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#16 (permalink) |
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6.2 Liter LS3 V8
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Travis AFB, CA
Posts: 3,568
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Re: Lutz says "no plug-in hybrid race" between Toyota, GM; Toyota to Debut Plug-in Fi
I'll post the same thing I posted at ToyotaNation:
Um...he right though. I am not saying which system is best. However, the Chevy Volt will run for ~40 miles on electric power alone.....then there's a small gas engine whose sole duty is to act as a generator for those batteries (keeping them charged so you continue to travel). Toyota's system is like the current Prius right? Sure it can and will run on electric power for stints, but I believe it has a gasoline engine that also powers the wheels? Am I right? If it were a race though Toyota would be ahead by a mile. GM's efforts of using 2-mode hybrids in SUVs ARE commendable. For instance I get 13 mpg city in my Armada, but Hybrid Tahoes are getting 20 mpg....that's an improvement of 35%! Toyota hasn't and has no plans to delve into the hybrid truck/full-size SUV arena. But on the car-front a Hybrid Camry kicks the snot out of a Hybrid Aura or Malibu. And of course there's the love-it-or-loathe-it Prius. I still think in the context of that (short) article, Lutz is correct. |
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#17 (permalink) |
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6.2 Liter LS3 V8
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Toledo, Ohio. U.S.A!
Posts: 3,101
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Re: Lutz says "no plug-in hybrid race" between Toyota, GM; Toyota to Debut Plug-in Fi
Heres what i have heard about Toyota plug-in. Of course its a version of the Prius.. and its said that its going to be able to run about 7 miles on just electric power... That said.. the Volt is going to be able to run about 40 miles on just electric power!! Im not sure the mpg rating of the Toyota plug-in.. but over 70% of people will be able to run everyday where ever they go on just electric power alone with the Volt. The Volt is far more advanced then the Toyota plug-in. the Toyota plun-in is going to be low tech compared to the Volt and is most likely being rushed into production so Toyta can just say "hey, look here we are the fist with a plug-in car!!" But i believe the Volt is going to still be the game changer!
__________________
-JD My Ride: 2005 Ford Mustang GT Coupe (Getting ready to trade up!) Project Car: 1969 Javelin SST 290 Family's Cars: -2010 Ford Fusion SE (Sport Blue) -2007 Chevy Cobalt Sedan LT -2007 Pontiac Grand Prix GT -1997 Chevy Camaro V6 30th Anniversary Edition -1998 Ford Taurus SE -1997 Oldsmobile Acheiva Sedan |
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#18 (permalink) | |
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7.0 Liter LS7 V8
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 4,125
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Re: Lutz says "no plug-in hybrid race" between Toyota, GM; Toyota to Debut Plug-in Fi
Quote:
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#19 (permalink) |
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4.6 Liter Northstar V8
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,832
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Re: Lutz says "no plug-in hybrid race" between Toyota, GM; Toyota to Debut Plug-in Fi
Let's see how we got here.
- Watch your competition bring out hybrid technology. - Miss the shift in the marketplace that was about the happen. (No one in GM ever heard of peak oil apparently) - Bad mouth the competition's hybrid tech saying the economics are all wrong. - Watch hybrid sales take off. - Rush half baked hybrid vehicles (mild hybrid AKA BAS) to the market. - Watch mild hybrid sales go no where. - Develop a new plug in hybrid technology that will leap frog the competition - Introduce the idea YEARS before the plug in hybrid technology is ready. - Hype the plug in hybrid technology as the biggest news in power train technology in decades - Hype the plug in tech as being years ahead of the competition - Hype the new tech more - Hype the new tech even more - Hype the new tech in excruciating detail and include it in ads - Share every bit of information about the new tech with the world and the competition - Talk about the new tech as the second coming - Start to temper the hype by saying it will cost $35K to $40K - Temper the hype more by saying the volume will be very low - Listen to how your competition will beat you to the marketplace in plug in tech - Starting talking in terms of how this is not a race I don't like how this is heading for GM. I've been saying for years that GM, Lutz, Waggoner, etc. should STFU about future products, hype the stuff you have and are selling TODAY (even if it is crap compared to the new stuff), work on the new stuff out of the spotlight so the competition doesn't know where you are heading years in advance, and bring it out AHEAD of the competition with minimal introduction lead time. Mark |
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#20 (permalink) | |
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2.4 Liter SIDI ECOTEC
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 478
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Re: Lutz says "no plug-in hybrid race" between Toyota, GM; Toyota to Debut Plug-in Fi
Quote:
Last edited by Buick Riviera : 08-28-2008 at 10:04 PM. |
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#22 (permalink) | |
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7.0 Liter LS7 V8
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Further on up the road..
Posts: 4,729
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Re: Lutz says "no plug-in hybrid race" between Toyota, GM; Toyota to Debut Plug-in Fi
Quote:
Both 'first' vehicles are going to be very very very minor symbols, nothing more. The Volt is not a savior vehicle, it's far too expensive to be a mass marketed vehicle for the general population. It and the PHEV Prius are going to be niche vehicles for a limited well-to-do demographic. Neither are going to generate much in the way of profits. Both have to be put on the streets as a first step toward future technologies. Hoping for some miraculous bonanza is just not going to occur. |
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#23 (permalink) |
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1.4 Liter Turbocharged ECOTEC
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 95
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Re: Lutz says "no plug-in hybrid race" between Toyota, GM; Toyota to Debut Plug-in Fi
a plug in prius is a joke, thats like hooking up a chain saw motor to my bike so i dont have to pedal, and calling it the biggest innovation EVER, when there are such things as motorcycles and scooters. The Volt is going to be the best selling, most attractive, most advanced car that the american consumer can buy. No doubts, no nothing, just sales, and 40+miles of gas free travel to anybody who can get their hands on it
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#24 (permalink) | |
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7.0 Liter LS7 V8
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Right here
Drives: Ford Escape. Pontiac Grand Am
Posts: 4,254
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Re: Lutz says "no plug-in hybrid race" between Toyota, GM; Toyota to Debut Plug-in Fi
Quote:
Second place is last place. Nobody remembers, they just know that you lost. By the way, answers: 1) I have no clue 2) Charles "Pete" Conrad 3) Vladimir Mishin succeeded Sergei Korolev |
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#25 (permalink) |
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6.2 Liter LS3 V8
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Toledo, Ohio. U.S.A!
Posts: 3,101
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Re: Lutz says "no plug-in hybrid race" between Toyota, GM; Toyota to Debut Plug-in Fi
I think the plug-in Vue will be better then the Prius plug-in.. the Vue will be able to go about 20 miles i believe on eletric power.. while the Prius.. only 7! And i think the vue is going to get 60 mpg.. i dont think the Prius will do much better then that!
__________________
-JD My Ride: 2005 Ford Mustang GT Coupe (Getting ready to trade up!) Project Car: 1969 Javelin SST 290 Family's Cars: -2010 Ford Fusion SE (Sport Blue) -2007 Chevy Cobalt Sedan LT -2007 Pontiac Grand Prix GT -1997 Chevy Camaro V6 30th Anniversary Edition -1998 Ford Taurus SE -1997 Oldsmobile Acheiva Sedan |
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#26 (permalink) |
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4.4 Liter Supercharged Northstar
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,782
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Re: Lutz says "no plug-in hybrid race" between Toyota, GM; Toyota to Debut Plug-in Fi
or how about this, bring us normal cars at low prices that get awesome fuel economy then you will kick everyones ass.
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#27 (permalink) |
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1.4 Liter Turbocharged ECOTEC
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 94
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Re: Lutz says "no plug-in hybrid race" between Toyota, GM; Toyota to Debut Plug-in Fi
at this point i say bring on the prius, bring on the volt and bring on anything else that gets us away from gas. hopefully these coming years will go down in automotive history as the major shift away from gas.
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#28 (permalink) |
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2.4 Liter SIDI ECOTEC
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Flint, MI
Drives: All GM fleet
Posts: 130
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Re: Lutz says "no plug-in hybrid race" between Toyota, GM; Toyota to Debut Plug-in Fi
But the Volt blows the Prius away in the looks dept...
http://link.brightcove.com/services/...tid=1759811968 Link courtesy of GMSource.com
__________________
All these economists, even the armchair variety, can be replaced by a good software package and a spanish speaking data entry jockey making 2 peso's per day. Last edited by smithrobs : 08-29-2008 at 02:27 AM. Reason: Credit for source |
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#29 (permalink) |
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6.0 Liter L76 V8
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,126
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Re: Lutz says "no plug-in hybrid race" between Toyota, GM; Toyota to Debut Plug-in Fi
So you say. And so GM says. But it is just idle bragging until the car actually arrives. The LiIon battery still remains a formidable hurdle and could still derail the whole Volt project if even one test battery catches fire.
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#30 (permalink) |
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4.4 Liter Supercharged Northstar
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Traverse City, MI
Drives: '04 Corvette, '09 CTS 4
Posts: 2,963
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Re: Lutz says "no plug-in hybrid race" between Toyota, GM; Toyota to Debut Plug-in Fi
Nobody should be surprised that Toyota will be first to market with a plug-in hybrid, if Honda doesn't quietly beat them.
Toyota has extensive hybrid experience and technology, not to mention the deepest pockets in the industry. Regardless of the distance the Toyota vehicle will drive before switching to gasoline, the "perception" game may be lost by the time the Volt becomes available in meaningful quantities to real drivers. |
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