the fantastic electric car zerozerozero revolution. Not to say that electrics don't have their supporters and enthusiasts.
    I think favorably of electric vehicles every time I get behind a diesel bus or truck, or an old beater that burns oil or spews raw gas fumes out its stinky tube.

    If these geniuses had just let the market evolve naturally it would be a different matter. But like all elites with above-average to high IQs, they just aren't very bright. And they're not bright or humble enough to ever figure that out.
    2017 Soul &, Titanium

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    Re: Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary.... 1/2 of US manufactures moving supply chain out of

    Quote Originally Posted by Neanderthal View Post
    White House trade policy adviser Peter Navarro said Wednesday the administration was planning a new "buy American" executive order intended to decrease U.S. reliance on Chinese-produced medicine and supplies. Health and Human Services Secretary Alex Azar said at a congressional hearing last month that a key problem in responding to the virus was that medical supply chains "are very much globalized and entwined with China" and that the current crisis should serve as a wake-up call.

    It's a #1 national security matter that ALL pharmaceuticals be produced in the USA. This should be obvious to anyone over six years old.
    Yes indeedy. Especially important after the Chicoms literally threatened to withhold pharmaceuticals from the US if....erm...trade negotiations didn't go their way.
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    Re: Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary.... 1/2 of US manufactures moving supply chain out of

    Quote Originally Posted by Neanderthal View Post
    White House trade policy adviser Peter Navarro said Wednesday the administration was planning a new "buy American" executive order intended to decrease U.S. reliance on Chinese-produced medicine and supplies. Health and Human Services Secretary Alex Azar said at a congressional hearing last month that a key problem in responding to the virus was that medical supply chains "are very much globalized and entwined with China" and that the current crisis should serve as a wake-up call.

    It's a #1 national security matter that ALL pharmaceuticals be produced in the USA. This should be obvious to anyone over six years old.



    The Davos crowd is New World Order types. Patriotism is essentially neanderthal thinking in their limited minds.

    Unfortunately "patriotism" was replaced long ago by "greed" and "progressive, modern thinking" which saw the US as the bad player, China as the good player on the world stage, and that China would and should replace the US as THE world power as nothing but good. That's what's being taught in the schools. I remember way back when, I'd run into teachers and perfessers who equated communism and republic-based capitalism. Essentially equal, very similar. Usually communism was seen more favorably.
    I recall a 7th grade geography or civics teacher stating unequivocally that by 1980 Brazil would replace the US as THE most advanced and powerful nation in the world.

    What of 75 years of Pax Americana? Meh! Anybody could have done that. RWR fell short of stopping this slide, Poopy Bush was a China-lover who was a "pragmatist," his successor/BFF was cheap and easy to purchase...on and on it goes.

    Former president instrumental in developing Sino-American relations

    DOMINIC FAULDER, Associate Editor, Nikkei Asian Review
    DECEMBER 01, 2018 23:20 JST
    BANGKOK -- "He was a very good friend of China," said Terry Branstad, the U.S. ambassador in Beijing, when news arrived of the death of former U.S. President George H.W. Bush on Friday.


    People who revere God and Country are seen as primitive, dimwitted, throwback hicks who will eventually die off. And the world will be a better place when modern minds completely dominate.

    As I've said about "the inevitable electrical revolution" that's been mandated by The Wise Ones in Washington, Bruxels, Peking, and other thought-leading shipping containers, mandated Central Planning revolutions in thinking, industry, and transportation typically are train wrecks. Unforeseeable bumps in the road to All Lektrik All The Time are there, and they could well be encountered at high speed.

    The Model T Revolution was genius- and consumer-driven. There are relatively very few geniuses, and consumers--other than consumers who've been convinced or brainwashed into thinking so--who are pushing hard for the fantastic electric car zerozerozero revolution. Not to say that electrics don't have their supporters and enthusiasts.
    I think favorably of electric vehicles every time I get behind a diesel bus or truck, or an old beater that burns oil or spews raw gas fumes out its stinky tube.

    If these geniuses had just let the market evolve naturally it would be a different matter. But like all elites with above-average to high IQs, they just aren't very bright. And they're not bright or humble enough to ever figure that out.
    It sounded pretty good until I actually said it.

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    Re: Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary.... 1/2 of US manufactures moving supply chain out of

    Quote Originally Posted by Z284ever View Post
    Yes indeedy. Especially important after the Chicoms literally threatened to withhold pharmaceuticals from the US if....erm...trade negotiations didn't go their way.
    I think this Coronavirus pandemic is going to make a lot of permanent changes to the way the world works and how we interact with each other. Will we go back to handshakes? Clearly China is in long term trouble, especially making threats to cut off our supply of medicine. That was a really stupid tact to use, short term it might work as we have no choice, but long term this will ensure we move production out of China. Everyone was already nervous about China having to much power, this just proved everyone's fears were well founded.

    Offices that were previously reluctant to let people work from home will now see that it can work and perhaps make it a permanent thing. As I mentioned, will we go back to handshakes? Stores are cutting hours, will some find being open less hours results in no change in sales and make shorter hours, say on Sunday or weekdays permanent? Be really interesting to see how things change. Either way, our politicians better not forget this Chinese threat - if anything comes out of this is that production either needs to move out of China voluntarily, and if American manufacturers don't want to do in on their own, then we need legislation to force them out.

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    Re: Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary...1/2 of US manufactures moving supply chain out of Ch

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapo...M#2da555ff5298

    Another one for Mary and the BoD to consider. I mean the Chicoms would have screwed you in the end anyway, that's how they do business.
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    Re: Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary...1/2 of US manufactures moving supply chain out of Ch

    The Problem is not the MFGs. The problem is the customers who will not pay more for it to be made here.

    Everyone says they hate Walmart And Costco but they all are pushing a cart there saving money...

    People talk with 5he mouths but buy with their wallets.

    We are all guilty of it!

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    Re: Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary...1/2 of US manufactures moving supply chain out of Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by scott3 View Post
    The Problem is not the MFGs. The problem is the customers who will not pay more for it to be made here.

    Everyone says they hate Walmart And Costco but they all are pushing a cart there saving money...

    People talk with 5he mouths but buy with their wallets.

    We are all guilty of it!
    Ha! Yes, I always find that funny - people will be staunch supporters of supporting America, but it's everyone else that should buy the higher priced American made goods. Just like we say with the Ute - how dare Holden discontinue it! And then all these people spitting venom at GM for discontinuing it go out and buy a Toyota and then scratch their bewildered head as to why GM is pulling out of Australia.

    I go out of my way to buy American as much as reasonably possible but sometimes I get stuck - I had to buy a dryer from China because it was the only one that would fit into the closet. I was spitting nails because I had no choice.

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    Re: Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary...1/2 of US manufactures moving supply chain out of Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by Z284ever View Post
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapo...M#2da555ff5298

    Another one for Mary and the BoD to consider. I mean the Chicoms would have screwed you in the end anyway, that's how they do business.
    Good article! I know a lot of people on GMI hate the idea of Mexican made, but I'm all for it (as long as GM doesn't produce all of its vehicles in Mexico). A strong Mexico can only benefit us. More people to buy our products, less crime, less illegals in the USA... However, it is a "be careful of what I wish for" as our economy is dependent on illegals. As much as we complain, we need them for the low cost jobs and to keep our birthrate up (looks to Japan to see what happens with the birthrate isn't high enough to replace people as they die and Japan's xenophobia won't allow for immigrants).

    GM of course needs to stay in China, but with caution.

    Crazy thought when you think of it. China is our biggest enemy and most potent threat, yet it is our manufacturing hub. We'd never have done that with the USSR. Zero support for Cuba, yet we've made the Chinese rich.

    Unrelated, but funny - even ISIS is restricting its murders https://www.foxnews.com/world/isis-t...avel-to-europe

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    Re: Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary.... 1/2 of US manufactures moving supply chain out of

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackGTP View Post
    I think this Coronavirus pandemic is going to make a lot of permanent changes to the way the world works and how we interact with each other. Will we go back to handshakes? Clearly China is in long term trouble, especially making threats to cut off our supply of medicine. That was a really stupid tact to use, short term it might work as we have no choice but long term this will ensure we move production out of China. Everyone was already nervous about China having to much power, this just proved everyone's fears were well founded.

    Offices that were previously reluctant to let people work from home will now see that it can work and perhaps make it a permanent thing. As I mentioned, will we go back to handshakes. Stores are cutting hours, will some find being open less hours results in no change in sales and make shorter hours, say on Sunday or weekdays permanent? Be really interesting to see how things change. Either way, our politicians better not forget this Chinese threat - if anything comes out of this is that production either needs to move out of China voluntarily, and if American manufacturers don't want to do in on their own, then we need legislation to force them out.
    That was pretty stupid. I guess in all of their Communist totalitarianism, this sort of arrogance is acceptable. Not here though.

    I stopped shaking hands in my professional setting this week. It's weird for me.
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    Re: Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary...1/2 of US manufactures moving supply chain out of Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackGTP View Post
    Good article! I know a lot of people on GMI hate the idea of Mexican made, but I'm all for it (as long as GM doesn't produce all of its vehicles in Mexico). A strong Mexico can only benefit us. More people to buy our products, less crime, less illegals in the USA... However, it is a "be careful of what I wish for" as our economy is dependent on illegals. As much as we complain, we need them for the low cost jobs and to keep our birthrate up (looks to Japan to see what happens with the birthrate isn't high enough to replace people as they die and Japan's xenophobia won't allow for immigrants).

    GM of course needs to stay in China, but with caution.

    Crazy thought when you think of it. China is our biggest enemy and most potent threat, yet it is our manufacturing hub. We'd never have done that with the USSR. Zero support for Cuba, yet we've made the Chinese rich.

    Unrelated, but funny - even ISIS is restricting its murders https://www.foxnews.com/world/isis-t...avel-to-europe
    Totally agree. Re-organizing supply and manufacturing chains through say, Mexico, (and others) vs China is the whole point here. I think it's safe to say that Mexico is the US choice.
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    Re: Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary...1/2 of US manufactures moving supply chain out of Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by scott3 View Post
    The Problem is not the MFGs. The problem is the customers who will not pay more for it to be made here.

    Everyone says they hate Walmart And Costco but they all are pushing a cart there saving money...

    People talk with 5he mouths but buy with their wallets.

    We are all guilty of it!

    Sure, but China is no longer the cheap and safe choice. And maybe GM should not be putting all their eggs, headlong into the Chicom basket.
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    Re: Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary...1/2 of US manufactures moving supply chain out of Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by Z284ever View Post
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapo...M#2da555ff5298

    Another one for Mary and the BoD to consider. I mean the Chicoms would have screwed you in the end anyway, that's how they do business.
    Mexico indeed. The biggest problems there are that the criminal enterprise is not only a corrupt government but the hyper-powerful drug cartels. Can they EVER get a handle on those people? China makes the drugs, ships to Mexico, they get smuggled into the USA where 60,000 die per year of ODs. Yet we're on lockdown for a virus that isn't even a rounding error?

    This virus looks like the/an unforeseen bump in the road to Electric Nirvana. Stuff happens that cannot be predicted. The markets handle this better than governments.

    Putting all your eggs in the China/Electric basket is something any 10-year-old from 40 years ago could have told you was dumb dumb dumb.

    If the makers want a stable country with a reliable--not cheap, not no-safety-regs, not no oversight--workforce, they should consider non-union US shops, down south, with a high level of automation. Unfortunately for the UAW, the UAW is nearsighted and greedy, enjoys bullying, and has no clue that they are cutting their own throats.
    UAW knows one tactic, it's assault. Nobody ever wonders why membership is a fraction of what it was in 1970?

    https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2...hip-in-one-map

    It appears VW workers never learn:

    UAW membership tops 400,000 for first time since '08
    Brent SnavelyDetroit Free Press


    UAW members, including William Monroe of Atlanta, stand for the Pledge of Allegiance at the bargaining convention last week in Detroit.
    DETROIT — The UAW eclipsed 400,000 members for the first time since 2008, drawing new members and dues last year from the resurgent automotive industry, suppliers in the South and higher education employees.

    It was the fifth straight year the union saw a membership gain, reporting more than 12,000 new members last year and 403,000 members total, according to an annual report filed in March with the U.S. Department of Labor.

    The union now represents more than 10,000 workers in the gaming industry and 25,000 higher education workers.

    "As the UAW grows, our members are better able to take care of their families and support their communities," UAW President Dennis Williams said in a statement Tuesday. "We understand success and quality products are helping UAW members build a better future for all Americans."

    The union's 3% gain in 2014 is among its largest jumps in recent years, said Kristin Dziczek, director of the labor and industry group for the Center for Automotive Research.

    "It shows they are picking up some momentum even though they are a long way off from where they were during the downturn," Dziczek said.

    The UAW currently represents about 137,000 workers at General Motors, Ford and FCA US (previously Chrysler), up from about 112,000 in 2011. Last year, the union also won organizing victories that included 1,000 employees at Horseshoe Casino Cleveland and 2,100 graduate employees at the University of Connecticut.

    "They have had some success in organizing, but I don't think they have turned the corner yet," said Arthur Schwartz, president of Labor and Economics Associates in Ann Arbor.

    The UAW's recent membership gains are relatively modest compared with its historic membership levels. Just a decade ago, the UAW had more than 650,000 members. Its peak was 1.5 million in 1979.

    In Chattanooga, Tenn., the UAW has won the right to represent more than half of Volkswagen's hourly workers who have joined UAW Local 42. However, the UAW is not the exclusive bargaining agent and those members are not dues-paying members.

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/money...ince/70753012/

    Article goes on to discuss UAW budget, annual losses, but never mentions how much was embezzled. Hmmmmm.
    Last edited by Neanderthal; 03-15-2020 at 12:39 PM.
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