A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts

  1. Welcome to GM Inside News Forum – General discussion forum for GM

    Welcome to GM Inside News Forum - a website dedicated to all things GM.

    You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, at no cost, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, Join GM Inside News Forum today!
     
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 31

Thread: A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts

  1. #1
    News Contributor Premium Member EJD1984's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Baltimore, MD
    Posts
    5,417
    Thanks
    1,106
    Thanked 2,282 Times in 1,126 Posts
    My Ride
    2014 GMC Sierra

    A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts

    A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts
    Automobile
    By Todd Lassa
    January 15, 2016

    Though not a golfer, nor someone who buys cars with automatic transmissions, I fulfill much of the demographics that Buick is working hard to shed, and I have a soft spot in my heart for the brand. I have been advocating a rear-wheel-drive car for Buick’s lineup ever since Sang Yup Lee’s 2004 Velite concept used General Motors’ old Zeta platform. The convertible concept was to have become a RWD sedan for 2009 but, well, you know what happened to a lot of good future product intentions back then.

    So when I sat down at the 2016 North American International Auto Show with Buick/GMC chief Duncan Aldred, it was the focus of my line of questioning. The Avista, Buick’s second RWD concept in two years, was spinning on its turntable just a few yards away.

    What are the chances it will go into series production?

    “The capabilities are there to build it; it was brought into here as a pure concept," says Aldred. "We wanted to show off Buick design, we wanted to showcase a few of the things that you will see in Buicks over the next one, two, three years, whether it’s the lighting technology, interior design, grille treatment, etcetera. And from there, we wait and see what happens.
    *Full Article at Link

  2. Remove Advertisements
    GM Inside News
    Advertisements
     

  3. #2
    News Contributor Premium Member EJD1984's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Baltimore, MD
    Posts
    5,417
    Thanks
    1,106
    Thanked 2,282 Times in 1,126 Posts
    My Ride
    2014 GMC Sierra

    Re: A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts

    Automobile
    As one enthusiast friend who’s not in the industry noted, Cadillac has always pushed back whenever it looks like Buick might encroach on its territory.

    Now I’m convinced my non-automotive-industry friend is right: Buick had a business case for Avenir, but Cadillac put the brakes on it.
    I wonder if Cadillac does feel threatened by Buick's new designs, and may be putting influence/pressure onto the GM corporate board.

    *Just thinking out loud.

  4. #3
    Sox
    Sox is offline
    5.3 Liter Vortec V8
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Canada, eh?
    Posts
    1,380
    Thanks
    149
    Thanked 786 Times in 433 Posts
    My Ride
    Ducati Multistrada

    Re: A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts

    Quote Originally Posted by EJD1984 View Post
    I wonder if Cadillac does feel threatened by Buick's designs, and may be putting influence & pressure onto the GM corporate board.
    I doubt it. The GM Board of Directors is just a huge rubber stamp for the CEO. Whatever the CEO wants, the CEO gets. I doubt the BOD has the originality of thought to even think of interfering in GM product plans, never mind anything else to do with corporate governance.

    When GM went bankrupt, the CEO had to wake the BOD to tell them.

  5. The Following User Says Thank You to Sox For This Useful Post:

    377Z (01-17-2016)

  6. Remove Advertisements
    GM Inside News
    Advertisements
     

  7. #4
    6.2 Liter LS9 Supercharged V8
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    New Orleans
    Posts
    8,478
    Thanks
    3,818
    Thanked 3,066 Times in 1,897 Posts
    My Ride
    2017 Cadillac CT6

    Re: A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts

    I think the thing is that Cadillac wants Buick to wait. The sedan market is shrinking, and Cadillac is trying to get established. If Cadillac was more established then I don't think there would be a problem.

    The last thing you need is cheaper competition from within when you're trying to establish yourself. Cadillac can hit higher margins than Buick ever can at roughly the same volume of sales.

    Cadillac's problems have more to do with lack of vehicle and engine platforms, not lack of design

  8. The Following User Says Thank You to dslay04 For This Useful Post:

    ehaase (01-17-2016)

  9. #5
    R2-D2 Astromech Droid Ed753's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    18,950
    Thanks
    12,395
    Thanked 8,200 Times in 4,836 Posts
    My Ride
    2018 GMC Sierra Crew 6 1/2'

    Re: A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts

    You don't actually believe yourself, do you?

    This is boarder-line comic relief.

    Quote Originally Posted by dslay04 View Post
    I think the thing is that Cadillac wants Buick to wait. The sedan market is shrinking, and Cadillac is trying to get established. If Cadillac was more established then I don't think there would be a problem.
    Exactly; Cadillac is only 10 years into its remaking. Buick please wait another 10 years (15 tops) ............


    Quote Originally Posted by dslay04 View Post
    The last thing you need is cheaper competition from within when you're trying to establish yourself. Cadillac can hit higher margins than Buick ever can at roughly the same volume of sales.
    If you can't compete with a (lower) division within your own company it might be an indication; that you aren't up for the game of competing with your true competitors.


    Quote Originally Posted by dslay04 View Post
    Cadillac's problems have more to do with lack of vehicle and engine platforms, not lack of design
    Right; why else would Buick not be allowed to have its own version of the ATS coupe or CT6!?
    Current: Hidden Content Hidden Content

    Past: '17 Cruze; '15 F150; '14 Volt; '13 MKX; '13 Silverado; '13 Fusion; '11 Ram; '10 Commander; '08 Sierra; '07 Rendezvous; '05 Ram; '04 Grand Cherokee; '03 F150; '01 Silverado; '00 Jimmy; '99 Sierra; '97 Ram; '96 Mustang GT; '96 Jimmy; '90 Escort GT; '89 Ranger; '84 Omni; '76 Malibu; '78 LeMans; '85 Escort; '82 Lynx; '75 Sierra

  10. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Ed753 For This Useful Post:

    377Z (01-17-2016),Commodoreman2000 (01-17-2016)

  11. #6
    6.2 Liter LS9 Supercharged V8
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    New Orleans
    Posts
    8,478
    Thanks
    3,818
    Thanked 3,066 Times in 1,897 Posts
    My Ride
    2017 Cadillac CT6

    Re: A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed753 View Post
    You don't actually believe yourself, do you?

    This is boarder-line comic relief.



    Exactly; Cadillac is only 10 years into its remaking. Buick please wait another 10 years (15 tops) ............




    If you can't compete with a (lower) division within your own company it might be an indication; that you aren't up for the game of competing with your true competitors.




    Right; why else would Buick not be allowed to have its own version of the ATS coupe or CT6!?
    Because the market is shrinking. If the market was growing, then, thats another story. Buick should be getting Avenir and Avista inspired crossovers or sport CUV's, why chase a shrinking part of the vehicle pie.
    Last edited by dslay04; 01-16-2016 at 07:49 PM.

  12. The Following User Says Thank You to dslay04 For This Useful Post:

    ehaase (01-17-2016)

  13. #7
    Firebird Concept (the turbine one) JBsZ06's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    12,991
    Thanks
    634
    Thanked 1,594 Times in 1,044 Posts
    My Ride
    2008 black c6 z51 m6 NPP

    Re: A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts

    Bucks avista would destroy the ATS coupe and sedan. Art and science is dead and buried or at least should be.

    This new Buick coupe and four doors are stunning.

    Nothing in the world tops this design under 100 grand.

    Buick, gmc and Cadillac need small medium and large CUVs.

    Not two door coupes...

    Although I don't see the ATS coupe lasting too long....or selling that well.

    Gm shouldn't have even bothered...

    Once they removed the concept car styling of the cts coupe..to make the ATS coupe.

    Just a dud IMO.

    A Porsche Macan sized and shaped Cadillac or gmc or Buick on either the alpha platform or the new bolt platform would work wonders and be easy to accomplish...

  14. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to JBsZ06 For This Useful Post:

    377Z (01-17-2016),Ed753 (01-16-2016)

  15. #8
    R2-D2 Astromech Droid Ed753's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    18,950
    Thanks
    12,395
    Thanked 8,200 Times in 4,836 Posts
    My Ride
    2018 GMC Sierra Crew 6 1/2'

    Re: A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts

    Quote Originally Posted by dslay04 View Post
    Because the market is shrinking. If the market was growing, then, thats another story. Buick should be getting Avenir and Avista inspired crossovers or sport CUV's, why chase a shrinking part of the vehicle pie.
    Then why did GM design the Avenir and Avista concepts; just to illustrate how boring and un-inspiring production Cadillac's are?

    If Buick had brought Avenir and Avista Sport CUV's would the same argument hold true, Cadillac is 2~3 Sport CUV's short, no?
    Current: Hidden Content Hidden Content

    Past: '17 Cruze; '15 F150; '14 Volt; '13 MKX; '13 Silverado; '13 Fusion; '11 Ram; '10 Commander; '08 Sierra; '07 Rendezvous; '05 Ram; '04 Grand Cherokee; '03 F150; '01 Silverado; '00 Jimmy; '99 Sierra; '97 Ram; '96 Mustang GT; '96 Jimmy; '90 Escort GT; '89 Ranger; '84 Omni; '76 Malibu; '78 LeMans; '85 Escort; '82 Lynx; '75 Sierra

  16. #9
    6.2 Liter LS9 Supercharged V8
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    New Orleans
    Posts
    8,478
    Thanks
    3,818
    Thanked 3,066 Times in 1,897 Posts
    My Ride
    2017 Cadillac CT6

    Re: A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed753 View Post
    Then why did GM design the Avenir and Avista concepts; just to illustrate how boring and un-inspiring production Cadillac's are?

    If Buick had brought Avenir and Avista Sport CUV's would the same argument hold true, Cadillac is 2~3 Sport CUV's short, no?
    To preview new design themes. Audi and Mercedes do it all the time. SUV's are rarely used to show new design principals because the proportions are thrown off

  17. #10
    R2-D2 Astromech Droid Ed753's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    18,950
    Thanks
    12,395
    Thanked 8,200 Times in 4,836 Posts
    My Ride
    2018 GMC Sierra Crew 6 1/2'

    Re: A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts

    Quote Originally Posted by dslay04 View Post
    To preview new design themes. Audi and Mercedes do it all the time. SUV's are rarely used to show new design principals because the proportions are thrown off
    Maybe a 2-door version of this will be "good enough"?

    Should give Cadillac enough room at least, right?



    .

    Current: Hidden Content Hidden Content

    Past: '17 Cruze; '15 F150; '14 Volt; '13 MKX; '13 Silverado; '13 Fusion; '11 Ram; '10 Commander; '08 Sierra; '07 Rendezvous; '05 Ram; '04 Grand Cherokee; '03 F150; '01 Silverado; '00 Jimmy; '99 Sierra; '97 Ram; '96 Mustang GT; '96 Jimmy; '90 Escort GT; '89 Ranger; '84 Omni; '76 Malibu; '78 LeMans; '85 Escort; '82 Lynx; '75 Sierra

  18. #11
    6.2 Liter LS9 Supercharged V8
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    New Orleans
    Posts
    8,478
    Thanks
    3,818
    Thanked 3,066 Times in 1,897 Posts
    My Ride
    2017 Cadillac CT6

    Re: A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed753 View Post
    Maybe a 2-door version of this will be "good enough"?

    Should give Cadillac enough room at least, right?



    .

    I'm torn. I think they need both. GTC for the low end Verano complement and in the near term, Aspire 5-6 years from now and build it off of a longer wheelbase so it can be a Rivera

  19. #12
    Corvette C7 megeebee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    16,689
    Thanks
    5,072
    Thanked 3,234 Times in 1,933 Posts

    Re: A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts

    Quote Originally Posted by EJD1984 View Post
    I wonder if Cadillac does feel threatened by Buick's new designs, and may be putting influence/pressure onto the GM corporate board.

    *Just thinking out loud.
    I think not.

    Ed Welburn and many others at GM know exactly what designs are in the works. Buick didn't "Surprise" Cadillac with the Avista. Everything is planned at the GM Corporate level. To think that one Division Chief is in Mary Barra's office trying to make another Division Chief stop doing something is ridiculous.

    AUOTMOBILE
    As one enthusiast friend who’s not in the industry noted, Cadillac has always pushed back whenever it looks like Buick might encroach on its territory.
    This is silly. How could anyone say, or even know this?

    The Divisions of GM don't sit in separate corners plotting ways to one-up or hinder each other. A successful Buick is no threat to Cadillac or any other GM Division.
    Last edited by megeebee; 01-17-2016 at 12:00 AM.
    "The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere the ceremony of innocence is drowned;
    The best lack all conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity. "

    W.B. Yeats- 1919



    .

  20. The Following User Says Thank You to megeebee For This Useful Post:

    377Z (01-17-2016)

  21. #13
    4.4 Liter Supercharged Northstar Cobaltss_King's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    2,947
    Thanks
    2,463
    Thanked 820 Times in 483 Posts

    Re: A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts

    Hmmm a four door Avista. Now where have I seen that idea before lol


    The more Caddy moves down market the more irrelevant Buick becomes in the US. Buick really can't have a sedan priced over 50k and not have it compete directly with a Caddy. Now depending on how the size of the next Gen Caddys shake out there could be room for a very different four door Avista.
    Last edited by Cobaltss_King; 01-17-2016 at 12:23 AM.
    "More powerful, quicker and outright faster than a comparable BMW, Cadillac’s newest model is the best reason to skip the letter M and head all the way down the alphabet to V."
    Current Rides: 13’ Audi A3 Hatch TDI
    17’ Cadillac CT6 3.6
    16’ Cadillac ELR

  22. #14
    R2-D2 Astromech Droid sfbreh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    NJ
    Posts
    19,258
    Thanks
    7,624
    Thanked 8,771 Times in 5,646 Posts

    Re: A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts

    Quote Originally Posted by EJD1984 View Post
    I wonder if Cadillac does feel threatened by Buick's new designs, and may be putting influence/pressure onto the GM corporate board.

    *Just thinking out loud.
    Cadillac stopping Buick over design is pure hogwash. They're designed by the same people and Cadillac is 100% capable of producing TOP TIER, MODERN CLASSIC designs.

    A Cadillac that looks like this...







    would feel no shame pulling up next to this Buick:






    Both cars are beautiful and make VERY different personal statements because, make no mistake, these are statement cars.

    I dunno about you guys, but if that's what Cadillacs and Buicks looked like, 1) there would only be American cars in my family and 2) I would be driving the Cadillac while my wife would drive the Buick.

    (bonus: check out the convertible version of Elmiraj behind Gael Buzyn)

    If you listen to GM, though, we DID get the Avenir and Ciel:



    Quote Originally Posted by dslay04 View Post
    I think the thing is that Cadillac wants Buick to wait. The sedan market is shrinking, and Cadillac is trying to get established. If Cadillac was more established then I don't think there would be a problem.

    The last thing you need is cheaper competition from within when you're trying to establish yourself. Cadillac can hit higher margins than Buick ever can at roughly the same volume of sales.

    Cadillac's problems have more to do with lack of vehicle and engine platforms, not lack of design
    I think GM NEEDS Buick to wait, and I also think Cadillac NEEDS Buick to make a second Omega even a remote possibility.

  23. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to sfbreh For This Useful Post:

    dslay04 (01-17-2016),jzchev28 (01-17-2016),patrickbec (01-17-2016),Tone (01-17-2016)

  24. #15
    R2-D2 Astromech Droid sfbreh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    NJ
    Posts
    19,258
    Thanks
    7,624
    Thanked 8,771 Times in 5,646 Posts

    Re: A Tale of Two RWD Buick Concepts

    Quote Originally Posted by dslay04 View Post
    I'm torn. I think they need both. GTC for the low end Verano complement and in the near term, Aspire 5-6 years from now and build it off of a longer wheelbase so it can be a Rivera
    FWD entry level coupe for $25,000+ and a $50,000 Avista coupe halo would be all they need.

  25. Remove Advertisements
    GM Inside News
    Advertisements
     

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v4.1.2