QOTD: “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice."

  1. Welcome to GM Inside News Forum – General discussion forum for GM

    Welcome to GM Inside News Forum - a website dedicated to all things GM.

    You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, at no cost, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, Join GM Inside News Forum today!
     
Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 52

Thread: QOTD: “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice."

  1. #1
    News Contributor Premium Member Perian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    8,268
    Thanks
    78
    Thanked 2,807 Times in 1,044 Posts
    My Ride
    2017 Jaguar F-Type (Manual)

    QOTD: “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice."

    The Wall Street Journal
    November 3, 2019

    A little-known Chinese company has become the world’s biggest maker of electric vehicle batteries.

    Beijing engineered a scenario that didn’t give the world much choice.

    China is by far the biggest EV market, and to boost its standing in the fast-growing industry, China began pressuring foreign auto makers to use locally-made batteries in the country several years ago. One company—Contemporary Amperex Technology Ltd., known as CATL—was the only shop capable of producing them at scale.

    Auto makers weren’t pleased, but they fell in line. During a visit to CATL headquarters in 2017, three Daimler AG executives displayed their irritation shortly after the meeting started, recalled Jiang Lingfeng, then a CATL project manager who prepared a technical briefing for the visitors.

    One Daimler executive cut off his briefing, said Mr. Jiang. “We’re not interested,” the executive said, according to Mr. Jiang. “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice, so let’s just talk about the price.”
    China accounted for 60% of the 2.1 million electric vehicles sold world-wide last year. By 2030, global plug-in car sales are expected to be between 23 million and 43 million annually, according to the International Energy Agency. In its highest estimate, EVs will comprise 57% of vehicle sales in China, 26% in Europe and 8% in the U.S.

    To meet demand, auto makers will need millions of lithium-ion batteries—by far the most lucrative part of an EV.

    Leading the charge is CATL, which became the world’s biggest EV battery maker by installed production capacity this year—the number of battery factories and their combined scale—according to Benchmark Minerals Intelligence, a research firm. CATL modeled itself after another Chinese company, telecommunications giant Huawei Technologies Co., copying its departmental structures and culture of demanding workloads, employees said. CATL also mimicked Huawei’s practice of prioritizing research and development to deliver frequent technology improvements.
    So how the heck did Tesla get an almost non-stop government green light in setting up their new Chinese assembly plant??? Here is a possible explanation:


    Bloomberg News (BREAKING STORY) - November 5, 2019
    Tesla Inc. has reached a preliminary agreement to start using CATL as a battery supplier for cars made in China from as early as next year, and the companies are in talks to expand the relationship globally, according to people familiar with the matter.

    Following months of negotiations, the companies clinched a non-binding deal after Tesla Chief Executive Officer Elon Musk traveled to Shanghai in late August and met with CATL Chairman Zeng Yuqun for about 40 minutes, according to the people, who asked not to be named discussing private deliberations. Though a final agreement is expected to be signed by mid 2020, there is no guarantee that will happen, the people said.

    The batteries would go into Model 3 cars produced at Tesla’s factory near Shanghai, which is slated to begin operating this year. But the companies still need to iron out details such as how many batteries Tesla will purchase, and separate discussions are underway on a potential global supply contract, the people said. Tesla will use batteries from Panasonic Corp. and LG Chem Ltd. in China in the meantime, one of the people said.

  2. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Perian For This Useful Post:

    Self Reliance (11-05-2019),skylark68 (11-07-2019)

  3. Remove Advertisements
    GM Inside News
    Advertisements
     

  4. #2
    News Contributor Premium Member Perian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    8,268
    Thanks
    78
    Thanked 2,807 Times in 1,044 Posts
    My Ride
    2017 Jaguar F-Type (Manual)

    Re: QOTD: “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice."

    One Daimler executive cut off his briefing, said Mr. Jiang. “We’re not interested,” the executive said, according to Mr. Jiang. “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice, so let’s just talk about the price.”
    So we've done a great job keeping Chinese cars out of our market through various means...however, when no one was watching, they have managed to basically corner the market for the most important future automotive component...the battery. Hats off the the Chinese if they can fulfill their goal here of being the worlds largest producer of automotive battery components.

    Absolutely love that quote from the Mercedes executive above...









    .

  5. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Perian For This Useful Post:

    BlackGTP (11-05-2019),jzchev28 (11-07-2019),Self Reliance (11-05-2019),TruckMan (11-06-2019)

  6. #3
    2.4 Liter SIDI ECOTEC Self Reliance's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Location
    Occupied Lenapehoking
    Posts
    268
    Thanks
    243
    Thanked 80 Times in 59 Posts

    Re: QOTD: “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice."

    China accounted for 60% of the 2.1 million electric vehicles sold world-wide last year. By 2030, global plug-in car sales are expected to be between 23 million and 43 million annually, according to the International Energy Agency. In its highest estimate, EVs will comprise 57% of vehicle sales in China, 26% in Europe and 8% in the U.S.
    In 2018 about 86 million cars were sold worldwide, about 28 million were sold in China. So China is about 33% of the global car market but buys 60% of the EVs. China is serious about getting clean, that's for sure.

    Xi Jinping discusses it at length here, I'd love to quote the article but it is filled with gems that it isn't fair to it, but here's a few:
    Humanity is a community with a shared future, and thus protecting the environment is a challenge and a duty which all of us around the globe must face together. If development of an ecological civilization goes smoothly, it will be an achievement of Chinese socialism, otherwise the reverse will be used as an excuse by forces with hidden agendas to attack us. After humanity entered the industrial age, traditional industrialization unfolded at an incredible pace.
    In over two centuries of modernization, no more than 30 countries have industrialized, with a combined population of less than a billion. China is the world’s largest developing country with a population of more than 1.3 billion, and therefore our efforts to build an ecological civilization and turn China into a strong and modern socialist country that is prosperous, democratic, civilized, harmonious, and beautiful will be global in their impact.
    In all things, we must act according to the will of the public. The environment is crucial to the wellbeing of the public, since blue skies and verdant surroundings allow us to feel the beauty and joy of life. Just as economic development is for the wellbeing of the people, so is environmental protection. In addition to creating more material and cultural wealth to meet people’s growing needs for a better life, we need also to provide more quality ecological goods to meet people’s growing demands for a beautiful environment.
    When the nation is this laser focused, embraces scientific facts and acknowledges its responsibilities, it is expected of them to lead, and rightfully so.

    Quote Originally Posted by Perian
    So we've done a great job keeping Chinese cars out of our market through various means...however, when no one was watching, they have managed to basically corner the market for the most important future automotive component...the battery. Hats off the the Chinese if they can fulfill their goal here of being the worlds largest producer of automotive battery components.
    中国万岁
    Last edited by Self Reliance; 11-05-2019 at 08:39 PM.
    26 + 6 = 1

  7. Remove Advertisements
    GM Inside News
    Advertisements
     

  8. #4
    Chevrolet VOLT Premium Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    The land of the hethan
    Posts
    10,251
    Thanks
    1,482
    Thanked 3,511 Times in 2,291 Posts
    My Ride
    The coffin on wheels

    Re: QOTD: “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice."

    Quote Originally Posted by Perian View Post
    So we've done a great job keeping Chinese cars out of our market through various means...however, when no one was watching, they have managed to basically corner the market for the most important future automotive component...the battery. Hats off the the Chinese if they can fulfill their goal here of being the worlds largest producer of automotive battery components.

    Absolutely love that quote from the Mercedes executive abov.
    China is making itself into the new era equivalent of the OPEC Cartel,
    OEMs worried about them stealing IP and they've already stolen the future.
    Last edited by jpd80; 11-05-2019 at 10:09 PM.

  9. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to jpd80 For This Useful Post:

    BlackGTP (11-06-2019),eklauss (11-06-2019),Extreme4x4 (11-05-2019),Mr.Buttons (11-05-2019)

  10. #5
    2.4 Liter SIDI ECOTEC Self Reliance's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Location
    Occupied Lenapehoking
    Posts
    268
    Thanks
    243
    Thanked 80 Times in 59 Posts

    Re: QOTD: “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice."

    Quote Originally Posted by jpd80 View Post
    China is making itself into the new era equivalent of the OPEC Cartel,
    OEMs worried about them stealing IP and they've already stolen the future.
    Alan Kay once said "The best way to predict the future is to invent it", and that's what they did. America can maybe try clean-coal powered cars or something
    26 + 6 = 1

  11. The Following User Says Thank You to Self Reliance For This Useful Post:

    richmond2000 (11-06-2019)

  12. #6
    3.6 Liter SIDI V6 Mr.Buttons's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Location
    In my room
    Posts
    1,176
    Thanks
    1,265
    Thanked 692 Times in 403 Posts

    Re: QOTD: “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice."

    Quote Originally Posted by Perian View Post
    So we've done a great job keeping Chinese cars out of our market through various means...however, when no one was watching, they have managed to basically corner the market for the most important future automotive component...the battery. Hats off the the Chinese if they can fulfill their goal here of being the worlds largest producer of automotive battery components.

    Absolutely love that quote from the Mercedes executive above...









    .
    And here we have everyone and their Moms demanding that we all have,no need electric cars. I can't wait to see the disaster this turns out to be with the China controlling the key to everyone's range limited freedom.

  13. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Mr.Buttons For This Useful Post:

    eklauss (11-06-2019),richmond2000 (11-06-2019),skylark68 (11-07-2019)

  14. #7
    2.4 Liter SIDI ECOTEC Self Reliance's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Location
    Occupied Lenapehoking
    Posts
    268
    Thanks
    243
    Thanked 80 Times in 59 Posts

    Re: QOTD: “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice."

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Buttons View Post
    And here we have everyone and their Moms demanding that we all have,no need electric cars. I can't wait to see the disaster this turns out to be with the China controlling the key to everyone's range limited freedom.
    How is this China's fault if the rest of the world are resting on their laurels? Unlike you I trust the Chinese, and better them than [redacted]
    26 + 6 = 1

  15. #8
    Chevrolet VOLT Premium Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    The land of the hethan
    Posts
    10,251
    Thanks
    1,482
    Thanked 3,511 Times in 2,291 Posts
    My Ride
    The coffin on wheels

    Re: QOTD: “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice."

    Quote Originally Posted by Self Reliance View Post
    Unlike you I trust the Chinese
    as the guys on southpark say, "they're takin' err jebs....."

  16. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to jpd80 For This Useful Post:

    jzchev28 (11-07-2019),Self Reliance (11-06-2019)

  17. #9
    2.8 Liter Turbocharged V6 hydrogen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    DFW, TX
    Posts
    879
    Thanks
    123
    Thanked 478 Times in 221 Posts

    Re: QOTD: “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice."

    Isn't China sitting on massive rare earth metal reserves? China leading EV battery production was inevitable. This development shouldn't be shocking news.

  18. The Following User Says Thank You to hydrogen For This Useful Post:

    TruckMan (11-06-2019)

  19. #10
    3.6 Liter SIDI V6 Mr.Buttons's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Location
    In my room
    Posts
    1,176
    Thanks
    1,265
    Thanked 692 Times in 403 Posts

    Re: QOTD: “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice."

    Quote Originally Posted by Self Reliance View Post
    How is this China's fault if the rest of the world are resting on their laurels? Unlike you I trust the Chinese, and better them than [redacted]
    I'm not blaming China for anything.

    I'm glad you trust China and not [redacted].
    Last edited by Mr.Buttons; 11-06-2019 at 05:09 AM.

  20. The Following User Says Thank You to Mr.Buttons For This Useful Post:

    TruckMan (11-06-2019)

  21. #11
    3.6 Liter SIDI V6 Mr.Buttons's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Location
    In my room
    Posts
    1,176
    Thanks
    1,265
    Thanked 692 Times in 403 Posts

    Re: QOTD: “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice."

    Quote Originally Posted by hydrogen View Post
    Isn't China sitting on massive rare earth metal reserves? China leading EV battery production was inevitable. This development shouldn't be shocking news.
    I hope that pun was intentional.

  22. The Following User Says Thank You to Mr.Buttons For This Useful Post:

    BlackGTP (11-06-2019)

  23. #12
    News Contributor BlackGTP's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    13,909
    Thanks
    5,485
    Thanked 7,835 Times in 3,943 Posts
    My Ride
    2013 Cadillac ATS - Black

    Re: QOTD: “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice."

    Quote Originally Posted by Self Reliance View Post
    How is this China's fault if the rest of the world are resting on their laurels? Unlike you I trust the Chinese, and better them than [redacted]
    This is the most [redacted].

  24. The Following User Says Thank You to BlackGTP For This Useful Post:

    Mr.Buttons (11-07-2019)

  25. #13
    2.4 Liter SIDI ECOTEC
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    102
    Thanks
    7
    Thanked 44 Times in 22 Posts

    Re: QOTD: “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice."

    Quote Originally Posted by Self Reliance View Post
    How is this China's fault if the rest of the world are resting on their laurels? Unlike you I trust the Chinese, and better them than [redacted]
    How is the rest of the world "resting on their laurels"? The Chinese have copied and stolen just about anything they can get their hands on. Look how much they have basically stolen just from GM in the use of domestic "partnerships".

    I guess if you want to talk about human rights abuses, concentration camps, brutal repression of peaceful protesters, stealing resources from other nations (belt and road), and imperialist intents with regards to the South China Sea, then I would have to say they are doing a much better job then any other country.

  26. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to stealthregal For This Useful Post:

    Ed753 (Yesterday),eklauss (11-06-2019),posaune (11-06-2019)

  27. #14
    2.4 Liter SIDI ECOTEC Self Reliance's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Location
    Occupied Lenapehoking
    Posts
    268
    Thanks
    243
    Thanked 80 Times in 59 Posts

    Re: QOTD: “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice."

    Quote Originally Posted by stealthregal View Post
    How is the rest of the world "resting on their laurels"? The Chinese have copied and stolen just about anything they can get their hands on. Look how much they have basically stolen just from GM in the use of domestic "partnerships".
    IP is such a silly thing to believe in my friend. But if you do believe in IP, America too stole patents and designs when it was the up and coming industrial country. I say more power to the Chinese.

    Quote Originally Posted by stealthregal View Post
    I guess if you want to talk about human rights abuses, concentration camps, brutal repression of peaceful protesters, stealing resources from other nations (belt and road), and imperialist intents with regards to the South China Sea, then I would have to say they are doing a much better job then any other country.
    To quote our president "There are a lot of killers. You think our country's so innocent?".
    Last edited by Self Reliance; 11-06-2019 at 10:51 AM. Reason: there's no need for this thread to become yet another political discussion
    26 + 6 = 1

  28. The Following User Says Thank You to Self Reliance For This Useful Post:

    Mr.Buttons (11-07-2019)

  29. #15
    emh
    emh is offline
    7.0 Liter LS7 V8 emh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    4,542
    Thanks
    333
    Thanked 1,043 Times in 558 Posts

    Re: QOTD: “The only reason we’re here is that we have no choice."

    Quote Originally Posted by Perian View Post
    So we've done a great job keeping Chinese cars out of our market through various means...however, when no one was watching, they have managed to basically corner the market for the most important future automotive component...the battery. Hats off the the Chinese if they can fulfill their goal here of being the worlds largest producer of automotive battery components.
    China is also investing heavily in fuel cells (I think there's another thread here on that too). They are basically investing in everything that could be important for the future of energy.

    Meanwhile, the US should be well-positioned to lead the world when the global energy economy reverts back to coal, which ought to happen any day now.
    "The irony of the Information Age is that it has given new respectability to uninformed opinion" -- John Lawton

  30. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to emh For This Useful Post:

    Mr.Buttons (11-07-2019),richmond2000 (11-07-2019)

  31. Remove Advertisements
    GM Inside News
    Advertisements
     

Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 3 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 3 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v4.1.2