Hyundai Genesis > 300C, GS460, E550

[Michael_S]

Originally Posted by Ach

Don't get me wrong, I think this car is a huge accomplishment- I just don't find anything "unreal" about the accel numbers.

Unreal for a Hyundai.

[BGH]

Perhaps the most striking similarity between the Genesis and the E550 is the sense of solidity. Shut the doors, and the body emits nary a quiver. Aggressively accelerate through a sharp curve, and the structure avoids flex like a Kevlar baseball bat. Credit goes to the Genesis's extensive use of high-strength steel -- Hyundai claims it is applied to 74 percent of the body -- which creates a structure that is stiffer in twisting and bending, according to Hyundai, than the E's.

I read somewhere it's stiffer than GS and the 5 series. It's also going to have a terrific sound system.

[E. Haskell]

I'm gonna walk into the local Hyundai dealer and when they say "are you here for the $7,999 Accent special" - I'm gonna say "hell no - I come to offer you the sum of $25,000 for a V8 Genesis."

[AMERICA 123]

Originally Posted by Ach

What is unreal about it? It's barely quicker than a V6 Camry - .

NOPE - it appears to be quicker - by a lot.

Motortrend's fastest 0 - 60 time for a Camry V6 was an '07 SE at 6.1 - before all the uh... software updates.

Your later post mentions Car and Driver's 5.8 - also done with an 'early' 'intro' '07 - although they don't tell you that in the article you linked - which no one has come close to duplicating.

The above 6.1 is the second quickest reported. Most are in the 6.22 ( Autoweek ) to 6.8 range ( some were higher ) with the biggest cluster around 6.4 -6.6.

Later Camry v6s are reported the same or slower.

Toyota's own claim on launch was reported two ways - 6.8 and 7.0.

9,999 OUT OF 10,000 times you can add a half second or so to Toyota's number to get what most do - the '07's tested at launch were that rare pleasant occurrence of being slightly quicker.

Certain software up dates were reported by some as having slowed the car down just a touch.

Since Motortrend is the crew testing the Genesis here, using their best number for the Camry V6 still puts the Hyundai six tenths quicker.

Really, we need a lot more numbers for the Genesis - and up to date numbers for the 2009 Camry V6 to get a useful comparison range for each.

Hyundai has really gotten their game together here on emissions, fuel consumption, and power simultaneously compared to their fairly recent past.

[Xenon]

Originally Posted by ptviperz

Is that a joke? 40K might get you 328, you can't touch a 335 for that.

G35S is a good buy at 40K

40K is a barebones 335i sedan. As for the Genesis, it bests every Buick sedan (The V6 Genesis has more power on tap on all but the Super model Buicks), and every Cadillac sedan available save for the CTS. Sad how a Hyundai makes a better car than both of GM's "Luxury" divisions.

[paul8488]

Hyundai deserves credit for their perserverence... they keep slugging away, trying to creep upmarket. Are they going to build an all-round better car than the established luxury players in one go? Of course not. But I think that this is an awesome attempt. Not everyone will be convinced... but with the economy suffering as it is, people that still want luxury and power but are having a hard time coughing up extra for a logo will be very happy with this car.

Oh, and it has a real name... I think that Genesis is a fantastic name for a luxury car... much better than any alphanumeric name.

Maybe Cadillac can get Hyundai to build them an STS / DTS replacement?

Finally... to whoever said 'whatever' to a huge luxury sedan doing 0-60 in 5.5 seconds... are you serious?!? 5.5 seconds! 10 years ago that was supercar territory! I find that pretty darn impressive. Even the V6 is as quick as a CTS, which is a significantly smaller car. Aside from those of you that park a Ferrari or Lamborghini in your garage each night, the Genesis should do alright as a full-size luxury sedan.

[paul8488]

Can't wait to see a test of the Genesis coupe (or whatever they're calling it)... it has to be lighter than the sedan... so the V6 should put up some good numbers.

I know they're not planning a V8 version, but I really wish they would, even in very small numbers. Just to give a bit more credibility to the car... it's going to have a tough time creating a name for itself alongside the Mustang, Camaro, and Challenger... all cars with impressibe history and impressive credentials to back that up.

[paul8488]

While we're on Hyundai... just compared the Canadian and France lineups. In France they have the new i10, Getz, and i30... while in Canada (and US I assume) they have the Accent and Elantra. I don't get why they have different models for North America... the i10 might be a bit small for NA, but why have different subcompact and compact models? The i10 and i30 are quite nice... Getz needs a redo soon though. Surely they'll streamline their lineups... right?

[Michael_S]

Originally Posted by blue3231

It'll be interesting to see how well this car does. I think it'll be hampered by the Hyundai name though. Maybe they should've started a new brand called Genesis (as I believe they did elsewhere). They could have this sedan, the Azera as a front-drive luxury car [ES350], the Veracruz as the CUV [RX350], and that new rear-drive coupe [G37 coupe]. Throw in an SUV based on the Borrego and that's a pretty complete line-up.

I agree the Hyundai name is definitely a handicap.

There were some news articles about this a few months back. Hyundai researched starting a new luxury brand. They would need to build new much more expensive and luxurious dealerships, hire staff for the new dealerships, create new advertising for the brand. They figured it would be 15 to 20 years before creating a separate luxury brand paid for itself. For right now, they decided against it. If the company is very successful for a few years, they may go for it.

But part of the reason the Genesis is so cheap for what you get (in terms of luxury, if not performance) is that they don't have to support fancy dealerships and all the costs associated with them.

[Sal Collaziano]

Originally Posted by blue3231

It'll be interesting to see how well this car does. I think it'll be hampered by the Hyundai name though. Maybe they should've started a new brand called Genesis (as I believe they did elsewhere). They could have this sedan, the Azera as a front-drive luxury car [ES350], the Veracruz as the CUV [RX350], and that new rear-drive coupe [G37 coupe]. Throw in an SUV based on the Borrego and that's a pretty complete line-up.

I agree.. Instead, they're testing the waters of the luxury market first..

[Sal Collaziano]

Good luck. Many people are paying a $5000.00 market adjustment just to get the car... Imagine that? An extra $5000.00 for NOTHING - just to own a Hyundai...

Originally Posted by E. Haskell

I'm gonna walk into the local Hyundai dealer and when they say "are you here for the $7,999 Accent special" - I'm gonna say "hell no - I come to offer you the sum of $25,000 for a V8 Genesis."

[Sal Collaziano]

This is exactly what I was trying to say. In the "real world", most people aren't going to get much better than a 6.2 in a Camry. I think it's going to be very different for the Genesis - which is in Chrysler 300C territory. The 0-60 in 5.5 seconds comes without Summer tires either... That simple mod alone will likely improve times...

Originally Posted by AMERICA 123

NOPE - it appears to be quicker - by a lot.

Motortrend's fastest 0 - 60 time for a Camry V6 was an '07 SE at 6.1 - before all the uh... software updates.

Your later post mentions Car and Driver's 5.8 - also done with an 'early' 'intro' '07 - although they don't tell you that in the article you linked - which no one has come close to duplicating.

The above 6.1 is the second quickest reported. Most are in the 6.22 ( Autoweek ) to 6.8 range ( somewhere higher ) with the biggest cluster around 6.4 -6.6.

Later Camry v6s are reported the same or slower.

Toyota's own claim on launch was reported two ways - 6.8 and 7.0.

9,999 OUT OF 10,000 times you can add a half second or so to Toyota's number to get what most do - the '07's tested at launch were that rare pleasant occurrence of being slightly quicker.

Certain software up dates were reported by some as having slowed the car down just a touch.

Since Motortrend is the crew testing the Genesis here, using their best number for the Camry V6 still puts the Hyundai six tenths quicker.

Really, we need a lot more numbers for the Genesis - and up to date numbers for the 2009 Camry V6 to get a useful comparison range for each.

Hyundai has really gotten their game together here on emissions, fuel consumption, and power simultaneously compared to their fairly recent past.

[Sal Collaziano]

Aaahahahahaha! I said this a month or so ago. Really! I hope they get in contact with Hyundai soon...

Originally Posted by paul8488

Maybe Cadillac can get Hyundai to build them an STS / DTS replacement?

Finally... to whoever said 'whatever' to a huge luxury sedan doing 0-60 in 5.5 seconds... are you serious?!? 5.5 seconds! 10 years ago that was supercar territory! I find that pretty darn impressive. Even the V6 is as quick as a CTS, which is a significantly smaller car. Aside from those of you that park a Ferrari or Lamborghini in your garage each night, the Genesis should do alright as a full-size luxury sedan.

The Genesis Coupe has the performance aftermarket very busy. There will be some nice performance upgrades available shortly after launch in February... The name should remain "Genesis". There's a lot of talk about it already and it would be crazy to name it anything else at this point.

Originally Posted by paul8488

Can't wait to see a test of the Genesis coupe (or whatever they're calling it)... it has to be lighter than the sedan... so the V6 should put up some good numbers.

I know they're not planning a V8 version, but I really wish they would, even in very small numbers. Just to give a bit more credibility to the car... it's going to have a tough time creating a name for itself alongside the Mustang, Camaro, and Challenger... all cars with impressibe history and impressive credentials to back that up.

[Sal Collaziano]

While we're at it, here's another review of the Genesis:
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...opanel..1.*#22

[GrandPrix08]

First of all, I am not sure how this thread relates to the European Competition, for I see this 'Asian' make thread posted in the European section. Hmmm.

As for the Genesis, and the ones who wonder how they came out with the V8, last I heard that they spent millions of dollars and a lot of trial and error and wasted several years to come out with this thing called a 'Tau'. Another thing is that, even though they took this long to come out with it, it's still not proven yet, since they are more experienced with their smaller engines they learned from their previous partner Mitsubishi. No-one knows if this engine will be good enough for a long run, for it is their definate first and as I understand, it's only for North America, the Korean version won't be offered the V8.

As for the European model that differs in North American market, as to why the cars like Getz, Atoz, or i series are not availiable in the North America, I've heard something about the cost. There are rumors that they may be sold for a lot higher price in the States than they can in the European market, Why? I don't know, there is just this rumor that they just won't cut it in the American market. Even though Hyundai is bringing the extended wagon version of the i30 a bit later to US/Canada named as an Elantra Touring.

As for the availiability of the Genesis, I think the bigger dealers tends to get a lot of cars in their lots, and smaller ones gets anywhere between 1 or 2 for their showrooms. I know this, since my local dealer currently has 4 of them(3 parked on their lot, and 1 in the showroom), and when I picked up a paper this morning, I've seen an ad from one of the dealer that advertises of having 20 Genesis in stock, yet, I still haven't seen ANY on the road. I guess the car isn't really a hit in New Jersey, for I did see a couple 09 Maxima's, 09 Pilots(though it's been out for quite some time) and others cruising in town, but NONE of the Genesises. If the car was selling, I should have seen at least one or two on the street by now, so I guess it isn't doing too well.

As for the new premium brand, the news has it that, it will cost Hyundai some 2.5Billion Dollars just to set it up, and it will take a good 10-20 years to really get it established to see any form of profits to roll in.

As for the 'Market Adjustment', I think the dealers who plays that game is just a few percentage, for, even for the New Jersey Dealers, besides the one that charge $5,000, I have never seen others in my area who plays that markup game. I have called all 4 Dealers that I know in Northern NJ, they didn't even know what I'm talking about, and they told me not to worry about it, for they don't do that stuffs. So, it will be a matter of time that those non-sense will fade out.

Also, American bound Genesis is cheaper than Korean domestic models since Hyundai removed some features in cutting the cost, from the cars. Features like Passenger cooled seat, rear DVD entertainment system, Air-ride suspention, Smart Cruise(rumorred to be comming soon to US models), so that is why the car can be sold for less.

Sorry for the long post.