Ruess comments on C8 Corvette encrypted ECU

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Thread: Ruess comments on C8 Corvette encrypted ECU

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    Ruess comments on C8 Corvette encrypted ECU

    https://www.autoblog.com/2019/06/04/...Bzi83_zM1hncZw











    Muscle Cars & Trucks reported a few days ago on the advanced encryption written into the ECU in the 2020 Chevrolet Corvette. The condensed version is that, according to the outlet's source, "successfully flash-tuning, reprogramming and otherwise altering the engine control unit to increase power output will be next to impossible." During the reveal event for the Cadillac CT4-V and CT5-V, MCT asked GM President Mark Reuss about the Corvette's new Global B electrical architecture, which is shared with the new Cadillacs, and about that ECU.

    The context is that the Global B system has been designed to serve the next decade of GM vehicles, capable of supporting advanced driver aids like Super Cruise, full autonomy, far greater and constant connectivity that enables features such as over-the-air updates, the growing importance of cloud computing, and electric vehicles. Reuss' comments have to do with the primary threat to such a system: hacking. Calling the cybersecurity component "very, very robust," Reuss told MCT, "Global B I think is going to be the standard of the industry in terms of the encrypted messaging that travels on our bus between modules. There's a clean side and dirty side to that."

    That includes the C8 Corvette, naturally, which brings us to the Reuss' pertinent comment about that ECU: "I don't wanna cut anybody out from an aftermarket standpoint, but we have to pick and choose who are the good guys."

    We didn't speak to Reuss about the matter, so we aren't sure if we're missing anything about that line. Taken by itself, the line makes less sense the more we think about it.

    As we discussed in the first post, GM has gotten cleverer at making life difficult for the aftermarket lately, if not exactly cutting tuners out. The ECU in GM's 2017 trucks with the L5P Duramax diesel took two years to crack, and it would be truer to call the tuner's result a rebuilt chip. The E99 ECU in the 2019 Corvette ZR1 took a year to crack to rebuild, rather, by the same tuners who'd worked the Duramax ECU.

    And as MCT points out, certain 2019-model-year GM trucks are still waiting on aftermarket tuning solutions. One forum member said he spoke to a principal at a popular truck tuner last week and was told, "he can tune the 5.3L AFM [Active Fuel Management] with 6 speed auto - no go on the 5.3L DFM [Dynamic Fuel Management] with 8 speed auto. Not now and possibly not ever."

    As for choosing who are the good guys, we don't recall seeing GM anoint aftermarket upgrades beyond in-house efforts from GM Performance Motor, Chevrolet Performance, and the like. But hey, anything is possible. Given the encryption tools GM would have with a brand new, dedicated platform GM consulted with the military on, who knows how many flaming hoops will be involved in cracking the C8 Corvette code, or what kind of digital red carpets will be rolled out for the good guys. For the not-so-good guys and their customers, though, breaking in likely won't be easy, nor quick, nor cheap.
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    Re: Ruess comments on C8 Corvette encrypted ECU

    Big Mother's going to give you 'updates' over the air whether you want them or not. Will it also feed your rate of speed to the local constabulary? Seems only a matter of time now.

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    Re: Ruess comments on C8 Corvette encrypted ECU

    If you think hacking that is "impossible", you are either clueless on how computers work or you totally underestimate the people out there. Either way, you are in for a big, big surprise.
    it will be harder in the beginning, but there is no lock that cant be picked.
    Also, not providing the key to that encryption so people can play with their cars is simply stupid, I bought it, it is mine, let me do whatever I please. I see a rise in the second hand market value for the current vettes. Just because of that, I wouldn't own one.

    Who comes with these ideas at GM, is there a fart room they go into, spend the day and then they compare who has the most stupid idea?

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    Re: Ruess comments on C8 Corvette encrypted ECU

    Quote Originally Posted by KingElv!s View Post
    Big Mother's going to give you 'updates' over the air whether you want them or not. Will it also feed your rate of speed to the local constabulary? Seems only a matter of time now.
    Just wrap your ECU in tinfoil:


    Quote Originally Posted by canadian.bacon View Post
    If you think hacking that is "impossible", you are either clueless on how computers work or you totally underestimate the people out there. Either way, you are in for a big, big surprise.
    it will be harder in the beginning, but there is no lock that cant be picked.
    Also, not providing the key to that encryption so people can play with their cars is simply stupid, I bought it, it is mine, let me do whatever I please. I see a rise in the second hand market value for the current vettes. Just because of that, I wouldn't own one.

    Who comes with these ideas at GM, is there a fart room they go into, spend the day and then they compare who has the most stupid idea?
    Ah...that's the reason why you won't buy a C8. Got it. There's a huge liability in exposing the ECU to outside influence, cars are more integrated than ever...this lockdown was inevitable.
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    Re: Ruess comments on C8 Corvette encrypted ECU

    Quote Originally Posted by KingElv!s View Post
    Big Mother's going to give you 'updates' over the air whether you want them or not. Will it also feed your rate of speed to the local constabulary? Seems only a matter of time now.
    I guarantee that GM shared the codes with the Chicoms as a condition of doing "business".
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    Re: Ruess comments on C8 Corvette encrypted ECU

    Ah...indeed, since I buy a performance car and I cant tinker with it, yes, it is a pretty big reason not to buy it. It is one thing to make it more secure from outside interference and another thing to stop me from changing the tune. Then what I buy it is not 100% mine.
    How about you buy this Vette, but you cant leave the state, cause GM will disable the throttle once you cross the state line.

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    Re: Ruess comments on C8 Corvette encrypted ECU

    Quote Originally Posted by canadian.bacon View Post
    How about you buy this Vette, but you cant leave the state, cause GM will disable the throttle once you cross the state line.
    Onstar has had that capability for many years. How often have you ever heard about it being enacted?
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    Re: Ruess comments on C8 Corvette encrypted ECU

    GM doesn't want "perfection" after thousands of hours testing screwed with. Or have to counter litigate because some airhead thought he had a better idea, screwed the pooch and is railing on GM cause his car "broke".
    Beyond me why you would part with $100K only to mess with factory settings to prove you are an idiot. If the car approaches 200 MPH out of the box the point of 2010 MPH is what? If it dedicated for track use, contact GM Performance. Out on the street you are asking for a wallet busting fine and 90 in the pokey. But of course there are always morons who have more money than brains and "KNOW" they can beat the system and are in it just for the yucks. God Bless.
    Last edited by criticalmass; 06-05-2019 at 03:45 PM.

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    Re: Ruess comments on C8 Corvette encrypted ECU

    There will always be brain-dead bozos that want to buck the system.

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    Re: Ruess comments on C8 Corvette encrypted ECU

    Quote Originally Posted by KingElv!s View Post
    Big Mother's going to give you 'updates' over the air whether you want them or not. Will it also feed your rate of speed to the local constabulary? Seems only a matter of time now.
    The tinfoil crowd has been saying that since the introduction of OnStar.

    Quote Originally Posted by canadian.bacon View Post
    If you think hacking that is "impossible", you are either clueless on how computers work or you totally underestimate the people out there. Either way, you are in for a big, big surprise.
    it will be harder in the beginning, but there is no lock that cant be picked.
    Also, not providing the key to that encryption so people can play with their cars is simply stupid, I bought it, it is mine, let me do whatever I please. I see a rise in the second hand market value for the current vettes. Just because of that, I wouldn't own one.

    Who comes with these ideas at GM, is there a fart room they go into, spend the day and then they compare who has the most stupid idea?
    What color C8 did you plan on buying before you learned about this?
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    Re: Ruess comments on C8 Corvette encrypted ECU

    Quote Originally Posted by canadian.bacon View Post
    If you think hacking that is "impossible", you are either clueless on how computers work or you totally underestimate the people out there. Either way, you are in for a big, big surprise.
    it will be harder in the beginning, but there is no lock that cant be picked.
    Also, not providing the key to that encryption so people can play with their cars is simply stupid, I bought it, it is mine, let me do whatever I please. I see a rise in the second hand market value for the current vettes. Just because of that, I wouldn't own one.

    Who comes with these ideas at GM, is there a fart room they go into, spend the day and then they compare who has the most stupid idea?
    Yep. And, the reward is huge. First one to crack the Corvette gets the gold...

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    Re: Ruess comments on C8 Corvette encrypted ECU

    Just another money grab from GM, Tesla actually gives updates for free that improve their cars and also for certain problems. GM will say, you want new features, buy a new car sucka!

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    Re: Ruess comments on C8 Corvette encrypted ECU

    If given the choice of my car being hacked while I'm driving it or not being able to modify my engine, I choose encryption that will hopefully keep the hackers out. I don't want someone taking over my car. Nor would I trust after market parts makers with my encryption key. And does anyone think the other major manufacturers aren't going to do the same thing?

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    Re: Ruess comments on C8 Corvette encrypted ECU

    Quote Originally Posted by canadian.bacon View Post
    If you think hacking that is "impossible", you are either clueless on how computers work or you totally underestimate the people out there. Either way, you are in for a big, big surprise.
    it will be harder in the beginning, but there is no lock that cant be picked.
    Also, not providing the key to that encryption so people can play with their cars is simply stupid, I bought it, it is mine, let me do whatever I please. I see a rise in the second hand market value for the current vettes. Just because of that, I wouldn't own one.

    Who comes with these ideas at GM, is there a fart room they go into, spend the day and then they compare who has the most stupid idea?
    So why doesn't the "I bought its mine" hold water with computer programmes or downloads like iTunes?

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    Re: Ruess comments on C8 Corvette encrypted ECU

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackGTP View Post
    If given the choice of my car being hacked while I'm driving it or not being able to modify my engine, I choose encryption that will hopefully keep the hackers out. I don't want someone taking over my car. Nor would I trust after market parts makers with my encryption key. And does anyone think the other major manufacturers aren't going to do the same thing?
    The thought occurs to me that a hard shutoff switch might be worthwhile in vehicles subject to hacking. If all else fails, killing the engine could prevent much worse outcomes.

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