Look Out Toyota! Holden To Launch Small Car Attack In 2009

[spidge]

Originally Posted by steve333

GMDAT has produced nothing but ****. Suzuki Forenza, Reno, etc, the Aveo. Yeh they are selling OK but they are still ****.
Why on earth are they even touching the next Cobalt, Barina, Viva, or whatever? Did they suddenly get competent? Are they going to use interior materials that dont smell like a toxic dump?
I'm starting to get pessimistic about the next batch of small GM cars if they are anything remotely like the GMDAT Trash we have now.

My guess is it's because GMDAT engineers work relatively quickly and cheaply, which would translate to lower-priced small cars.

[BBDOS CV8]

The Barina and Viva are two vehicles with least input by Holden, followed by Epica. Captiva has had input and is more than competitive with it's main opposition. Again, they've got constrained supply of them, too, despite moving manufacture to the Isuzu plant in Thailand.

The Captiva diesel soon to appear in the Epica is a sign of the future: it's already Euro V compliant and actually produces a few extra Kx over the Mondeo TDi, and it's a joint Daewoo/Fiat/VM Motori design that's right up to the minute. Same with the engine in the Holden Rodeo/Colorado which is competitive with the opposition.

People have to get over this Korean/Asian thing. Ford is moving Fiesta to Thailand to source it cheaper. Renault is about to build a small SUV based on the Nissan X-Trial at Ssanyong which will start in Oz at a RAV4/CR\V bashing sub $30K price.

The Daewoos we've seen have no quality issues - ask any industry underwriters. They have design/development inadequacies. It's easier to fix that than it is to create a competent, motivated consistent-quality-capable workforce.

Unless Holden produces it's own shortened VE and can assemble it on the existing plant at Elizabeth you won't see a Torrie made here. More likely to be made in Mexico.

[TKR]

Originally Posted by steve333

GMDAT has produced nothing but ****. Suzuki Forenza, Reno, etc, the Aveo. Yeh they are selling OK but they are still ****.
Why on earth are they even touching the next Cobalt, Barina, Viva, or whatever? Did they suddenly get competent? Are they going to use interior materials that dont smell like a toxic dump?
I'm starting to get pessimistic about the next batch of small GM cars if they are anything remotely like the GMDAT Trash we have now.

IT IS NOT GOING TO BE A DAEWOO!!!! It will be a GM GLOBAL vehicle. gggrrrrrrrrr!!!!!

Go and have a look inside a Saturn Vue and get back to us...xxxxx (edited due to bad language).
Also, if you actually have done some reading about the changes made to Epica, you may have noticed that some significant changes have been made already.

As for competent...I will agree that the Viva and Barina are hardly standard setting but the number of warranty claims for these vehicles is very low. How do I know?...I enter claims at a dealership. Also I can tell you that the Epica with the 6 spd auto is a very smooth, economical mid sized car.

After seeing the effort, and results, of Holden's and GM's input into the Epica and Captiva I think many will be very surprised when the Viva (or Cobalt???) is launched in NZ and Aust. Also the next Barina (Aveo) will be based on the next gen Corsa so I would expect huge improvement over the current gen vehicles on the market now. This is due in the next 12 -18 months.

[Ssom]

Originally Posted by BBDOS CV8

The Barina and Viva are two vehicles with least input by Holden, followed by Epica. Captiva has had input and is more than competitive with it's main opposition. Again, they've got constrained supply of them, too, despite moving manufacture to the Isuzu plant in Thailand.

The Captiva diesel soon to appear in the Epica is a sign of the future: it's already Euro V compliant and actually produces a few extra Kx over the Mondeo TDi, and it's a joint Daewoo/Fiat/VM Motori design that's right up to the minute. Same with the engine in the Holden Rodeo/Colorado which is competitive with the opposition.

People have to get over this Korean/Asian thing. Ford is moving Fiesta to Thailand to source it cheaper. Renault is about to build a small SUV based on the Nissan X-Trial at Ssanyong which will start in Oz at a RAV4/CR\V bashing sub $30K price.

The Daewoos we've seen have no quality issues - ask any industry underwriters. They have design/development inadequacies. It's easier to fix that than it is to create a competent, motivated consistent-quality-capable workforce.

Unless Holden produces it's own shortened VE and can assemble it on the existing plant at Elizabeth you won't see a Torrie made here. More likely to be made in Mexico.

I'll get over it when GMDAT start making good small cars. There's nothing wrong with building in Asia, but until we start seeing GM's investment in shifting the small car development in Korea (Hopefully staffed this time with people who know what they are doing) then I reserve my scepticism.

Far as I'm concerned, build something that can match Fords Euro product in all areas and you can build it in Madagascar for all I care. My Accord was assembled in a shed in Nelson yet still has superior fit and finish to US and Japanese made Accords, just shows how much the plant has to do with the end result (Sod all).

[RedVee8]

Originally Posted by Ssom

I'll get over it when GMDAT start making good small cars. There's nothing wrong with building in Asia, but until we start seeing GM's investment in shifting the small car development in Korea (Hopefully staffed this time with people who know what they are doing) then I reserve my scepticism.

Far as I'm concerned, build something that can match Fords Euro product in all areas and you can build it in Madagascar for all I care. My Accord was assembled in a shed in Nelson yet still has superior fit and finish to US and Japanese made Accords, just shows how much the plant has to do with the end result (Sod all).

GMDAT is now GM and will be a full member in the Gamma and DeltaII cars. They will be as good a car in development terms as any of their siblings. Equipment levels and styling nicities may be different of course, but these are always subjective.

Slightly different tack, will GMDAT be utilising the Thailand and Malaysian factories?

[Sal Collaziano]

Those Koreans know how to build cars...