Most Desperate GM Product

[SierraGS]

While I would not disagree with the current poll leaders Cobalt and Colorado, GM really needs a high MPG small car to go against the Fit/Yaris so I would say it should be the Aveo with an all new model.

The Aveo needs a high MPG engine with good performance, any chance of the 115 HP 1.6L finding its way to the Aveo?

If the MPG is not getting boosted above 35 MPG then GM should sell the current Corsa in the U.S., yes I know GM will take a beating on the cost based on the Euro/Dollar exchange and since the Corsa is selling well may not be able to get much in the way of volume.

This could be a benefit by limiting the loss GM would take on the total number of cars.

If GM offers a Corsa with reasonable performance (0-60 less than 12 Seconds) and MPG near 40 it would have vehicle that would get buyers attention, the styling of the Corsa IMO is great for a small car and from what reviews I have read the Corsa performs well in its segment.

Honda made out OK with a very limited supply of Fit cars for the first year and built up a lot of demand for following years. Granted GM does not have the reputation Honda has with small cars so there will be many critics but the MPG and some good reviews of the Corsa's performance will get it established. By then North American production (Mexico probably even though with the new low wage scales some U.S. plants may make sense) for the next gen Corsa will be on line and eliminate much of the cost disadvantages.

[PA Dweller]

Originally Posted by motorman

they need to sell more impalas as there is more profit for GM and the dealer in a impala than in a cobalt so up date the impalas

The Impala's have been selling well even without updates, the Cobalt is a loser as far as small cars go (Not including the Cobalt SS) and if properly updated can grab a larger chunk of the market.

[Joe in T.O.]

Pontiac Gran Prix and full size vans.

[mikmak]

Originally Posted by PA Dweller

The Impala's have been selling well even without updates, the Cobalt is a loser as far as small cars go (Not including the Cobalt SS) and if properly updated can grab a larger chunk of the market.

Oh, well there goes my suggestion. I didn't realise that they were actually selling well.

Bravada, good point (re: US-ccenntricity) [sic] but I tend to agree that GMNA has been stuck with some real dishlickers for a long time.

I thought the latest combo was actually younger than for example, the cobalt or the platform holding up the Lucerne/Lacrosse (which ever is oldest, I can't remember).

Spark sure needs some help, but in reaity I think it is attracting the type of buyers that aren't overly concerned with creature comfort or capability. That's no reason to ignor them of course, but I think for GM to make some cash, that need to do it in areas where they can actually turn a dime.

Take Toyota for example. Only a few years ago, they ditched all sembelance of sports cars, with the death of the awkward Celica and the unfortunate (though reputedly amusing) MR2/S.

They focussed on what they knew best and created a big hairy sales beast called the Camry. It sells very well in the US and certainly makes its mark on many a market (though to be honest I have no idea how well they do in east or westrern Europe). They invested in what they knew and now they have the oxford scholars to develop a lightweight sporty with Fuji heavy industries. A car that I am sure, will take JDM and the US import crowd into another cult frenzy not seen since the inception of the WRX.

Of course a frenzy is required to actually turn over a decent profit on a sports car. Smart work by Toyota but it's been a long tough slog for them to get into a position where they can choose their next type of vehilce. And because they have generated such a huge pile of cash, they don't have to do it half arsed. It is going to be a cracker.

[PA Dweller]

Originally Posted by mikmak

Oh, well there goes my suggestion. I didn't realise that they were actually selling well.

Bravada, good point (re: US-ccenntricity) [sic] but I tend to agree that GMNA has been stuck with some real dishlickers for a long time.

I thought the latest combo was actually younger than for example, the cobalt or the platform holding up the Lucerne/Lacrosse (which ever is oldest, I can't remember).

Spark sure needs some help, but in reaity I think it is attracting the type of buyers that aren't overly concerned with creature comfort or capability. That's no reason to ignor them of course, but I think for GM to make some cash, that need to do it in areas where they can actually turn a dime.

Take Toyota for example. Only a few years ago, they ditched all sembelance of sports cars, with the death of the awkward Celica and the unfortunate (though reputedly amusing) MR2/S.

They focussed on what they knew best and created a big hairy sales beast called the Camry. It sells very well in the US and certainly makes its mark on many a market (though to be honest I have no idea how well they do in east or westrern Europe). They invested in what they knew and now they have the oxford scholars to develop a lightweight sporty with Fuji heavy industries. A car that I am sure, will take JDM and the US import crowd into another cult frenzy not seen since the inception of the WRX.

Of course a frenzy is required to actually turn over a decent profit on a sports car. Smart work by Toyota but it's been a long tough slog for them to get into a position where they can choose their next type of vehilce. And because they have generated such a huge pile of cash, they don't have to do it half arsed. It is going to be a cracker.

I don't even understand it, but the Impala does sell extremely well. However, I wonder how many still go to fleets?

[Bravada]

I don't even understand it, but the Impala does sell extremely well. However, I wonder how many still go to fleets?

You've just answered your own question.

Take Toyota for example. Only a few years ago, they ditched all sembelance of sports cars, with the death of the awkward Celica and the unfortunate (though reputedly amusing) MR2/S.

Awkward? Unfortunate? Man, those cars were legends, people cried when Toyota killed them - and along with them, any real enthusiast fanbase they had around here (Europe), now they just have the loyal following of content non-amused drivers, but that's just not the same. Honda is winning on that big time (I know many people who don't really care if it's Honda or Toyota, as long as it's "Japanese" [read: British, Turkish or Chinese], and Honda's offerings have been much more interesting of late).

(though to be honest I have no idea how well they do in east or westrern Europe).

The Camry is nonexistent in Europe, we get the Avensis large family car instead (not the Toyota Ipsum aka Avensis Verso minivan you get as Avensis), which is fairly nice, though by now outclassed and awaiting replacement. Through a mixture of very good sales/service experience and renowned reliability Toyota manages to attract large amounts of both retail and fleet business (which helps all lines sell strongly all the time). Varying from market to market, Toyota still struggles for a Top10 position in Germany while leading the market (alternating with Skoda) in countries like Poland.

It has to be noted, though, that the rather disappointing Yaris, flagging Avensis (in the wake of all-new pretty much everybody else, incl. spectacular Mondeo and Passat), relegation of Corolla nameplate to sedan duty + cancellation of fleet favourite estate body, and the disappointing qualities of said Corolla, Toyo is experiencing flattening if not falling sales now. Also, more reliable sources on, well, reliability, such as UK's Warranty Direct, start showing Toyota can hardly keep its bulletproof standards anymore, contrary to Honda (who also build vehicles in all corners in the world, but somehow get the quality thing better).

[WishIhadatruck]

Do we have to choose? Fix them ALL right now!

All I have to say is that the models that will attract those looking for economy better be best in class with regards to fuel economy. Aveo and Cobalt have a lot of work to do. I'm anxious to see how good the fuel economy is on the '09 Cobalts.

[derrado]

Originally Posted by steverino

Dump the G6. The Grand Prix is so much better in every way

The fleet-queen Grand Prix with the tight back seat, cheapo interior, 3800 six, odd styling, old platform and flagging reputation?

The 1997 Grand Prix was pretty awesome. It was sporty, it stood out. A shame it didn't come with a manual, though. But when 2003 rolled around, Pontiac didn't know what to do. The current Grand Prix sedan is just this awkward halfway car, not sure whether it is a family car or a sports coupe. It has made no impact on the market and it is on its way out.

The GXP is kind of cool, but do you really want to buy a FWD V8 when the G8 is in the same showroom?

The G6 is on the proven Epsilon platform (which also hosts two NACOTYs), it comes in three different body styles, it has a vastly better interior and from what I've heard, it handles better. It also looks much, much better.

The Grand Prix is dead.

[t-rex]

Originally Posted by PA Dweller

I don't even understand it, but the Impala does sell extremely well. However, I wonder how many still go to fleets?

I can't remember exactly, but someone posted some figures in here a while back that showed ~50-55% of Impalas go to fleets. Its private sales still would outnumber that of Chrysler's LX's...

[PA Dweller]

Originally Posted by Bravada

You've just answered your own question.

Not really since GM is supposed to be cutting down on fleet sales. To me fleet sales can me 5% or 95% being sold as fleet specials. At 95% you have a major problem, at 5% it's a non-issue.

Originally Posted by t-rex

I can't remember exactly, but someone posted some figures in here a while back that showed ~50-55% of Impalas go to fleets. Its private sales still would outnumber that of Chrysler's LX's...

Yikes.

I hope that figure has come down since then.

[motorman]

Originally Posted by PA Dweller

The Impala's have been selling well even without updates, the Cobalt is a loser as far as small cars go (Not including the Cobalt SS) and if properly updated can grab a larger chunk of the market.

the problem for GM is there is not enought profit in a $12K list price car to keep GM afloat.

[PA Dweller]

Originally Posted by motorman

the problem for GM is there is not enought profit in a $12K list price car to keep GM afloat.

Even with the increased demand for small, fuel efficient cars? How does Honda and Toyota turn a profit on these cars?

[skylark68]

Colorado/Canyon because I see many moving to smaller trucks with gas prices as they are. The interior needs to be dramatically improved. The exterior is okay as is.

[Bravada]

Not really since GM is supposed to be cutting down on fleet sales.

I don't think this concerns the Impala - I'd doubt they'd be protecting the W-body at the expense of, e.g., Malibu. At the end of the cycle, the most "personal" of W-bodies, the Grand Prix, suddenly became the rental queen. I don't think GM pushes to fend off Impaler's fleet sales.

[PA Dweller]

Originally Posted by Bravada

I don't think this concerns the Impala - I'd doubt they'd be protecting the W-body at the expense of, e.g., Malibu. At the end of the cycle, the most "personal" of W-bodies, the Grand Prix, suddenly became the rental queen. I don't think GM pushes to fend off Impaler's fleet sales.

I guess they are doing this to keep the image/resale value of the new Malibu up.