Ford 6.2L Official numbers are out

[05ChevySilveradoSS]

Originally Posted by Power Kid

ok Guys: GVW = Gross Vehicle weight

Not max tow rating.

If you are going to tow 10,000 with a 5.3L (!) I don't care if it has 16 gears, thats completly stupid, when you can buy a 6.2L that actually has some tq.

Gm doesn't put the 5.3L in thier max tow unit for a reason.

Whatever you say dude.

[Power Kid]

Originally Posted by XCR440SP

Yes, GVWR is Gross Vehicle Weight Rating, but this discussion has been about Towing, GVWR is more about Payload and thats a different animal (one that horsepower and torque take a distance back seat to springs and, brakes, and Ring and pinion size)

Thats fine as long as your trailer has no tounge wieght.... but guess what they do.

Take my rv for example, 8,200lbs dry. No problem right way under the max of a new F150 of @ 11,000 lbs. But its got tounge weight of 1,200 dry!!! So for 09 there was no Crew Ford that could legally tow that puppy.

IF yor pulling some kind of wagon that has a front axle then tnge weight don't matter. Or some guys will drive their bobcat onto the rear half of the trailer to keep the weight on the trailers axles but thats not a real solution.

Gott leave for wknd, continue next week!

[05ChevySilveradoSS]

Originally Posted by Power Kid

In actual fact those tow ratings are almost meaningless given your goign to be over on your rear axle with 95% of the trailers out there well before you hit max tow rating. Its all marketing.

That said Gm has a nice unit with the max tow and before 2010 an advantage over Ford as a max tow loaded Crew Gm had a payload sticker of over 1,700lbs, whereas a 09 Ford could be as much as 1,000lb lower on a appples to apples comparison. Why Gm didn't advertise the heck out of that I don't know. Maybe because they didn't have $$$ to produce, never mind run the ad? Ford has uped the GVW and GAWR/rear for 2010 on their max tow trucks to rectify that. Advantage is gone.

Or mabe bc Gm focases on more than one thing other than towing specs, and though many of us truck buyers dont really care but gm focases on people that are considering buying trucks that are looking for fuel mileage, comfort, safty, and reliability. Those are the focas points in this day and age anyways and gm is doing the right thing by not having max towing cap wars like ford and used to be dodge, and focasing on things that are REALLY important

[Power Kid]

Originally Posted by 05ChevySilveradoSS

Whatever you say dude.

I was telling my GM buddies about this debate... they all pulled rvs with 5.3ls and they're not sure about you man! You love your 5.3L!

[Power Kid]

Originally Posted by 05ChevySilveradoSS

Or mabe bc Gm focases on more than one thing other than towing specs, and though many of us truck buyers dont really care but gm focases on people that are considering buying trucks that are looking for fuel mileage, comfort, safty, and reliability. Those are the focas points in this day and age anyways and gm is doing the right thing by not having max towing cap wars like ford and used to be dodge.

WTF? Wasn't it GM that got the ball rolling jumping to 10,700lbs on the new 07's? Didn't that leap frog ford big time? Forget about that.

Ok this time I really got to go.

[05ChevySilveradoSS]

Originally Posted by Power Kid

WTF? Wasn't it GM that got the ball rolling jumping to 10,700lbs on the new 07's? Didn't that leap frog ford big time? Forget about that.

Ok this time I really got to go.

Haha, well ask yourself this? When did the GMT 900's debut? 07. exactly! there gonna hit on things like that when introducing a NEW truck, but NOW do you hear them bragging about towing capacity, except in the Silverado hybrid commercial .

You have a safe trip power kid (or whatever your doing be safe). This is all discussion nothing personal. I just want to clarify that, oh and are we ever gonna get back on subject lol

[Power Kid]

Good one.

Lets spend an extra +$5k on a truck with half the tow rating! To each his own.

[nailhead425]

Anyone towing a 10,000 lbs RV needs a 3/4 ton. Sorry, but those are quite a bit different than 10,000 lbs of box trailer filled with gravel.

[05ChevySilveradoSS]

Originally Posted by Power Kid

I was telling my GM buddies about this debate... they all pulled rvs with 5.3ls and they're not sure about you man! You love your 5.3L!

Ill say that i love all LS engines period.

I along with other silverado truck owners, know how well these engines work (even more so with the new 6spd) and really this is no discussion man. I mean hey real world vs. your opinion??? I know which ill choose from.

I hear my customers all the time and believe me ive pretty much heard it all, and the majority trade there 5.3 silverados in for another 5.3 silverado. Again i think ill side with real world situations rather than speculation.

Some of you people really dont understand the potential of these engines, few has yet to realize it. Were talking about some of the best engines in the world here. Take it or leave it.

Haha, and nailhead 425 i agree with you 100%. Though im guilty of towing alittle over 9,000 with my 02. . .Yeah i know i need to get me a 2500 but god that 02 has just been so good to me.

[JBsZ06]

Did ford finally give up on that outdated ohc engine layout ?

[nailhead425]

Originally Posted by JBsZ06

Did ford finally give up on that outdated ohc engine layout ?

No. The new engines are still OHC, they just have a larger bore and wider bore spacing. One of the many problems with the old Mod motors (4.6,5.4,V-10) was the small bore and tight bore spacing that led to small, shrouded valves that breathed poorly. Only the 4V, then subsequent 3V heads, improved the breathing so that the engines were on-par with the competition. The under-square 5.4 and V-10 (90mm bore, 105mm stroke) not only had small bores and shrouded valves, the long strokes resulted in crazy high port velocities that further exaggerated the poor breathing characteristics. Which is also why they perform so well with boost.
The new engines will have larger valves, better valve angles and better port flow numbers.

[Johnny P]

Here's some food for thought about the torque of the engines being discussed. Manufacturers will typically size the rear axle according to the capacity of the engine and it's intended use.

GM 5.3L comes with a max ring gear of 8.6"

6.0L uses a minimum of a 9.5" 14 bolt and also either a 10.5" or 11.5" axle in 3/4 ton and up trucks.

Dodge 5.7L Hemi uses a minimum ring gear in trucks of 9.25" and up to 11.5"

Ford gives the 5.4L a ring gear of 9.75" in the 1/2 tons and 10.25" in 3/4 ton and up.

The upcoming 6.2L will likely use the same Sterling 10.25" axle.

Originally Posted by JBsZ06

Did ford finally give up on that outdated ohc engine layout ?

Hopefully so.

[nailhead425]

Originally Posted by Johnny P

Here's some food for thought about the torque of the engines being discussed. Manufacturers will typically size the rear axle according to the capacity of the engine and it's intended use.

GM 5.3L comes with a max ring gear of 8.6"

6.0L uses a minimum of a 9.5" 14 bolt and also either a 10.5" or 11.5" axle in 3/4 ton and up trucks.

Dodge 5.7L Hemi uses a minimum ring gear in trucks of 9.25" and up to 11.5"

Ford gives the 5.4L a ring gear of 9.75" in the 1/2 tons and 10.25" in 3/4 ton and up.

The upcoming 6.2L will likely use the same Sterling 10.25" axle.

Oh there is so much more to the strength of a diff than just the ring gear size. Pinion splines and diameter, axle shaft splines and diameter, pinion gear location on the ring gear, etc.

The 10.25 sterling is a FF design, the 6.2 will have the 9.75 in 1/2 tons.

The Dodge 9.25 is notoriously weak where the GM 8.6 10bolt is notoriously strong, Gov-Loc and the period of poor gasket design not withstanding.

The 9.5 SF 14 bolt in GM trucks is big and very strong. Overkill for most 1/2 tons. It also takes a bit more fuel to turn, just like the Ford 9.75. The Ford 8.8 is very strong as well, but Ford has high payload numbers and the 9.75 is needed to support the weight, not handle the power.

Keep in mind that GM and Dodge both use AAM for their axles. GM for all their trucks (save a few Dana 80s here and there) and Dodge in the 3/4 tons and up.

The AAM 10.50 and 11.50 have a front pinion support bearing and low pickup point on the ring gear which lends a huge amount of strength to the assembly. Similar to the old hotchkiss style Ford 9".

[Johnny P]

Originally Posted by nailhead425

Oh there is so much more to the strength of a diff than just the ring gear size. Pinion splines and diameter, axle shaft splines and diameter, pinion gear location on the ring gear, etc.

The 10.25 sterling is a FF design, the 6.2 will have the 9.75 in 1/2 tons.

The Dodge 9.25 is notoriously weak where the GM 8.6 10bolt is notoriously strong, Gov-Loc and the period of poor gasket design not withstanding.

The 9.5 SF 14 bolt in GM trucks is big and very strong. Overkill for most 1/2 tons. It also takes a bit more fuel to turn, just like the Ford 9.75. The Ford 8.8 is very strong as well, but Ford has high payload numbers and the 9.75 is needed to support the weight, not handle the power.

Keep in mind that GM and Dodge both use AAM for their axles. GM for all their trucks (save a few Dana 80s here and there) and Dodge in the 3/4 tons and up.

The AAM 10.50 and 11.50 have a front pinion support bearing and low pickup point on the ring gear which lends a huge amount of strength to the assembly. Similar to the old hotchkiss style Ford 9".

I get that completely, but it's a good indicator.

My whole point is that there is a reason the Hemi doesn't use the 8.25" and the 6.0 doesn't use the 8.6".

The GM designed 10.5" 14 bolt is atleast the strength of the Dana 70. The pinion support is awesome on those axles.

I gotta say the the AAM designed carriers aren't nearly as beefy looking a comparable Dana or 10.5" 14 bolt.

Doesn't GM still use Dana 60's in the Express vans? I'm looking at an '07 3500 with a 60 right now.

[05ChevySilveradoSS]

Originally Posted by Johnny P

I get that completely, but it's a good indicator.

My whole point is that there is a reason the Hemi doesn't use the 8.25" and the 6.0 doesn't use the 8.6".

The GM designed 10.5" 14 bolt is atleast the strength of the Dana 70. The pinion support is awesome on those axles.

I gotta say the the AAM designed carriers aren't nearly as beefy looking a comparable Dana or 10.5" 14 bolt.

Doesn't GM still use Dana 60's in the Express vans? I'm looking at an '07 3500 with a 60 right now.

Yes sir, they do. Im pretty sure!