May Sales: Toyota up 12%, Nissan Falls 11%

[Vintalage]

Originally Posted by RWD60

not to say this isn't a bad month for nissan... but every single 4-door car they sell between 10 and 35k is getting new versions out in the next 12 months. don't count them out yet...

Said it before I did. They are in a better position than GM. They have the new sentra, Altima, and refreshed Maxima ready to deploy in the coming months. Since the replacements have been shown to the public, most are waiting for the new models. This could explain the sharp decline.

[racy]

Originally Posted by ScottS

What's the lesson here? Toyota, despite a few recent headaches, can still sell a bunch of cars due to a reputation built over the last 20+ years. Anyone here who thinks they can reverse 20 years of history basesd on 1-2 years of recent comparisons is nuts. This is why GM has to focus on getting things right the first time, and doing so consistently.

This is such an uphill battle for the Domestics. I was chatting with a group of family members, none of them car fanatics. Yet all agreed that their next purchase would be a Toyota - not a specific model. Just, "a Toyota".

Think about that for a sec. Not a specific mode, just "a Toyota".

Why? Because of Toyota's history of reliability and economy.

I kept silent. I wasn't about to argue with them for three reasons: (1) They were correct. (2) They were correct. And (3), They were correct.

I have tried to extoll the virtues of the new General Motors upon them, but to no avail, and I can't really blame them. Toyota has a 20 year track record. In this country, is has become part of our cultural knowledge that "Toyota makes a dependable car". Whether this is true or not, is irrelevent. People in this country believe it.

Most People in this country believe that:
- The rest of the world is inferior.
- God's name is Jesus.
- "Self Improvement" means going to the tanning booth.
- Someone or something else is always responsible for their problem. Thus law suits.
- Toyotas are the best made car

There ya have it. American as apple pie.

[asim]

Wow, I WOULD have never expected this. :sarcasm:

[Minnow101]

Originally Posted by ponchoman49

Hard to believe people are buying the new line of ugly and bland Toyotas that seldom if ever get there advertised mileage! There are so many other choices out there, why is everybody choosing Toyota? An Altima is so much more fun to drive than a silly Camry. The Lucerne has many advantages over the Avalon, including apparently better quality control and better crash test results too! The Corolla is outdated, even if it is rated at 40 mpg highway which I don't believe for a second unless you drive super slow. There trucks are girly machines and most real truck drivers choose a superior Silverado/Ram or F-150 over theres. The Highlander and there other bigger sport ute are old. Scions are dustbins with lawnmower engines! The ladybug/slug like Yaris is getting very lukewarm reviews from what I have seen. Honestly I just don't see why Toyota is doing so good.

And what American car is getting anywhere's near the advertised mileage ???? All the manufacturers are guilty of pumping up the MPG when reality is something much less. The fact remains that GM and Ford don't have anything that compares to a Corolla or Civic. Nothing.

[paul8488]

The Vibe had a Corolla engine... and it never got 40 mpg. 30 no problem, 35 driven miserley, but I don't believe that many Corolla drivers get 40 mpg regularly.

[Vintalage]

Originally Posted by paul8488

The Vibe had a Corolla engine... and it never got 40 mpg. 30 no problem, 35 driven miserley, but I don't believe that many Corolla drivers get 40 mpg regularly.

Uh, isn't the Vibe heavier than the Corolla? Well, as a matter of fact it is. 2679 lbs. (base Vibe) vs 2530 lbs. (base Corolla)

Secondly, EPA ratings for the Vibe are not in the 40s like the Corolla is:

Matrix/Vibe
Manual: 30 mpg / 36 mpg
Automatic: : 28 mpg / 34 mpg

Corolla
Manual: 32 mpg / 41 mpg
Automatic: : 30 mpg / 38 mpg

[Ming]

The Vibe/Matrix do strike me as being on the portly size, and many people have complained about less than stellar power (especially off the line), even from the GT engine.

[Geotpf]

Originally Posted by 69Firebird400

PS - Thanks to Geotpf for the link to the model by model Nissan sales results. I couldn't find it on my own earlier!

Actually Employee Discount for Everyone only began in June 2005, so the UGLY year over year comparisons won't begin for the Big 3 until the end of this month. Plus, I think the beginning of that promotion took some sales away from the import brands that didn't participate, so their year over year comparisons may look artificially favorable. Ugh.

You're welcome. Since the employee discount didn't start until next month, this month's sales decreases for GM are real then.

However, you are wrong about that promotion hurting the imports, at least not Toyota. Here are Toyota's sales results for the period when the domestics were running thier employee discounts:

June 05: Up 10.0%
July 05: Up 12.3% (best month ever up to that point)
Aug 05: Up 9.5%

Right now, GM is paying for and Honda and Toyota are benefiting from mistakes GM made in approximately 2000-2003; that is, people who bought GM cars new during that period are probably looking to replace them now. If thier previous GM car was an unreliabile piece of junk, they aren't going back, even if the current models now are decent-and no matter whether or not they can get a good deal or not. The employee pricing deals only pulled ahead sales; they didn't get many converts from Toyota and Honda. And unless the Honda or Toyota they buy is also a piece of junk, they will mostly stick with them forever-those sales are gone for good.

That's how the car market works-a car maker pays for thier current mistakes not only now, but also five years from now, come replacement time.

[69Firebird400]

Originally Posted by Vintalage

Uh, isn't the Vibe heavier than the Corolla? Well, as a matter of fact it is. 2679 lbs. (base Vibe) vs 2530 lbs. (base Corolla)

Secondly, EPA ratings for the Vibe are not in the 40s like the Corolla is:

Matrix/Vibe
Manual: 30 mpg / 36 mpg
Automatic: : 28 mpg / 34 mpg

Corolla
Manual: 32 mpg / 41 mpg
Automatic: : 30 mpg / 38 mpg

To add to what Vintalage said, isn't the base Corolla engine less powerful than the base Vibe/Matrix engine?

The Corolla XRS engine, which is the same as in the Matrix XRS, gets 26/34 with a 6-speed manual (and requires premium). The same engine in the Matrix XRS gets 25/32 with a 6-speed manual (also requires premium).

So when comparing apples to apples, it appears that a small portion of the difference is the added weight and worse aerodynamics of the Vibe/Matrix relative to the Corolla, and the larger portion is that the Matrix/Vibe just have different engine offerings that have better power but worse economy than the Corolla's lower-level engines do.

[Geotpf]

Originally Posted by 69Firebird400

To add to what Vintalage said, isn't the base Corolla engine less powerful than the base Vibe/Matrix engine?

Nope. The base Corolla and base Vibe/Matrix engines (and the XRS/GT versions thereof) are identical. In fact, the only differences between the two cars are the interior (mainly the dash) and the fact that the Vibe/Matrix is a wagon and the Corolla is a sedan.

[Melkur]

Originally Posted by norway12

What is up with over 40 000 sales for both the Corolla and Camry??!!! That is SICK! Wake up America, the Camry and Corolla are not that great! GOD....

On the contrary they are really good cars which is why they sell like crazy.

[y2chuck]

Originally Posted by Melkur

On the contrary they are really good cars which is why they sell like crazy.

I agree, I recently tested the new Camry and it really is that good of a vehicle. I had high expectations and it exceeded them. Great job by Toyota.