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Thread: CY2019 - RAM > Silverado 10.1%: How It Happened

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    Re: CY2019 - RAM > Silverado 10.1%: How It Happened

    The new Silverado is the ugliest pickup truck GM has designed in the last 40 years. It isn't good looking from any angle. The GMC is slightly better looking, but neither are as good looking as the Ram. The Silverado has no flow or singular language. And don't tell me a four banger is a good engine choice for a full sized pickup. The hemi Ram drives much better than GM's offerings. At the end of the day, I don't care that I've saved a couple miles per gallon than a better driving experience offered by the more powerful Ram. I actually thing the Tundra is better looking and that's probably the biggest insult of all.

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    Re: CY2019 - RAM > Silverado 10.1%: How It Happened

    Quote Originally Posted by tripowergto Jan2003 View Post
    The coming 14 week factory shutdown for the Ram "Classic" production while they convert the plant for Wagoneer production could affect continued growth.
    They'll incentivise the new Ram or cone up with a tempting low cost new Ram package to convert those lost classic sales into next gen sales.
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    Re: CY2019 - RAM > Silverado 10.1%: How It Happened

    The strike by the (corrupt) UAW was idiotic. It cost GM sales, alienated customers, and created more ill-will.

    The drop in new Silverado sales were affected by the UAW strike - and I’ll bet some customers went to Ram and Ford.

    I’m one of the many customers who were unable to get their GM vehicle fixed at the dealer, one month after the UAW strike ended, due to the dealer’s inability to get a part from GM. I wonder how many Silverado truck owners also had the same experience - and will look elsewhere for their next truck?

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    Re: CY2019 - RAM > Silverado 10.1%: How It Happened

    Quote Originally Posted by 1999 White C5 Coupe View Post
    The strike by the (corrupt) UAW was idiotic. It cost GM sales, alienated customers, and created more ill-will.

    The drop in new Silverado sales were affected by the UAW strike - and I’ll bet some customers went to Ram and Ford.

    I’m one of the many customers who were unable to get their GM vehicle fixed at the dealer, one month after the UAW strike ended, due to the dealer’s inability to get a part from GM. I wonder how many Silverado truck owners also had the same experience - and will look elsewhere for their next truck?
    We get it....u dont like the UAW
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    Re: CY2019 - RAM > Silverado 10.1%: How It Happened

    Quote Originally Posted by 1999 White C5 Coupe View Post
    The strike by the (corrupt) UAW was idiotic. It cost GM sales, alienated customers, and created more ill-will.

    The drop in new Silverado sales were affected by the UAW strike - and I’ll bet some customers went to Ram and Ford.

    I’m one of the many customers who were unable to get their GM vehicle fixed at the dealer, one month after the UAW strike ended, due to the dealer’s inability to get a part from GM. I wonder how many Silverado truck owners also had the same experience - and will look elsewhere for their next truck?
    Yes, the UAW was in the wrong but GM knew that the strike would hurt
    its business, set the wheels in motion by not keeping the UAW at the table,
    prolonged it by mucking with health benefits and then finally caved in.

    GM is simply incapable of negotiating in anything but a position of strength.
    GM's negotiating team cost them billions but no doubt got a handsome bonus....

    In all seriousness, the main goal was to make the UAW to give up on three plants and have them deemed permanently closed. That was a huge win.
    All the rest was a side show.
    Last edited by jpd80; 01-04-2020 at 07:05 PM.

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    Re: CY2019 - RAM > Silverado 10.1%: How It Happened

    The UAW members voted to authorize a strike weeks before the UAW leadership walked into the room to begin negotiations. They were striking no matter what GM did or said.

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    Re: CY2019 - RAM > Silverado 10.1%: How It Happened

    Quote Originally Posted by jpd80 View Post

    In all seriousness, the main goal was to make the UAW to give up on three plants and have them deemed permanently closed. That was a huge win.
    All the rest was a side show.
    Because GM can't design class leading vehicles that people line up to buy.
    GM has been shrinking this way for decades now.
    Where is a Colorado based SUV for example?
    New full sized van?
    Euro van?
    Wrangler fighter?
    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyDiablo View Post
    The UAW members voted to authorize a strike weeks before the UAW leadership walked into the room to begin negotiations. They were striking no matter what GM did or said.
    News flash, the members vote to authorize a strike EVERY time during national negotiations.
    GM intentionally violated the previous agreement. Part of the new agreement was for the UAW to drop 2 lawsuits against GM for breech of contract.

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    Re: CY2019 - RAM > Silverado 10.1%: How It Happened

    How did it happen? The Silverado looks like crap, as if it was designed in 20 seconds. The interior is also underwhelming.
    GM under Mary Barra has gotten lazier than it's ever been and they don't have the guts or will to beat the competition.

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    Re: CY2019 - RAM > Silverado 10.1%: How It Happened

    Quote Originally Posted by Perian View Post
    Question for GM management: How the heck did you fail to notice this trend?
    Too busy watching Wall St.

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    Re: CY2019 - RAM > Silverado 10.1%: How It Happened

    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyDiablo View Post
    The UAW members voted to authorize a strike weeks before the UAW leadership walked into the room to begin negotiations. They were striking no matter what GM did or said.
    I just saw Lowboy's post above so already answered - sorry.

    https://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/20...horize-strike/
    On Monday, the UAW released the results of the strike authorization vote — a normal part of the lead-up to bargaining.

    Each member of the Detroit Three voted overwhelmingly to use a potential strike as a bargaining chip, with GM workers slightly more inclined to walk the picket line than the other two. The finally tally was 96.4 percent at GM, 96 percent at FCA, and 95.98 percent at Ford.
    Last edited by jpd80; 01-05-2020 at 01:40 AM.

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    Re: CY2019 - RAM > Silverado 10.1%: How It Happened

    Quote Originally Posted by Lowboy View Post
    Because GM can't design class leading vehicles that people line up to buy.
    GM has been shrinking this way for decades now.
    Where is a Colorado based SUV for example?
    New full sized van?
    Euro van?
    Wrangler fighter?

    .
    ^^This.^^ Hits the nail squarely on the head. Also I might add, better midsize and compact cars that actually compete and are not just an also ran in their segments. This last part goes from everything to features/content, styling, and pricing. IMO of course.

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    Re: CY2019 - RAM > Silverado 10.1%: How It Happened

    There´s one detail that differs GM from Ford and RAM.

    GM doesn´t have CGI as a block material in their trucks.

    Ford has CGI in the 6.7 Power Stroke the 3 liter V6 diesel and both 3 liter and 2,7 liter Petrol V6
    RAM has CGI in the 6.7 l Cummins diesel and the 3 l V6 diesel from VM Motori.
    GM intended to have CGI in the Baby Duramax 4,5 l V8 but cancelled the order during the economic downturn in 2008.
    Time Please!!
    The current Duramax 6,6 l V8 have reached it´s limits due to the old grey iron.

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    Re: CY2019 - RAM > Silverado 10.1%: How It Happened

    Just drove a 2020 GMC Elevation w/3.0L diesel 4wd. For comparable trim levels from Ford and Ram I didn't see the huge, obvious faults of the GMC. The diesel ran very well and in a short 6 mile trip showed 32 mpg. I didn't notice any shudder from the ride and the section of freeway i was on had visible waves in it.

    Looking at the last year sales figures, Chevy only lost 4k in 1500 sales and over 10k in the slower selling HD trucks. With a new HD model coming out last year that could be expected. GM has traditionally sold a greater percentage of 1/2 tons compared to Ford and Ram so the 1/2 ton Chevy sales so many whine about might not have been as weak as the haters want to believe. Ram may not have actually sold more 1/2 tons than Chevy, but since they don't separate sales like GM we won't know that fact. GM definitely sold more 1/2 tons of that supposedly crappy truck than Ram did and for most of the year at higher prices. Many want to praise that outdated Tundra that sells a quarter of what Chevy sells.

    BTW those that insist on thinking that the Ram has IRS, you are absolutely wrong.

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    Re: CY2019 - RAM > Silverado 10.1%: How It Happened

    Quote Originally Posted by steve333 View Post
    How did it happen? The Silverado looks like crap, as if it was designed in 20 seconds. The interior is also underwhelming.
    GM under Mary Barra has gotten lazier than it's ever been and they don't have the guts or will to beat the competition.
    WAIT A MINUTE!! Haven't you seen the new CHEVROLET lettering thingie bisecting the grille? How about that, huh? Huh?

    Quote Originally Posted by CGiron View Post
    There´s one detail that differs GM from Ford and RAM.

    GM doesn´t have CGI as a block material in their trucks.

    Ford has CGI in the 6.7 Power Stroke the 3 liter V6 diesel and both 3 liter and 2,7 liter Petrol V6
    RAM has CGI in the 6.7 l Cummins diesel and the 3 l V6 diesel from VM Motori.
    GM intended to have CGI in the Baby Duramax 4,5 l V8 but cancelled the order during the economic downturn in 2008.
    Time Please!!
    The current Duramax 6,6 l V8 have reached it´s limits due to the old grey iron.
    In case you're an un-hep cat vis a vis CGI, like me, here:


    From the May 2014 Issue of Car and Driver
    At this year’s Detroit auto show, Ford’s F-150 nabbed headlines with its courageous move from steel to aluminum for the entire cab and bed, potentially saving hundreds of pounds. Equally courageous, but less reported, is Ford’s choice of ma*teri*als for the 2015 F-150’s 2.7-liter twin-turbocharged “Nano” V-6 engine: It has a cast-iron cylinder block.

    Conventional wisdom says that iron is too heavy for modern cars and trucks. Ford’s first manufacturing genius, Charles “Cast-Iron Charlie” Sorensen, earned his nickname by integrating the Model T’s major engine and transmission components into just a few castings. But during the past two decades, engineers have systematically switched blocks and heads from iron to aluminum to save weight.

    So why the seemingly retrograde move to an iron block for the F-150’s 2.7-liter V-6, especially when this truck’s three optional engines all have aluminum blocks and heads? Because iron makes the most sense from an engineering perspective, and the most cents for the Ford Motor Company.

    In the 1950s, metallurgists began developing cast iron vastly superior to the Model T stuff. All cast iron is a mix of iron and graphite (carbon) with smidgens of other elements to fine-tune its physical properties. Basic gray iron is great for frying pans. Stronger malleable iron makes excellent crankshafts. Nodular iron has higher tensile strength and hardness, ideal for gears and camshafts. The best stuff is compacted graphite iron (CGI), which falls between gray and nodular iron in strength and stiffness while providing greater resistance to fatigue cracks.

    Under the gaze of an electron microscope, the graphite clusters in CGI look like coral tentacles. These entangled curlicues grip the surrounding iron matrix, in contrast to gray iron’s thin flakes and nodular iron’s spherical clumps. CGI also excels in thermal conductivity and internal-damping characteristics. The intrinsic damping helps minimize engine noise and vibration.

    When European high-speed trains suffered brake-rotor heat-checking and cracking, CGI saved the day. It’s the material of choice for exhaust manifolds, turbocharger housings, and flywheels. Hardworking turbo-diesel engines and NASCAR racers have had CGI blocks for years.

    Since iron is three times denser than aluminum, the F-150’s engine block is in*evi*tably heavier than if it were cast from recycled beer cans, but there are offsets to consider. Since CGI is stronger and tougher, block walls can be thinner and main bearing saddles narrower, trimming overall engine length and weight. Engineers cleverly designed what Ford calls a two-piece block with the iron sandwiched between aluminum heads and a thick die-cast-aluminum “ladder frame.” The oil pan is molded plastic. No cylinder liners or expensive bore-surface treatments are needed inside the strong CGI, a significant cost savings.

    Because Ford is using CGI, its new V-6 is tougher, more *compact, and less expensive than the all-aluminum alternative. In other words, this is an excellent way to counterbalance the extra cost of the F-150’s aluminum cab and bed. Cast-Iron Charlie would *definitely approve.

    https://www.caranddriver.com/feature...ve-2015-f-150/
    Last edited by Neanderthal; 01-05-2020 at 12:24 PM.
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    Re: CY2019 - RAM > Silverado 10.1%: How It Happened

    Give the Silverado and Sierra the Ram interior and they would be killing it. It really IS just the interior that is the problem.

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