Toyota's New Competitive Weapon: The 36 MPG 3-Row SUV

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Thread: Toyota's New Competitive Weapon: The 36 MPG 3-Row SUV

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    Toyota's New Competitive Weapon: The 36 MPG 3-Row SUV

    Very long article with numerous tables:

    Toyota brings to the US market the all-new 2020 Highlander, a 3-row SUV, with a whopping 36 MPG - at least 25% better than the next-best competitors.

    It also prices the Highlander hybrid at least $15,000 less than the competition.

    The outgoing Highlander hybrid had vastly inferior fuel economy and wasn’t available with front-wheel-drive (FWD), yet its hybrid take-rate grew from 6% to 8%.

    Therefore, the all-new Highlander should see its hybrid take-rate increase from 8% to approximately 20%.

    The otherwise superior 2020 Toyota Highlander could do even better if was packaged in different or more flexible trim/grade levels.

    Everyone has gotten used to many automakers stretching fuel efficiency claims, posting numbers that are difficult to achieve on average, and that later have to be ratcheted down. With the all-new for the 2020 model year Highlander, Toyota (TM) breaks that sad industry pattern.

    But first, some background. Let’s start with the three-row SUV segment in the U.S. market. As of the end of the September month, the 2019 year-to-date sales numbers looked like this:
    __________________________________________________ _____
    As you can see in the table above, Toyota Highlander leads in a segment that was up 6% overall, but down 2% for the incumbents - taking out the new nameplates that entered the market in 2018 and 2019, such as Subaru Ascent, Kia Telluride, Hyundai Palisade, BMW X7, Cadillac XT6 and Lincoln Aviator. In other words, the new players took a significant bite out of this segment.

    In that environment, the Toyota Highlander performed admirably in its last year before the generational shift. Sales being flat year-over-year is better than the incumbent average, and excellent considering that the outgoing generation of the Highlander was naturally dated and tired.

    On New Generation Vehicles In General

    Let’s discuss all-new generations of cars in the first place. Once every 5-7 years (typically), automakers launch a new-generation vehicle which replaces the previous one. In this most recent industry cycle, this kind of generational change typically brings about these changes:

    The exterior gets a fresh redesign that makes the car look better and less dated.

    The interior gets a very serious lift in terms of premium feel and look, and with many more features.

    The overall refinement, smoothness and “driving dynamics” (steering, handling, etc.) advance one step for the better.

    https://seekingalpha.com/article/431...edium=referral
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    Re: Toyota's New Competitive Weapon: The 36 MPG 3-Row SUV

    If I were in the market for a 3 row the Highlander would be at the top of my list, this hybrid version only makes it better.

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    Re: Toyota's New Competitive Weapon: The 36 MPG 3-Row SUV

    Can it sit 8 people? will it be a pig like my plug in? Slow like snail? My lactating one likes to get places in a hurry..

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    Re: Toyota's New Competitive Weapon: The 36 MPG 3-Row SUV

    Maximizing fuel economy usually means minimizing utility and sport. I doubt it can tow or haul much, if at all. Certainly not when you are carrying a full load of passengers. Which is why most buy an SUV in the first place. And that tire package is obviouly biased for FE also, which concludes that in addition to being painfully slow, you are also dynamically challenged. And that face, only a TMC fan could love.

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    Re: Toyota's New Competitive Weapon: The 36 MPG 3-Row SUV

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Chaos View Post
    If I were in the market for a 3 row the Highlander would be at the top of my list, this hybrid version only makes it better.
    Come on, everyone knows right now the 3 Row to get is the Explorer.. followed by the Traverse

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    Re: Toyota's New Competitive Weapon: The 36 MPG 3-Row SUV

    Quote Originally Posted by DreadNaughty View Post
    Maximizing fuel economy usually means minimizing utility and sport. I doubt it can tow or haul much, if at all. Certainly not when you are carrying a full load of passengers. Which is why most buy an SUV in the first place. And that tire package is obviouly biased for FE also, which concludes that in addition to being painfully slow, you are also dynamically challenged. And that face, only a TMC fan could love.
    Its fine for mommy duty. SUV's are getting so expensive, this is a remarkably good dea + MPG'sl for the $$$$$.
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    Re: Toyota's New Competitive Weapon: The 36 MPG 3-Row SUV

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Chaos View Post
    If I were in the market for a 3 row the Highlander would be at the top of my list, this hybrid version only makes it better.
    The Highlander will also continue to offer a hybrid powertrain, which consists of a 2.5-liter four-cylinder and two electric motors that team up for a combined 240 horsepower. Hybrid models come with a continuously variable automatic transmission (CVT) and can be had with either front- or all-wheel drive.
    https://www.caranddriver.com/toyota/highlander
    Last edited by Neanderthal; 12-29-2019 at 03:56 PM.
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    Re: Toyota's New Competitive Weapon: The 36 MPG 3-Row SUV

    Quote Originally Posted by DreadNaughty View Post
    Maximizing fuel economy usually means minimizing utility and sport. I doubt it can tow or haul much, if at all. Certainly not when you are carrying a full load of passengers. Which is why most buy an SUV in the first place. And that tire package is obviouly biased for FE also, which concludes that in addition to being painfully slow, you are also dynamically challenged. And that face, only a TMC fan could love.
    HAHAHAH

    This is going to cement Toyota as the go to for a 7 passenger. The MPG without any real penalty is huge.

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    Re: Toyota's New Competitive Weapon: The 36 MPG 3-Row SUV

    Quote Originally Posted by mbukukanyau View Post
    Come on, everyone knows right now the 3 Row to get is the Explorer.. followed by the Traverse
    Actually, the Explorer would also be high on my list. No Traverse though, as much as I find it attractive outside, its just way to dull inside. Honestly, a new Tahoe would probably trump all of them.

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    Re: Toyota's New Competitive Weapon: The 36 MPG 3-Row SUV

    If you are buying a minvan-ish SUV strictily for maximized MPG's, then knock yourself out. Pretty dumb, IMO.
    There are many factors for me, least of which is a few extra MPG's, when gas is so cheap.

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    Re: Toyota's New Competitive Weapon: The 36 MPG 3-Row SUV

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Chaos View Post
    Actually, the Explorer would also be high on my list. No Traverse though, as much as I find it attractive outside, its just way to dull inside. Honestly, a new Tahoe would probably trump all of them.
    you can throw in a Malibu between a traverse and a Tahoe.

    The Traverse is in my opinion the most practical buy at this point.

    From a utility standpoint, nothing beats it. Plus for such a big vehicle, it can hassle very well..

    Packs 301 HP too

    But when it comes to spending your money, by all means, what floats your boat is all that matters..

    MPG is not even in the top 5 considerations when buying the family vehicle. For me. Space is by far #1. Especially with car seat in middle row... Traverse wins

    Reasonable technology application, traverse wins,

    Sitting space, win for traverse
    Trunk space, traverse win...
    Can it hassle.. you bet it can hold it’s own pretty well between 35 mph and 100 mph.. it can scoot pretty good for such a big vehicle

    Anyways, I know Chevrolet products are not popular around here...

    But in the end, it’s your money...
    Last edited by mbukukanyau; 12-29-2019 at 05:13 PM.

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    Re: Toyota's New Competitive Weapon: The 36 MPG 3-Row SUV

    Quote Originally Posted by DreadNaughty View Post
    If you are buying a minvan-ish SUV strictily for maximized MPG's, then knock yourself out. Pretty dumb, IMO.
    There are many factors for me, least of which is a few extra MPG's, when gas is so cheap.
    Well, it's not a SUV so not sure why they keep calling it that.

    For a normal person who drives 1,000 miles per month, 36 MPG will yield 28 gallons consumed. The non-hybrid version would divide 1,000 miles by 24 MPG, or 42 gallons consumed. So basically, you save 14 gallons per month. At the current nation-wide average price of $2.55 per gallon, you save $35.7 per month.

    $1,400 divided by $35.7 per month is 39 months. So, the payback on the $1,400 hybrid investment is 39 months. That's a reasonable and rational number.
    You have to be an idiot to not applaud Toyota on this. A hybrid 7 passenger CUV under 40k is huge.


    Mbuk, had GM not been an absolute imbecile and priced the Traverse too high we'd have one. Instead, we've been enjoying the hell out of our Palisade that offers far more than GM can think of at their price points.

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    Re: Toyota's New Competitive Weapon: The 36 MPG 3-Row SUV

    Quote Originally Posted by bballr4567 View Post
    Well, it's not a SUV so not sure why they keep calling it that.



    You have to be an idiot to not applaud Toyota on this. A hybrid 7 passenger CUV under 40k is huge.


    Mbuk, had GM not been an absolute imbecile and priced the Traverse too high we'd have one. Instead, we've been enjoying the hell out of our Palisade that offers far more than GM can think of at their price points.
    I have to agree you on the pricing of the Traverse. My lease is up on our Acadia and looking to replace it with another Acadia or similar CUV. Currently working on pricing on an Acadia and a Traverse and I am not happy with the numbers coming back. I've gotten some good lease deals in the past, but I'm striking out so far this time. For example, for an Acadia equipped similarly to what I currently have, the MSRP seems to be at least $2k more than the MSRP of my current Acadia (SLT). Lease deals are not good on the Traverse either, and while they are knocking about 4-5k off the MSRP, they are still in the lower mid-40s to get what I want.

    Not much better at Ford, either. They are asking $380+/month all-in for an Explorer XLT (cloth and 2.3 4-cylinder). No thanks!

    Over at FCA, there are some good deals on the Jeep GC Limited. Still waiting for final numbers on those, but it seems somewhat promising.

    We'll see what the next couple of days brings. If these don't pan out, I will look elsewhere. Did you get a good deal on the Palisade?
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    Re: Toyota's New Competitive Weapon: The 36 MPG 3-Row SUV

    Quote Originally Posted by impala02 View Post
    I have to agree you on the pricing of the Traverse. My lease is up on our Acadia and looking to replace it with another Acadia or similar CUV. Currently working on pricing on an Acadia and a Traverse and I am not happy with the numbers coming back. I've gotten some good lease deals in the past, but I'm striking out so far this time. For example, for an Acadia equipped similarly to what I currently have, the MSRP seems to be at least $2k more than the MSRP of my current Acadia (SLT). Lease deals are not good on the Traverse either, and while they are knocking about 4-5k off the MSRP, they are still in the lower mid-40s to get what I want.

    Not much better at Ford, either. They are asking $380+/month all-in for an Explorer XLT (cloth and 2.3 4-cylinder). No thanks!

    Over at FCA, there are some good deals on the Jeep GC Limited. Still waiting for final numbers on those, but it seems somewhat promising.

    We'll see what the next couple of days brings. If these don't pan out, I will look elsewhere. Did you get a good deal on the Palisade?
    You got to haggle on price, I have found that if you are aggressive, they will work with you.

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    Re: Toyota's New Competitive Weapon: The 36 MPG 3-Row SUV

    Quote Originally Posted by bballr4567 View Post
    Well, it's not a SUV so not sure why they keep calling it that.




    Does not matter what we call it, what it is, is a minivan like vehicle that primarily uses a NA I4 engine to barely propel it's 4,500 lb chassis, let alone any additional cargo or humans. If I were shopping for a CUV/SUV that prioritizes and maximizes FE, I would probably consider the Escape Hybrid with it's 44 mpg rating, costing only $28K, and drives far more sprightly day to day. Not exactly an 7-8 seater you say? Yup, if I really did need to haul a big family around daily and safely, I would never risk their lives with an underpowered death trap that can't get out of it's own way.....just to save a few $$. Step up to an engine without adequate power, and keep everyone safe. That's how I roll anyway.

    Applaud Toyota for cheapening their large family truckster with an I4 just for marketing purposes, risking peoples lives who don't think twice before over loading their vehicle?
    I think not.

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