Motor Trend Was Wrong: Next Cadillac FWD

[megeebee]

From Automotive News:

Cadillac flagship will share Buick LaCrosse platform

Rick Kranz
and Jamie Lareau
Automotive News | August 10, 2009 - 12:01 am EST
Cadillac's new flagship will share a platform with the new Buick LaCrosse but will be wider and more luxurious, industry and General Motors Co. sources say.

The Cadillac, code-named XTS, is expected in 2011 and will replace the front-drive DTS and rear-drive STS, the sources say. The X in the code-name suggests that all-wheel drive will be optional or standard.

The car is part of an emerging strategy for Cadillac that mirrors BMW's three-car lineup of small, medium and large. The CTS would be the medium-sized car, and a new small Cadillac also is expected in 2011, sources say.

GM has made little secret of the new flagship, showing a drawing of the concept to dealers at a meeting last month in Detroit. Details are emerging about its platform and production site.

The new flagship may be assembled at GM's Oshawa, Ontario, plant, the Canadian Auto Workers union says.

GM told the CAW last month that the Oshawa plant will be getting two new mid-sized sedans, says Chris Buckley, CAW Local 222 president.

While the specific models were not revealed to the CAW local, "there is a very real possibility that a Cadillac will be built in the city of Oshawa," Buckley says.

Oshawa will produce a hybrid, short-wheelbase sedan in the first quarter of 2011, and a long-wheelbase sedan will go into production in 2013, said Jennifer Wright, a GM Canada spokeswoman. She declined to reveal the brand of the new models.

The Cadillac sedan will be developed on GM's new global mid-sized vehicle platform, industry sources say. The first U.S. vehicle developed on that front-drive platform is the 2010 LaCrosse, which goes on sale this month.

But sources say that platform will be modified, creating a car that is 1.5 to 2.0 inches wider than other vehicles developed on the same platform. The LaCrosse is 73.1 inches wide, already about a half-inch wider than the CTS.

A source says Cadillac wants the cabin comfort that buyers expect in a luxury vehicle. Overall, the Cadillac sedan will be about 200 inches long. By comparison, the redesigned 2010 Mercedes-Benz E-class sedan is 191.7 inches long and 75.9 inches wide.

Still to be determined is whether awd will be standard or optional on the Cadillac XTS.

The Oshawa car plant produces the Chevrolet Impala and the Camaro on separate lines. Buckley says the line for the rwd Camaro is flexible and can assemble rwd and fwd vehicles.

More: www.autonews.com
(Subscription)

[megeebee]

I realize this is only kinda'-sotra' news. But it looks official that the Epsilon II platform will be the foundation for the next Cadillac sedan and not a stretched Sigma.

And alas, even Automotive News used the "F" word.

.

[Suziebob]

What makes Automotive News more reliable a source than Motor Trend?

[ChevyRules]

What is still wrong with GM is showing........ How much do you want to bet that this EPII boat will get the same if not worse fuel economy( due to AWD) then a Zeta equivalent Cadillac? As the G8 and LaCrosse both get the same fuel economy.......

What will this XTS compete against? The LS, 7, and S class? I think not. Unless they debut the rumored 3.6TT V6, then it is mediocreville again for anything bigger then the CTS.

[Suziebob]

Nothing is showing. This offers absolutely no new information and is nothing more than speculation and it even contradicts itself. It says it's talking about the next gen full size Cadillac, then drops this line.

GM told the CAW last month that the Oshawa plant will be getting two new mid-sized sedans, says Chris Buckley, CAW Local 222 president.

[ChevyRules]

Originally Posted by Suziebob

Nothing is showing. This offers absolutely no new information and is nothing more than speculation and it even contradicts itself. It says it's talking about the next gen full size Cadillac, then drops this line.

Those two vehicles are the Regal and overflow for the EPII Malibu.

You would approve of this FWD Cadillac based off a mainstream platform as Cadillac's flagship sedan to go against the LS, 7, and S Class? Why keep Buick in NA? I wouldn't have a problem with FWD in Cadillac's if Buick was not around........

Anything that goes after Lexus's FWD offerings and Acura should be a Buick. Anything that goes after the GS, LS, IS, 3 series, 5/6 series, 7 series, Z4, S Class, etc goes to Cadillac. It's quite simple, but GM loves to screw things up and blur the boundries between what Cadillac is going after and what Buick is going after or makes the Cadillac a joke in the segment. What is going to be the top engine for this Cadillac? Unless we see the rumored 3.6TT V6, this car will have 280-304 HP max and that doesn't come close to the full size luxury sedans. Not to mention Merc and BMW have V10's and V12's in the S and 7 series.

[Ultra Magnus]

I am just not impressed with what GM is planning for Caddy. Unless AWD is standard with a rear bias then how can you realistically call this car a flagship when the midsize CTS will out perform it in every reasonable way. And what of the V variant? Is that going to go away completely from Caddy or are we going to be left with another STS-V type vehicle that is outgunned by its smaller cheaper sibling.

[Suziebob]

Show me spyshots or an official GM statement. Until then, this is just speculation.

[ChevyRules]

Originally Posted by Suziebob

Show me spyshots or an official GM statement. Until then, this is just speculation.

Even NSAP has hinted the DTS/STS replacement will ride on an extended EPII. Unless something changed recently( which it can knowing GM), that is the current plan.......

[mikesright]

Originally Posted by ChevyRules

Even NSAP has hinted the DTS/STS replacement will ride on an extended EPII. Unless something changed recently( which it can knowing GM), that is the current plan.......

I think it's safe to say we need to wait a little bit for a spyshot or other evidence before we pronouce this as fact. GM has been toying with a new flagship for Cadillac, and smaller products for years now. I doubt that we are going to see a bad effort on an important car for Cadillac.

Plus, we know management is in turmoil right now as layers get purged from the executive ranks and new leaders of each division get established.

[Suziebob]

Plus, even if it is full size FWD/AWD, who on this board is going to buy one? Who buys a BMW 7 Series who drives the car themselves? Executives can be shuffled around in a FWD/AWD car just as well as in a RWD car. If it saves development costs... it may not be a horrible thing. As long as the CTS and ATS are RWD.

[ChevyRules]

Originally Posted by mikesright

I think it's safe to say we need to wait a little bit for a spyshot or other evidence before we pronouce this as fact. GM has been toying with a new flagship for Cadillac, and smaller products for years now. I doubt that we are going to see a bad effort on an important car for Cadillac.

I would say SRX was a poor effort. Not only did it dump a good platform( Sigma/Sigma II) in favor of TE, it is a fat heavy pig proving too much for the 3.0 SIDI and good enough for the class with the 2.8T. It is EMBARRASSING that the Escalade outperforms it by roughly a second 0-60 and it weighs 1100 lb. more then the SRX. The interior might be good and the AWD system makes it a good handler, but this should have been a Buick, not a Cadillac.

Originally Posted by Suziebob

Plus, even if it is full size FWD/AWD, who on this board is going to buy one? Who buys a BMW 7 Series who drives the car themselves? Executives can be shuffled around in a FWD/AWD car just as well as in a RWD car. If it saves development costs... it may not be a horrible thing. As long as the CTS and ATS are RWD.

Cadillac can not penny pinch like that. The segment demands V8's( or V8 power) and V12's. With the XTS being limited to EPII, as of now the only engine available to it is the 3.6 SIDI. This Cadillac will be down already by 100 HP compared to the 7 series with its TT V8. I hope the rumored 3.6TT comes because it is this Cadillac's ONLY hope to not be a joke in the segment if this rumor is true.....

[fan]

Well, if a FWD replacement for DTS is somewhat needed, a FWD Cadillac the size of LaCrosse could be offered.
But it should not be advertised or seen as a 7 series or S class competitor and it should not be as large as them. It would be some sort of a niche luxury vehicle for American market. A large "land-yacht" powered by small engines offering awfull dynamics would not fit Cadillac's new image.
However a RWD large sedan, larger, more imposing than a 7 series would be the real thing.
I assume...

[Aprime]

Originally Posted by Suziebob

Who buys a BMW 7 Series who drives the car themselves?

I don't know what fantasy world you live in but here, bimmers - regardless of their size are driven by their owners*, and multi-millionaires own DTSes [with poor car tastes, IMO].

*German officials excluded.

Originally Posted by fan

Well, if a FWD replacement for DTS is somewhat needed, a FWD Cadillac the size of LaCrosse could be offered.
But it should not be advertised or seen as a 7 series or S class competitor and it should not be as large as them. It would be some sort of a niche luxury vehicle for American market. A large "land-yacht" powered by small engines offering awfull dynamics would not fit Cadillac's new image.
However a RWD large sedan, larger, more imposing than a 7 series would be the real thing.
I assume...

It appears that Government Motors doesn't like Zeta.

[Suziebob]

Originally Posted by Aprime

I don't know what fantasy world you live in but here, bimmers - regardless of their size are driven by their owners*, and multi-millionaires own DTSes [with poor car tastes, IMO].

*German officials excluded.



It appears that Government Motors doesn't like Zeta.

I always thought a lot of full size super lux cars were used to move execs and or other people with too much money around.