Happening Now

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Thread: Happening Now

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    Happening Now

    Happening Now
    Febuary 20, 2006
    www.gminsidenews.com



    Chevrolet Dealers not Happy About Saturn. Sibling rivalry seems to be going on between Chevrolet and Saturn. Many bow-tie dealerships are upset because GM is investing so much into Saturn, which in turn is taking away from Chevrolet. Read more... https://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=27230

    Ethanol Gains Support. With the recent launch of GM's "Live Green, Go Yellow" campaign for use of E85 Ethanol-capable vehicles, support for the fuel has started to increase. Could GM have tapped into a hot new trend? Time will tell. Get the full story here... https://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=27187

    Ready for G5? It's been confirmed that Pontiac is bringing a Cobalt-based small car to the States. What are your thoughts on the plans? Tell us... https://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=26910

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    6.2 Liter LS9 Supercharged V8 MonteCarloSS86's Avatar
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    Re: Happening Now

    Great news about Ethanol being bragged about by GM but the G5 has me worried- It'll probably just be a major rebadge. The picture of that Impala jumped out at me though, lol.
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    Re: Happening Now

    That Chevy-Saturn stuff is dumb. You should of really put in that article with the Outlook news and the Astra. The Astra is coming and THATS news! I cant wait to see those at the dealer down the road, i'm hoping they'll bring the diesels along with em' too.
    BTW, The Impala looks pretty good there, not so bland as it sometimes looks.

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    GMI Staff Member Premium Member nadepalma's Avatar
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    Re: Happening Now

    The Chevy/Saturn bit shouldn't be a rivalry at all -- fact is that Chevy is GM's bread n' butter sedan and appeal to those folks who want an American brand. Saturn on the other hand is typically purchased by those who wouldn't step foot in a GM showroom. Fact is that GM needs Saturn to attract those types of customers -- Chevy just can't appeal to those folks at the moment. And since Saturn is as much about a buying experience as it is about buying a car, GM would be foolish to get rid of them or hinder their expansion in any way. Fact is that now that GM is giving Saturn some real product, they should do even better.
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    Re: Happening Now

    You know what the Cayanne has more than a passing resemblance to the Toureg. Now they are coming out with an Audi version.

    If GM can bring out a Pontiac coupe to get some of the Sunfire, Probe, Prelude, Cougar, MR2 and ahahahah Escort EXZ whatever people satisfied, I say more power to them.

    I hope it looks more like a Solstice and less like a Cobalt but if not oh well. GM could have had the gold but it went for the bronze.

    Nevertheless, while GM is in the market share race of its life if the G5/Sunfire can take 100,000 in sales away from the Scions and imports, so be it.

    For every G5 that would be 1 less Scion I have to look at.
    Last edited by ethayes; 02-20-2006 at 09:23 PM.

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    Re: Happening Now

    Those of the Chevy dealers that are crying b/c GM is paying/investing more attention to Saturn(the baby division of them all), should stop their crying. GM has given Chevy new vehicles in their division over the past year & now its time for some of that attention to be given to another child in the family.
    Chevy dealers have a new Aveo, Impala/Monte Carlo & a freshened Malibu along w/new SUV's & the new Avalanche. So they have no reason to be crying their collective eyes out making an unnecessary river of tears.

    I hope that the G5 gets a name change. It needs it badly. I also hope that the "G5" has the design philosophy in line w/the Solstice as should all other future Pontiac's have for the forseeable future, save for maybe the GTO & even the Firebird should it return to the market along the Camaro. The Design should be as different as the Sunfire was to the Cavalier, unlike the Sunbird to the Cavalier. The latter corp. cousins were just straight up rebadges of each other. The Sunfire had a definite different look to it that the Cavalier had. The Sunfire's lines & all were "inspired", I would think, by the Firebird/Trans Am's lines & all.

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    I am not happy either.. what about Pontiac!

    Chevrolet dealers are the wrong approach to handling solely this Japanese threat ... both Saturn and Pontiac do it better. Saturn is the flavorless reliable and boring. Pontiac is the firece performance affordable side. Chevy is too bland and not tough enough to knock out Japanese models. Besides.. you guys are getting more product soon. Camaro..anyone..

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    Re: Happening Now

    Chevy needs to learn that people who buy VWs and Mazdas DO NOT want a Chevy. Yes it is stupid, and yes it is immature, but all the ad campaigns in the world wont change that. They COULD do it by making some drastic changes to their lineup and image, but then they'd just end up killing their traditional customer base (Olds anyone?).

    The only way to cover both markets is to have two different brands with different images to cover different people. Chevy dealers need to realize that they are a BRAND of GM that won't succeed in EVERY market. Saturn isn't the enemy, the money all ends up in the same place at the end of the day.

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    Re: Happening Now

    For those bitching about Chevy dealers. Remember what division made all the money that is being invested into Saturn. Chevy is GM's biggest money maker AND its volume line. It should get more investment because it is worth more and makes more money. Saturn has yet to turn a profit and is over 10 years old. That means that it has been draining other division's money for years! Would you be upset if you were making all the money and your boss decided that another guy should get some of your money just so that he could do better in the future? D*mn right you would, and rightfully so. All the Chevy hating needs to stop because without Chevy there would be a lot less of EVERYTHING at GM, if it still existed.

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    Re: Happening Now

    Good news on E85, as it seems to currently be one of this country's most viable options...

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    Re: Happening Now

    Quote Originally Posted by nadepalma
    The Chevy/Saturn bit shouldn't be a rivalry at all -- fact is that Chevy is GM's bread n' butter sedan and appeal to those folks who want an American brand. Saturn on the other hand is typically purchased by those who wouldn't step foot in a GM showroom. Fact is that GM needs Saturn to attract those types of customers -- Chevy just can't appeal to those folks at the moment. And since Saturn is as much about a buying experience as it is about buying a car, GM would be foolish to get rid of them or hinder their expansion in any way. Fact is that now that GM is giving Saturn some real product, they should do even better.
    Saturn has never made a dollar for the Corporation. My biggest beef with the "Roger Smith" era of GM (of which Saturn is a legacy) was the effort that was expended to create Saturn which should have been spent on shoring up the existing brands.

    Import intenders and import buyers *would* set foot in a Chevy or Pontiac dealership *if* the base Cavalier or Sunfire (the cars at the time of Saturn's introduction) had the same amount of attention & resources that was applied to Saturn. Same idea with the 'dealer experience'.

    What the h3ll is Saturn's reason for living now? First they were the 'touchy-feely' division, not even a division really... Then, for a while they were the 'entry-level' division... Now they're going to be... what, the BMW fighter divsion?

    Where does Pontiac fit into this? Where does Buick fit into this mess? I can't believe Oldsmobile was axed but Saturn survived only to have a MORE confusing identity than Oldsmobile had before it was canned.

    The Chevy folks are p*ssed, no doubt. I'm sure they watched the minimization of Oldsmobile, and now the herding of Pontiac and Buick (not to mention GMC) into the abbatoir... So that Saturn can be the 'entry-level' 'BMW fighter' division?

    Are we confused yet?

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    Re: Happening Now

    Quote Originally Posted by 91z4me
    For those bitching about Chevy dealers. Remember what division made all the money that is being invested into Saturn. Chevy is GM's biggest money maker AND its volume line. It should get more investment because it is worth more and makes more money. Saturn has yet to turn a profit and is over 10 years old. That means that it has been draining other division's money for years! Would you be upset if you were making all the money and your boss decided that another guy should get some of your money just so that he could do better in the future? D*mn right you would, and rightfully so. All the Chevy hating needs to stop because without Chevy there would be a lot less of EVERYTHING at GM, if it still existed.
    I totally disagree.

    As someone above pointed out earlier, the 'attention' and the designs that Saturn are getting are aimed at a different customer base than Chevrolet has.
    Chevrolet wants the Aura instead of the Malibu? Fine, just make sure your customers are going to know they are giong to pay a few thousand dollars more for it.

    People don't expect to walk into a Chevrolet dealership and pay $26000 for a well equiped Aura (and GM doesn't want them to have to)....they expect to pay $22000 for a well equiped Malibu.

    Chevrolet is viewed as, and is meant to be, the entry level car for GM. Saturn is being slotted above that. Chevrolet doesn't need, nor should not get the cars designated for Saturn. What Chevrolet does need to 'compete' against Toyota is to take the cars it does have and make them better.

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    Re: Happening Now

    Quote Originally Posted by geozinger
    Saturn has never made a dollar for the Corporation. My biggest beef with the "Roger Smith" era of GM (of which Saturn is a legacy) was the effort that was expended to create Saturn which should have been spent on shoring up the existing brands.

    Import intenders and import buyers *would* set foot in a Chevy or Pontiac dealership *if* the base Cavalier or Sunfire (the cars at the time of Saturn's introduction) had the same amount of attention & resources that was applied to Saturn. Same idea with the 'dealer experience'.

    What the h3ll is Saturn's reason for living now? First they were the 'touchy-feely' division, not even a division really... Then, for a while they were the 'entry-level' division... Now they're going to be... what, the BMW fighter divsion?

    Where does Pontiac fit into this? Where does Buick fit into this mess? I can't believe Oldsmobile was axed but Saturn survived only to have a MORE confusing identity than Oldsmobile had before it was canned.

    The Chevy folks are p*ssed, no doubt. I'm sure they watched the minimization of Oldsmobile, and now the herding of Pontiac and Buick (not to mention GMC) into the abbatoir... So that Saturn can be the 'entry-level' 'BMW fighter' division?

    Are we confused yet?

    --
    geozinger
    Some of the things you said about Saturn may be true...but what is important now is not what happened, but what can happen.

    For all of Saturn's failures...there are things that are success stories...they have an extremly high approval ratings from customers....and they aren't viewed as 'typical GM' by many potential customers out there.

    So, for those of us on here who always buy GM products but dont' like Saturn...that is why Chevrolet and Pontiac and Buick exist. Face it...Saturn has to be different than what we all expect and what we want....because it has to attract customers that GM doesn't already have.

    With all that sad, how much money has Saturn made GM? Not sure, probably not a lot. But it is in MUCH better position than any other GM brand to attract 'non-typical' GM customers when you give it some decent cars.

    In that way...Saturn's 'failings' in the past are almost the very things that will allow it to succeed in ways that GM needs it to..in the future.

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    Re: Happening Now

    [
    --
    geozinger[/quote]

    The thing that I'm noticing is that Chevrolet wants to hog it all. Companies like Lamborghini can hog it all because there is no junior division to take care of. And while a company like Lamborghini is a division of Volkswagen, it already had a following.

    Chevy's following has always been that of America's Brand. However, we have witnessed the full advent of front wheel drive shift, the growth of the SUV (and gas prices!), lessening patriotism, and the death of the Camaro. The truth is that if Chevy was everything to every person, then there would have never been a need for ANY of the other divisions.

    Why make a Sierra if you already have a Silverado?
    Why make a Firebird if you already have a Camaro?
    Think about it. The different divisions are for different people. Let's use Toyota for example: Some guy who makes $100k per year and used to own a Camry, do you think Toyota wants to let that customer buy a BMW or Mercedes? Heck no! And that guy's son who is in college and used to drive his dad's Camry, who cannot afford the Camry or anything greater (yet), Toyota doesn't want him to buy a Cavalier, either. Trust me, I am going somewhere with this.

    Chevy is everyman's brand. Now, when that person wants to elevate from a Chevy, would you suggest we send him to Acura? Or for a young girl going off to college, should her first car be a Scion?

    Saturn was created to reach a targeted consumer base that Chevy obviously could not reach, or else they would already have them. Now, I won't deny that Saturn hasn't turned a large scale profit, but like fish in an aquarium, if you don't feed them, then they will die. Let Chevy fight Toyota - leave Saturn to rival Scion and Cadillac to take on Lexus. Chevy needs to be a little more supportive of it's little sister. They also need to stop trying to be something its not...everything. (And this is from a Chevy-faithful guy who owns a 94 Silverado...and loves it!)

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    Re: Happening Now

    As I recall when Saturn was developed, the idea was to build a car to compete with the imports, separate from GM, latest manufacturing techniques, top customer service (car wash with any service ie), sort of an American revolution. Sure seemed to work for several years in spite of the not too appealing cars. Still a good business model but the competition is getting too fierce, especially with the Korean nameplates stealing Saturns customers. I suspect the brand is an endangered species.

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