Bob Lutz Discusses Park Avenue; GMInsidenews Makes National TV!

[camaro_freak]

Originally Posted by PsychoBueller

So Buick dealers essentially voted for a G-body FWD LOOOOONG front overhang beast instead of the stunning Park Ave? I hope thay all go out of business.

exactly.. it's time for some pimp slapping

This proves Buick dealers, or at the ones that were brought it, have COMPLETELY lost touch with what their brand is supposed to represent.

It is time for a major housecleaning at Buick

[asim]

Originally Posted by mgescuro

Wait wait wait wait!

What exactly is the problem with the SLS??? It wasn't brought to the US with the Chinese interior because of the side impact issue???

THEN KEEP THE STS THE SAME SIZE AND DROP IN THE INTERIOR!!!

First of all, yay for Ming and GMI!

I think Lutz has some of the right views, he just needs some time to get things going at a good pace. Also, just drop the SLS interior into the STS and NO ONE will complain then!

[sprchev1]

Originally Posted by PsychoBueller

So Buick dealers essentially voted for a G-body FWD LOOOOONG front overhang beast instead of the stunning Park Ave? I hope thay all go out of business.

Not sure if any of you guys work for Buick dealers but I would have to say they know what is going to sell and what is not. If it weren't for the dealers Buick may already be on the ash heap of automotive history. GM is in the business of manufacturing cars. Dealers are in the business of selling cars. GM has tried to do both in the past and it has bitten them in the ass each time. They need to stick to making cars and let the dealers sell them.

Not saying GM should always listen to the dealers but they need to remember the sales side of things is ultimately in the dealers hands.

[2648562]

I want to know how the Chinese Park Avenue compares in size to the Lucerne. If it's not significantly larger why bother? Seriously, why? Aside from rear wheel drive, a decent looking front-end, and some luxury appointments I really don't see this car making any difference here. Do you really think rear wheel drive is what Buick buyers crave? Are you all hot for its optional 250 horsepower? My guess is it's the blue-tooth more than anything that's got everyone so upset. Sales, not fantasies, are whats going to save Buick. As it sits, I wouldn't want to do anything other than sit in the backseat for a bit. And I doubt most American Lexus or Infiniti buyers would either. Is it better than most Buicks? In a lot of (okay, almost all) respects yes. Heck yes. But IMO, GM is going to have to do way better here if they have any desire to stop Buick's date with death.

Congrats for getting anything out of Bob Lutz though. You're the first person outside of the board room GM has probably ever listened to!

[I-Love-Pontiac]

Originally Posted by 2648562

I want to know how the Chinese Park Avenue compares in size to the Lucerne. If it's not significantly larger why bother?

Well why does Lexus have the LS and GS? The main difference between those 2 vehicles isn't the size, it's the class level. The LS is Lexus's flagship that goes all out in refinement and features.

That's what the Park Ave would be for Buick. Although I'm not sure how well it could compete. The new LS really is amazing...

His smirk when he said the name aggravated me a little bit, but oh well.

Yeah me too. It gave a very "oh those silly kids and their websites" impression.

[69Firebird400]

Great work, Ming. Too bad he referred to the site as "GM InsiderNews." His smirk when he said the name aggravated me a little bit, but oh well.

As for the content of the interview, I only watched from the 14:45 point until the end of that segment, but I like the idea of offering a RWD Buick flagship based on the Chinese Park Avenue. Would US buyers accept that car if it was built in China, or would they insist that it be built in Australia instead? Lutz wants some separation in pricing; Australian labor costs versus Chinese should make the price separation easier. Just PLEASE don't de-content it!

Originally Posted by 2648562

I want to know how the Chinese Park Avenue compares in size to the Lucerne. If it's not significantly larger why bother? Seriously, why? Aside from rear wheel drive, a decent looking front-end, and some luxury appointments I really don't see this car making any difference here. Do you really think rear wheel drive is what Buick buyers crave? Are you all hot for its optional 250 horsepower? My guess is it's the blue-tooth more than anything that's got everyone so upset. Sales, not fantasies, are whats going to save Buick. As it sits, I wouldn't want to do anything other than sit in the backseat for a bit. And I doubt most American Lexus or Infiniti buyers would either. Is it better than most Buicks? In a lot of (okay, almost all) respects yes. Heck yes. But IMO, GM is going to have to do way better here if they have any desire to stop Buick's date with death.

Congrats for getting anything out of Bob Lutz though. You're the first person outside of the board room GM has probably ever listened to!

Size does not necessarily equal luxury, or even a superior product. This is something that GM is still having trouble understanding, as evidenced by the CTS that was supposed to compete with the 3-series BMW, but actually is 5-series sized. They're hopefully starting to "get" this with the BLS becoming the 3-series competitor instead in a few years. But have you ever noticed how in most cases, the GM offering is larger and heavier than its competitors?? Not everyone is looking for the biggest car for the money! I don't care if the Park Avenue is two inches longer - as long as its interior is nicer, it rides/handles better, and has a more powerful engine than the Lucerne, then it's not going to step on the Lucerne's toes. And if it does, the Buick dealers should be happy, because they'd be selling a higher margin vehicle, thus making more money. If the Chinese Park Avenue has a 250 horsepower optional engine (which I do not know for sure), that does not mean that a US import would. I guarantee it would have a V8, and probably standard, to set it apart from both the Lucerne and the similar Pontiac G8 that would be sold in the same showroom in most situations.

[2648562]

Originally Posted by I-Love-Pontiac

Well why does Lexus have the LS and GS? The main difference between those 2 vehicles isn't the size, it's the class level. The LS is Lexus's flagship that goes all out in refinement and features.

That's what the Park Ave would be for Buick. Although I'm not sure how well it could compete. The new LS really is amazing...

You're right, Lexus could crush it in their sleep. And sadly, it is in a better class. But then again, Buick has shown in the past that they don't need every luxury appointment under the sun to sell well. I just think as far as a halo car goes (which is all it could be).... it's pretty weak. Again, I don't know what they need (Buick buyers are a strange breed). After seeing this and thinking about it the last few weeks, I feel pretty strongly that Buick needs more than a modern-day Catera though. A larger than large DTS level Buick might sell. But then again, what was said about margins makes sense too. Whatever they decide, I hope there isn't much Chinese about it. I'm not too fond of people that eat dogs.

[minnfang]

Good job Ming - you prompted a great discussion on the video!

[BusyBody]

Great video, thanks for the link.

[jlmartin99]

Greetings Ming,

Kudos, I watched the interview and all I can say is I remain a fan of Bob Lutz and team. Even more it does look like the current STS will be dropped and new CTS will replace it. I guess I should really take a hard look at the 2008 CTS, it looks like it just may be in my future.

JLM

[E. Haskell]

Bob Lutz is my favorite corporate car guy.

[steinravnik]

The Park Ave is a nice looking sedan. Worlds better than Lucerne.

[t-rex]

What's with that Canadian CAW moron? Who moved the rock? And why can't he pronounce "Mazda" correctly? This guy is an outright liar! I hope viewers of that TV show don't actually believe that stupid, outright untrue crap he spouted about the Japanese market. Why do people believe everything they see on TV?

I could just choke some of these a-holes...

Is it just me? Or does Bob Lutz seem to pant and gasp like he's 5 nanoseconds from expiring from a major coronary? Maybe he just needs to rip some incredibly huge fart. At any rate, it was entertaining to watch him. Pass the man some Prilosec.

I most liked Lutz's chortling comment about the Buick dealer "not at the meeting." That's because the way GM runs things, they probably didn't contact actual dealers, but rather some "dealer advisory panel" consisting of 4 clueless members of upper management. Imagine the poor dealers getting blamed for poor product. Sounds like a lot of passing the buck to me...

Way to go Ming! GMI is making waves at the hest of our great semi-leader!

[jbartley]

Originally Posted by 63cat

Nice job! The Park Avenue should be called Electra here and definitely have portholes.

Electra. I like that. That would fit nicely with Lucerne & Enclave.

[stevecmh]

i hope they bring it back.. my family has had a few.. they were fancy cars