UPDATE 6/21!: GM Cutting Another Division?

[SierraGS]

Originally Posted by DuSpinnst

Saturn is basically Opel, so it doesn't cost GMNA anything.

Saturn will require millions of dollars (at least) of marketing just to build up sales and all the while steal sales from other GM brands.


GMC is the only brand that doesn't cost GMNA much - I bet GM could cut marketing spending for GMC in half (or more) and not see much of a drop in sales, but still rake in the high margins of GMC sales.

GMC trucks sell to Buick/Pontiac owners who tend to be older (and wealthier) than younger buyers.

Older buyers will play a major role in the auto market over the next year since they have critical advantages over younger ones

- They have higher incomes
- Better credit ratings
- More disposable income for Truck/SUV for family needs
- Some are retired and need a Truck/SUV for recreation

GMC is very important to GMNA's bottomline and is the only brand that GMNA can cut spending on without losing profits.

[mot76]

I say spread the wealth, kill the Chevy truck division. More traffic will then flow into the BPG dealerships. Why does Chevy have to have all the glory? If you put it another way, a Chevy truck could be a rebadged GMC, not the other way around. GM is not Chevy; Chevy is GM.

[eaton53]

Originally Posted by TriShield

That's not an excuse to do nothing and never has been. GM attempting to justify, make sense of and prop this mess up has gotten them where they are today. GM's overbloated brand and antiquated brand structure does not work and has killed the company.

Eventually they will use the nuclear option to do it. Bankruptcy.

Alan Mulally and Ford's approach is a bit more intelligent, they simply aren't going to make any new Mercury products without announcing a sudden death of the brand.

You say "That's not an excuse to do nothing", yet you're coming up with nothing.... except to parrot your god Farago and bleat "bankruptcy".

Here's a newsflash.... NO ONE will buy a car from a bankrupt automaker. So to suggest it is complete foolishness.

Your brilliant "get rid of everything but Chevrolet and Cadillac" strategy gets rid of Opel, Buick and Holden, giving away Europe, Australia and China.... and billions in profits in the process.

And then you open up GM to billions more in lawsuits by shutting down the BPG dealers.

What GM needs to do is cull the damaged, redundant and dying brands and replace them with products from the healthy ones.

Saturn is basically Opel, so it doesn't cost GMNA anything. Europeans and NA have different tastes. Toyota does NOT sell the same line-up in Europe as it does in NA. So killing them does nothing other than cause all the dealers to sue you after they dumped millions into dealerships.

The reason I bring Opel and Holden to the BPG stores are fivefold...

First, Opel = Saturn and Holden = Pontiac. Why bother with the rebadge?

Second, Saturn is a cheap car brand and money pit. Lutz says Pontiac is damaged. Opel and Holden don't have this baggage.

So start fresh... I don't know why people think it's any harder to market a new brand (although Opel is not totally unknown in the U.S.) than a broken one.

Third, the new BOH gives the BPG dealers product that does not overlap with Chevy or Cadillac. This ends the cannibalization that is so prevalent at GMNA today.

Four, said product avoids BPG dealer litigation.

And five, having only 5 brands worldwide means they can be properly supported from a product and marketing standpoint.

[Lichtronamo]

Originally Posted by eaton53

You and TriShield actually don't get it. At all.

Both of you have been asked now how the get out of the dealership situation and have offered nothing, as if they can just walk away from it.

IMO, they can get down to 5 brands without massive dealer litigation.

CHAPTER 11.

[eaton53]

Originally Posted by Lichtronamo

CHAPTER 11.

Equals no more brands and no more company. Think Studebaker, Packard, Daewoo...

[nsap]

UPDATE: Since the publication of this article GMI has had several other sources approach us confirming what was reported; that another brand is being looked at to cut. Our sources are all stating that the BPG (Buick-Pontiac-GMC) brands were the top considerations, but it has since been narrowed to GMC or Pontiac. However, our sources have also used the "Saab" name in discussions we have had with them...however NOTHING regarding the Saab brand has been confirmed by GMI.

The latest ^

[Buickman]

Buick Blues
Jim Dollinger
Saturday, January 7, 2006

They took the lease incentive off Park Ave in April of 01 just as Spring began.
In 02 they offered the Century with $500 extra off only in white, silver, or tan.
They starved the division of product, only serving up warmed over Trailblazer, Venture ,and Aztec.
They closed Buick City even though it produced the highest of quality.
They are now tearing down the magnificent Buick headquarters on Hamilton Ave.
They make the most boring interiors with the most bland of colors.
They make the lease payments significantly higher on Buicks than comparable GM models.
They are combining Buick stores with other GM franchises to soften the legal entanglements when they swing the axe on the foundation stone.
The LeSabre went to the graveyard along with Skyhawk, Skylark, Century, Regal, Park Avenue, Roadmaster, Riviera, and can't remember last time we had a coupe or wagon. What happened to Grand Nationals and TTypes?
They constantly shift marketing slogans from "Spirit of American Style" to "One Better" to "It's All Good" to "Dream Up" to "Beyond Precision".
They show a nut driving a Riviera on season ending ER episode shooting at main characters.
They have Eva Longoria bored to tears at a Buick LaCrosse display during Desparate Houswives.
They promise $3 Biilion investment in Buick. It never happens.
We receive the goofiest brochures in the business.
The LaCrosse and Lucerne both intro well past Christmas and aren't available for the big year end spree.
The rebates are announced even before the brochures or vehicles arrive.

And you believe Wagoner and Company aren't on a mission? They are simply marching to orders, the real question is from WHO? As suppliers and eventually manufacturers belly up, watch for Wilbur Ross and his band of Rothschild banker friends to pony up cents on the dollar and recreate from the carcass, then devoid of pensions and health care, as well as union contracts.

Kind of amazing The Buick has survived. Attribute the longevity to the most spectular heritage in automotive history. Buick bred men like Durant, Mott, Nash, Chrysler, and Curtice (Time magazine's man of the year). The Buick dealers make up the finest distribution channel in the business and have prospered in spite of the virtual attack on their operations, not from the competition, but rather from their very own manufacturer.

Stockholders need to rise up and sue the Board of Directors for negligence. Wagoner should be imprisoned. He is a bigger crook than Ebbers or Lay ever imagined. $4,000,000,000 to his Fiat friends, and the stock ends up at Merrill Lynch while their chairman Stan O'Neal serves on our board. Hello???? 30,000 jobs to be lost and today he is quoted as saying there may be more. The man is out to completely destroy what he hasn't already spun off or shut down. Time to WAKE UP!

[TaHoE]

Well then looking at the update: Goodbye Pontiac.

[Kennyboy]

Blah blah blah. All speculation and bullcrap IMO. We had this discussion several years ago and nothing significant happen. We'll see what will happen.....

[AMERICA 123]

Well, given the recent revelations concerning Toyota and their labor practises I'd slow this alleged kill another brand activity down - that has the potential to change everything over the next 12 months - and thats not just in regard to Toyota.

If that plays out fairly all you would need is some favorable movement on something else - fuel and oil prices or the Yen exchange rate or all the previous.

Inevitably some combination of all the above is going to occur.

Last month, 64% of GM's sales were outside the USA/NA ? where things will continue to do better - at least relatively so the fire sale approach may or may not be warranted.

[chickenkicker]

Originally Posted by TaHoE

Well then looking at the update: Goodbye Pontiac.

I wonder how many people will be saying hello Ford.

[eaton53]

Originally Posted by AMERICA 123

Well, given the recent revelations concerning Toyota and their labor practises I'd slow this alleged kill another brand activity down - that has the potential to change everything over the next 12 months - and thats not just in regard to Toyota.

I don't think anyone really cares.
Most Americans will risk poisoning their own kids if it means they can get cheap toys...

[FierySolstice]

So when will we know if GM will be selling Hummer and cutting anther brand? Will it be soon?

[NationsKappatol]

So, I lurk far more than I post, and here is what I propose, since we are arm-chair QB's...

Since they are thinking of cutting GMC and Pontiac, cut them both. Expand Buick...I really think it has a lot of potential. Combine Buick dealers with Saturn dealers to give Saturn the exposure it needs. Get us a competitive Astra, keep the Sky, add a two-mode VUE, dump the Aura and Outlook. Buick will have the Enclave, the new, hopefully amazing LaCrosse, and more on the way.

Combine Caddy With Saab.

Sell Hummer.

Entry Level With Full Line:
Chevrolet (including micro-cars, 2-mode, and Volt)

Mid-Level: Benchmark of Customer Service
Buick - Saturn

Ultra-Luxury: Saab as niche FWD Lux, Caddilac as RWD lux
Cadillac - Saab


This is coming from a pontiac lover and Solstice Owner. This, I think is the way to survive.

[throwback]

[quote=
Since they are thinking of cutting GMC and Pontiac, cut them both. Expand Buick....[/QUOTE]

I agree with this. Chevrolet can offer performance through the SS cars. I think Buick with some better designs could fill the entry level luxury market. They only need 2 GOOD sedans and the Enclave. I am a SAAB fan and owner, but I think it's time to sell SAAB. The problem with dumping 2 brands is money, something GM does not have a lot of.