GMI's Revitalization in Action | The Dream Saab Lineup

[FireFox89]

Great direction. But the 9-1 and 9-9 are overkill and would cannibalize cadillac and with the 9-1 coexisting with a pontiac torenta (bmw 1 series rival). The saab grille looks awesome and is in tune more in the way bmw designs their vehicles (with the bmw corperate grille). But the zeta is something that saab isnt. Plus chevrolet, pontiac, buick and (hearsay) cadillac has a zeta.

[mgescuro]

Originally Posted by t-rex

Oh another Saab idea I had in mind.......a small roadster. Sonnet anybody? But NOT Kappa based. Instead, Saab engineers could create a premium suspension package on a shortened Delta (or successor) plaftorm. Would give Saab something to take on the Audi TT (which is Golf-based, sorta), and even the Porsche Cayman...

No. Too many roadsters out there. Market is small. I'd much rather see a 9-1 with more capabilities with the feel of a roadster.
Sonnet's a good idea, but ultimately, a non-starter for Saab.

[LeSabre]

I like all Dream Saab w/the exception of the 9-1.
Though I could possibly be swayed to like it if I or we had more pics of it from different angles. Like a head on side shot & a 3D shot of the rear, side & roof.
I suggest making those to pic ideas happen.

Also, maybe a Zeta based "Sonnett" about the size of the coming Camaro, would be cool & interesting, at least to me. Perhaps it could take on Mercedes Benz's SL class.
Oh, And how about a Saab that could contend w/the Mercedes Benz CLS class!

[karsten]

Nicely done, but very US oriented. Remember that you have a world audience out there! No diesels mentioned, smaller gas/ethanol engines (1,4-1,6L) for the 9-1/9-2 with turbo and Di. The facelift for 9-3 that you suggest is more like a complete new car (for 2011). I agree that SAAB needs a 9-6X to replace 9-7X. I believe that we will get more niche models when the new plattforms arrive.

[throwback]

Well done. I do not see the need for a 9-9x however. Saab should be focused on the near luxury market. The 9-9x will step on Cadillacs toes in that segment. I agree with the other segments and your generally thesis that SAAb holds much promise for GM. I think that SAAB is more important to GM's growth than either Pontiac or Buick at this point. SAAB (and Chevy) are GM's only global grand, they are also a natural complement to Cadillac world wide. With SAAB occupying one rung below Cadillac.

[WetLlama]

Wow... just wow. How exciting would this lineup be?

Only change I'd make (and who am I to say) would be to move the 9-1 into the 9-2(x) slot, and use the Aero-X (or a roadster variant) for the 9-1(x). I think that would give SAAB some much needed clout in the Audi R8/Corvette/650i/911 category...

[mbukukanyau]

a 9-9 would be great, If GM were to make a Business case for a large car, the size of an S Class. They might have to share the underpinnings with Buick and Cadillac.

[Hurricane]

INCREDIBLE chops! Fantastic job!

Bring back the Sonnett! And a 9-3 two door hatch!

[HEVguy]

Wow! Looks great, and well filled out line-up as well. I really like the more up-level looking front ends (like on the 9-5)!

[kenman923]

Nice work, but I don't think Saab really needs a 9-9. If you ask me, the Zeta should be left to Chevy/Pontiac/Buick.

[AbsoluteSaab]

I'd just like to say thank you for your hard effort.
I've done a couple of Photochops myself and time consuming is an understatment.

Like it all

The engine options seem a bit odd at times, and there are no diesels, but that's a minor fault.


Good work...

[Bvonscott]

I am stunned by these designs. They look fantastic! I like that the fronts are all a little different, and not using the same piece throughout. There could be some tiny little changes here and there, but I sire hope GM is paying attention to this because these designs are REALLY GOOD.

[nadepalma]

I finally got on here after all our going back and forth on the other thread from last week to put my two cents in! lol.

Originally Posted by mgescuro

Epsilon II will be fully extensible, with multiple variation of length and width, with 3 different sets of mechanicals underneath. Obviously, Saab will have the most advnaced machanicals.
But as of now, not much else is known. We don't even know if the AWD system is a Haldex or a Torsen diff.

9-5 was historically a competitor to the 5-series. Since 2002, the 9-5 has fallen back a bit with stalled updates, and it couldn't catch up. I'd expect the next-gen 9-5 to bring it back to competing form.

I agree. The 9-5 needs to return to it's former "position" and be seen as a legitamit competitor for the A6/5-Series/Etc. To do that, they need to make sure that they get all the details right. The new EpII should help in this regard as well since it seems GM has done their homework on making the platform flexible enough tand good enough to compete in a variety of segments and do it cost effectively.

I'd like to see what kind of AWD system they come up with. I"ve read that Ford developed their own AWD system for the Milan/MKZ/Fusion ---- they did it so they could save a few bucks, but they essentially did it cost effectively without having to go to an outside vendor. The Five Hundred/et al. have a Haldex set up, but I wonder if GM would consider doing their own version?

Originally Posted by mgescuro

The assumption behind the 9-9x is that it's going to be on a premium Zeta. Concurrent development of a premium Zeta would assist Cadillac as well. Cadillac would target the S550 side of the market, while Saab would target Quattroporte and XJR.

Read my thread on the matter. I think it makes sense.
GMI's Revitalization in Action: Commentary: 9-9x

Also, the key with Saab is that it is in more global markets than any other GM brand currently. Saab can penetrate the market where function and style and sportiness are paramount, and a European heritage is highly regarded (Asian countries and the Europe).

Cadillac, for all it's North American heritage, is a virtual no-name else where. Where it is known, the reputation is tarnished. Saab can make an immediate impact while Cadillac ramps up. Because, like it or not, Cadillac's ramp up will be measured in decades, not years.

I agree with you overall. I think that internationally, GM's most important brands are (and should be), Chevrolet, Cadillac and Saab. Someplace inbetween you could put Opel, but they aren't sold world wide, while GM is making Caddy and Chevy into true global brands and Saab has always been a global brand --- but with limited appeal and reach. GM needs to exploit this and make it work to their advantage.

I know we talked about the 9-9 issue previously and think it's a great idea. I just wonder if the Saab folks will "accept" (if that's the right word) a RWD/AWD platform vs. a FWD/AWD platform. Arguably this is no longer an issue as the 9-7X (though far from perfect) has been recieved well enough.

But while I see your point about Caddy beign a "tarnished brand" I think that this is on the mend (as you point out). I think that there are enough luxury/sport car buyers to be divided between Caddy and Saab. Yeah, Caddy can be RWD primarily and have more of an upscale luxury feel that is distinctively American while also taking on the big boys in their back yard, etc. This is good and it's more "traditional" while also being sporty --- but certainly "american".

Saab can be just as luxurious, but put sportiness before luxury in a simple/Scandanavian kinda way. And since it's decidedly European and not American, you can go around the world with two brands that compliment and work well together. Yeah, there might be some cross shopping, but honestly they have their respective clientel. I think this might work well.

[MuzX]

Hi folks,
I'm really appreciated by the efforts the team did on revitalization.
However, let me say some criticism.
For the Europians they look too American, and they specifications are also too American. I miss the real scandinavian design characteristics and the roots of Saab, it's completely disappeared. There is no hatchback which was the main feature of classic Saabs.

9-1 looks ok for me, 9-3 is also quite well, 9-4X too.
9-5 is a big american sedan with Aero-X style nose, the 9-6X is like Nissan Murano with Aero-X style nose, 9-9X is huge american limousine with Aero-X style nose.
Their engines have no relations to Saab.

You may forget that Saab is very European brand, and should be proud of it, even it's partial owner is GM. These models are mostly for US market only, the 9-9X, the 9-6X are almost impossible to sell in Europe, we don't like the huge, thirsty cars so much than US people.
(With 4 cyl and 2.0 litres my 6 years old car can beat many bigger engines, yet the fuel economy and the emission is excellent, and it's very important for us!)
The lack of powerful, yet economical diesel engines makes them also very difficult to sell in Europe.
E100 fuel is the far future, there are still only the first steps to spread E85...

I think, the E100 Hybrid Convertible concept is a very important step ahead and Saab should make much more efforts to prepare it for manufacturing.

Besides the problems mentioned above, there is no any chance to build them, there are no budget and technical background for all of these develepment. Even I can't see the will of GM to lead Saab to the right direction.

[CADILLACSIXTEEN]

Ok some of these decisons seem very stupid to me...

First, Why would they build the 9-1 on a DELTA, its obvious they would build it on KAPPA.

Second, Why would they say the 9-3 is on EPSILON I when it has already been decided that the next 9-3 would be on the EPSILON II.

EPSILON II is not "another platform", its a replacement for EPSILON I. Its made to not only be better, but also to allow differentiation between brands.