Wagoner Says Customers Didn't Want Hybrids

[Ming]

GM says customers didn't want hybrids back when gas was cheaper
news.moneycentral.msn.com
July 10, 2008 3:53 PM ET

Chairman and CEO of General Motors Corp. Rick Wagoner said that although GM had the technology to produce more fuel-efficient vehicles when gas prices were lower, a significant portion of its customers would not have bought them.

"We have to build cars and trucks that people want to buy," Wagoner said in his address to the Dallas Regional Chamber on Thursday.

http://news.moneycentral.msn.com/pro...710&id=8881084

[johnnyl321]

if these folks knew what people wanted, they wouldn't have the problems they face now. I like GM cars and trucks, but their management and what they call leadership is laughable at best.

[ByTheLake]

"We have to build cars and trucks that people want to buy," Wagoner said

Yeah, cars like the Honda Civic. I know, I know ... just wait a few more years and...

[jckjds]

Originally Posted by johnnyl321

if these folks knew what people wanted, they wouldn't have the problems they face now. I like GM cars and trucks, but their management and what they call leadership is laughable at best.

This is not an apology for GM's lack of foresight, but Wagoner is essentially correct. When the EV1 came out, people, by and large, did not want it. It was very expensive during a time when gas was $1 per gallon. Quite frankly, it was ahead of its time. If it had been offered in the early 2000's (like the Prius) it might have been a hit, producing more variations of the electric car.

Now, GM should have (in hindsight) continued to subsidize the EV1 and other technoloiges until they did become popular (because of rising gas prices and increased environmentalism), but that didn't happen.

[Ming]

They did not want "mild" half-arsed hybrids, and still generally do not from what I've heard of people who are lining up for a Prius in my workplace with multi-month waiting lists. My attempts to convince them to look at GM hybrids were weakened by the fact that GM's hybrids are not super fuel efficient 50MPG type cars. They just aren't and you can't get around that fact.

You can have the most fuel efficient full sized SUV in the world, but it's still fuel inefficient as a vehicle when compared to the spectrum of cars on the market. And $4.00/gallon gas will not make a repeat customer of someone who really didn't need a Suburban to commute to his desk job in the first place -- the SUV fad buyers.

Also, from what I recall, it was very hard to find a Silverado Hybrid, and even now, many dealers are opting out of selling the $53K full-size SUV Hybrids.

GM can make this argument with the EV1 all day, and with something to back them up, but even in the case of the EV1, it was hard to get and limited to a few markets in the U.S.

Penny-pinchers like me? I bought a 1998 Chevy Metro new when gasoline was at its cheapest: 89 cents a gallon. I liked saving gas money. Not because I couldn't buy bread if I'd bought something bigger, but just because I didn't think it necessary to spend so much money on a car or gasoline. But I was fresh back from Japan, with weird notions in my head. I didn't grasp the need for a Real American to drive the biggest vehicle possible.

In retrospect, I wish I hadn't traded it in - It could have been nicely garaged until recently. Instead I fell to the lures of big fuel-sucking, profit-packed vehicles. My 2004 Safari, 2001 Express Van (what a change from a Metro!) and 2000 Bonneville SSEi included. I do blame myself for that lapse (but the Bonneville sure was fun). Now I'm back in the small car camp.

[igotzzoom]

Who is GM consulting for its future trends forecasts, Ms. Cleo? It always seems like they're playing catch up to everyone else. For once...they might be on-target with the Volt, and possibly with the Cruze, but all too often, their mantra seems to be "Us too!" 2 or 3 years after everyone else.

[tirediron]

The right Hybrids yes, maybe, but not Yukons and Tahoes.
They are collecting dust on our lot right now.

The word "Hybrid" is the answer to everyone who doenst want to acknowledge what our real problems are and is simply a buzz-word band aid until GM and Toyo really figure out how to play this new gas mileage game we are beginnning to play.

[Saturn69]

Originally Posted by Ming

GM can make this argument with the EV1 all day, and with something to back them up, but even in the case of the EV1, it was hard to get and limited to a few markets in the U.S.

Penny-pinchers like me? I bought a 1998 Chevy Metro new when gasoline was at its cheapest: 89 cents a gallon. I liked saving gas money. Not because I couldn't buy bread if I'd bought something bigger, but just because I didn't think it necessary to spend so much money on a car or gasoline. But I was fresh back from Japan, with weird notions in my head. I didn't grasp the need for a Real American to drive the biggest vehicle possible.

In retrospect, I wish I hadn't traded it in - It could have been nicely garaged until recently. Instead I fell to the lures of big fuel-sucking, profit-packed vehicles. My 2004 Safari, 2001 Express Van (what a change from a Metro!) and 2000 Bonneville SSEi included. I do blame myself for that lapse (but the Bonneville sure was fun). Now I'm back in the small car camp.

A few markets? Try two states, California and Arizona, leased only from Saturn retailers. Yeah, it wasn't the easiest car to get. I wish I had a Metro now. I don't get the "I'm gonna buy the biggest car I can afford that I'll have to spend as on fuel as I can afford" mindset. Doesn't give you much wiggle room in those unavoidable tougher times, do it? I, too, have better things to spend my money on than gasoline or a look-at-me car.

[Chaz_23]

Diversification is the key, for everything. Can you imagine the world's largets publishers, saying: we are not going to publish non-fiction books anymore, what people want is trashy novels. Or a clothing company not making pants, khakis anymore because all that people want is gang-member type ultra wide jeans.

A company like GM needs to make cars in every segment. Period. Minivans, small-trucks, two-doors, mid-size SUVs, mini-cars, compacts and everything else. Toyota does. Not only that but they keep introducing new models left and right. That will obviously mean that some models will subsidize others. Big deal.
GM cuts models, platforms, segments because they don't sell well for a week. Then 2-3 years later that very segment becomes "hot" again and GM scrambles to come up with something, usually 3 years late. Wagoner still hasn't learned his lesson. He's got to go.

[tgagneguam]

"We have to build cars and trucks that people want to buy," Wagoner said in his address to the Dallas Regional Chamber on Thursday.

Oh, is that what you did in lieu of building hybrids? I see. So how am I supposed to understand continually falling share in North America since the day you took your office, hmmmm? While retail share has stabilized, and maybe saw a bit of an uptick more recently, you largely presided over significantly falling share. That tells me that much of what you built failed to find favor with consumers; you weren't building what people wanted.

It's funny that people actually will buy this line from GM to explain its generally poor performance lately and historically. Good lord, Rick, how 'bout some candor from the top for once?

[63GrandSport001]

Did Rick really sit there and say that people didn't want hybrids when gas was cheap?????

And yes a large amount of GMs customer base wouldn't have purchased gas sippers from GM when gas prices were cheaper they would have gotten new customers......

[mgescuro]

Heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh....

Customers didn't want hybrids when gas was cheap.
But somehow every single other automaker figured out that it might be a viable solution, despite the extra cost.

What GM has continually failed to understand is the nature of the market isn't always just about cost. it's about owning a car. It's about creating a car that buyers are passionate about. And frankly, the only car that GM owns that does that is the Corvette.

Toyota did it because they believe that despite the cost, there was a subset of the market that believed a super efficient car, with lower emissions, would be attractive. And if it finds a market... then it finds a market. Not only did Prius find a market, it built a cult following. Now it's the standard bearer.

What really surprises me is if one reads Lutz's book, he essentially says "don't listen to the customers" because customers have no idea what they want. Well, hybrids is a perfect example of that credo. Customers might not want a hybrid. They might not even be familiar with the concept of a hybrid. They might not be enthralled with the cost. but the idea of the hybrid was attraction enough.

So... GM is a decade behind the curve. And they're trying to rewrite the hybrid market with a plug-in. Hopefully GM doesn't botch it up.

[natesriv]

Wagoner, you're almost AN IDIOT...almost

Is it just me? Is it that simple???

Here's the solution to all GM's problems:
1: Mid sized small car (between Civic sized and Camry sized)
2: Medium sized 4 cylinder for this car, NVH and mileage mid pack, doesn't have to lead the world, but not be last either
3: Decent interior... solid with soft touch. Don't need super navigation (who really uses that anyway?), nice dash, door panels and comfortable seats (big enough for fat Americans)
4: Good looks, no study panels here, just go with a good design... doesn't take a study group to figure that out
5: $20-$25K (hell, make it in Mexico.. you wanna solve the imigration problem? QUIT F_CKING SENDING JOBS TO CHINA!!!!)

That's it! A small car about between Cobalt and Malibu...Keep Malibu, Redo Cobalt Interior and exterior to current GM standards and you're golden

Oh, and for the love of GOD!!! Stop discontinuing models after 4 years... Keep Cobalt name (drop Cruze!!), let brand recognition build on a continuning quality program where each year you make improvements, and each year it gets better...JUST LIKE HONDA AND TOYOTA DO...

It's almost so simple that I laugh that GM and Ford hasn't done it!!!!

[tirediron]

Acutally wouldnt it be best for him to hide under his desk for awhile? I think I'm learning he ain't such a good speaker. Kinda like our pres.

[2002 Caddy]

Customers didn't want cheap a$$ Crapalires, Corsica's, Citations and X Body and J Body junk that fell apart in the dealer's show room but that didn't stop Rick from making those too.