GM-UAW Deal Near?

[asim]

Originally Posted by rlchv70

Remember that the union members still have to vote on it.

I'm sure that whatever the UAW board and GM board will agree upon is designed to get the union members' votes.

[yentam7433]

GM gives the UAW billions of dollars and 3 yr down the road there’s a national health care plan who keeps the money would make one big strike fund

[Gm786]

I'm really hoping that GM and the UAW are near a deal because this is a really important matter for GM. Hopefully everything will work out well for both GM and the UAW.

[mike's 01ws6]

Originally Posted by rlchv70

Remember that the union members still have to vote on it.

Welcome to August!!!

[mike's 01ws6]

Originally Posted by yentam7433

GM gives the UAW billions of dollars and 3 yr down the road there’s a national health care plan who keeps the money would make one big strike fund

It would not be able to be used for that. National health care would probably not cover the same things that a private plan would, so the money would go to supplement the insurance. They would also need to sit on the money in case it didnt work out.

[Ramair-WS6]

Originally Posted by mike's 01ws6

National health care would probably not cover the same things that a private plan would, so the money would go to supplement the insurance. They would also need to sit on the money in case it didnt work out.

Thank you for the typical Union response.

If the US goes to a single payer healthcare system there is NO REASON for the VEBA to exist. The Union does not have a leg to stand on on that issue, you would get the same coverage that every other citizen would get, you would not be ENTITLED to something better.

[PeterPuck]

Originally Posted by KUZCO

and what have you heard u pucker

Well now, let's see...

"Bad management" is responsible for all of GM's woes.

The UAW is responsible for GM's recent effort to "go green".

The execs make huge money and huge bonuses, so GM really isn't in that much trouble at all.

The UAW builds the Corolla, and look how good Toyota is doing!!

50 grand a year plus benefits is not that much anyhow.

GM started the jobs bank, not the UAW. Therefore we're entitled to it.

It's the "workers" who do everything, while management and execs just sit around in cozy little offices.

The problems GM is facing is largely a big show to help with negotiations.

We are entitled to cradle-to-grave security because we give years of our lives to help GM make money.

We need the UAW because corporations are all out to screw us and to look out for themselves only.

We "built" this company.

[sigma]

Originally Posted by PeterPuck

Well now, let's see...

"Bad management" is responsible for all of GM's woes.

The UAW is responsible for GM's recent effort to "go green".

The execs make huge money and huge bonuses, so GM really isn't in that much trouble at all.

The UAW builds the Corolla, and look how good Toyota is doing!!

50 grand a year plus benefits is not that much anyhow.

GM started the jobs bank, not the UAW. Therefore we're entitled to it.

It's the "workers" who do everything, while management and execs just sit around in cozy little offices.

The problems GM is facing is largely a big show to help with negotiations.

We are entitled to cradle-to-grave security because we give years of our lives to help GM make money.

We need the UAW because corporations are all out to screw us and to look out for themselves only.

We "built" this company.

That's just silly to a large degree.

Just to elaborate on the jobs bank point. GM did start the jobs bank to keep trained and skilled labor around when they shut down plants for retooling. It actually saves GM money because they don't have to go hire a brand new workforce since employees have a steady income during those months.

Also if you don't think that Al Dunlop, Jack Smith, Roger Smith, and Ron Zarella (all former GM management last time I checked) are largely responsible for the huge GM finds itself in... you are dreaming. Don't you love how all of those people continue to collect large paychecks from GM as part of their negotiatied retirement packages. If the UAW has to agree to major concessions, so should GM's pool of "retired" hapless executives.

[macphisto]

Originally Posted by Ramair-WS6

Thank you for the typical Union response.

If the US goes to a single payer healthcare system there is NO REASON for the VEBA to exist. The Union does not have a leg to stand on on that issue, you would get the same coverage that every other citizen would get, you would not be ENTITLED to something better.

Hey and we could have people dying on waiting lists like they do in Canada.

The single payer is not the answer nor is it happening any time soon. There's a huge portion of this nation that will never go for it and that will keep it from happening.

We need to look at other ways to lower health care costs outside of a single payer or completely socialized system. All the polling data I've seen suggests a majority of Americans want neither system. Actually most Americans are quite happy with their healthcare situation but have a negative view of it overall.

[macphisto]

Originally Posted by sigma

Also if you don't think that Al Dunlop, Jack Smith, Roger Smith, and Ron Zarella (all former GM management last time I checked) are largely responsible for the huge GM finds itself in... you are dreaming. Don't you love how all of those people continue to collect large paychecks from GM as part of their negotiatied retirement packages. If the UAW has to agree to major concessions, so should GM's pool of "retired" hapless executives.

100% agreed there. Executive salaries and compensation packages are horribly out of control and have been for years. Shareholders just let them get away with it. I have no problem with an exec making some serious $$$ and having a nice retirement package, but most of them now are ludicrous.

A few years ago Disney laid off around 2,000 workers in nearby Disney World. Disney was apparently struggling to make ends meet, but they still managed to pay Eisner a $150+ million bonus when he was still the CEO. Chances are that bonus could have easily paid for those 2,000 workers. Eisner had made more than enough money before that bonus.

[DuSpinnst]

Originally Posted by Ramair-WS6

Thank you for the typical Union response.

If the US goes to a single payer healthcare system there is NO REASON for the VEBA to exist. The Union does not have a leg to stand on on that issue, you would get the same coverage that every other citizen would get, you would not be ENTITLED to something better.

Except National Heathcare isn't going to be like that (and isn't like that in many countries).

The Government (in most countries) offers BASIC healthcare, so things like regular checkups and hospitalization are covered. However other costs are not covered (like preventive care, specialization, elective surgery, elective prescriptions ala Viagra) but can be covered under a private rider insurance.

Since the UAW has the best healthcare, there is NO WAY a government plan will cover everything they get now, the difference would still have to be paid for by GM and the other automakers.

As an example my Uncles in Germany have Private Insurance that rides on top of the Socialized Medicines they get from the government.

[DuSpinnst]

Originally Posted by sigma

That's just silly to a large degree.

Just to elaborate on the jobs bank point. GM did start the jobs bank to keep trained and skilled labor around when they shut down plants for retooling. It actually saves GM money because they don't have to go hire a brand new workforce since employees have a steady income during those months.

Its silly until you realize once GM creates something like that they cannot destroy it. If GM created it shouldn't it be able to destroy it?

Shouldn't GM be able to "take back" everything it has given? I believe all non-union people have to deal with this, why does the UAW seem to think once it is "in the bag" they get to keep it forever.

They bargain every few years for a reason, and its not so the UAW can get more, it is also so they can GIVE BACK what they don't need.

The Union has an entitlement problem, and that is a fact. That and the perpetual misinformation about what Engineering and other people do is a huge problem (I've worked both in a plant and in an office and from what I see the average person has a GROSS misunderstanding about what the other side does).

[chrisbenz]

It would be great to they do not strike.

[plane]

Another long night of UAW contract talks possible

Sunday, September 16, 2007
Sharon Terlep / The Detroit News

Union leaders, company officials and the bargaining teams involved in the talks between General Motors Corp. and the United Auto Workers Sunday afternoon were preparing for the possibility of another long night of negotiations.

Big issues remain unresolved as the two sides try to hammer out what is expected to be a historic and pattern-setting labor agreement for the U.S. auto industry.

The chief executives of Detroit's Big Three automakers had a joint conference call Saturday to discuss the contract negotiations, sources familiar with the talks said.

Article continues at link...

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll...DATE/709160352

[plane]

GM-UAW Talks Focus on the Cost of Retiree Health Care As Bargainers Continue to Haggle
Wednesday September 19, 9:19 pm ET
By Tom Krisher and Dee-Ann Durbin, AP Auto Writers

DETROIT (AP) -- As bargainers for the United Auto Workers and General Motors Corp. continue to haggle across a table in Detroit, the big issue in the critical contract talks comes down to this: If GM pays the union to take on the company's huge retiree health care obligations, can the UAW's investments return more than the rate of health care inflation?

GM wants to unload much of its roughly $51 billion in unfunded retiree health costs to a trust that would be administered by the union. The UAW in exchange wants promises that GM will continue building cars at union-represented plants.

It's the key obstacle of the talks, and the complexities are what's dragging them out. The two sides have yet to agree on how much GM will put into the trust, a person who had been briefed on the bargaining said Wednesday. The person, who requested anonymity because the negotiations are private, said the talks likely would take several more days to complete.

Wednesday was the fifth day of bargaining since GM's contract with the UAW was scheduled to expire, but the union has extended the pact hour by hour. Negotiators went home for the night about 9 p.m. and were to meet again Thursday, GM spokesman Tom Wickham said.

Article continues at link...

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/070919/auto_talks.html?.v=13