RWD Lincolns planned if MKZ, brand re-launch successful - Page 2

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Thread: RWD Lincolns planned if MKZ, brand re-launch successful

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    Re: RWD Lincolns planned if MKZ, brand re-launch successful

    Lincoln's true competitors like Hyundai
    Please. Lincoln has serious American history. I'd never own one but bringing the name Hyundai into the same sentence is just wrong. I don't think of a Buick as a Lincoln competitor either. Not if Lincoln gets back on proper track. Their new commercial is damn good. I care not what anyone says... That was excellent marketing. Now they need to get the product. Do I want Cadillac Motor Company (which is what it should be just like Chevrolet Motor Company) to steamroll Lincoln? Absolutely. Do not however underestimate Ford. They have a line of Ford 150's and Super Duty's that print money like no other to finance Lincoln.

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    Re: RWD Lincolns planned if MKZ, brand re-launch successful

    Quote Originally Posted by nruggiero View Post
    Is $1 Billion really enough to get Lincoln off to a good start? It really doesn't seem like it.

    It is NOT!! That is a paultry sum in the auto business, especially the Luxury end of the business.

    It seems like more money is going towards marketing than vehicles.
    Bingo!
    Last edited by megeebee; 12-05-2012 at 04:35 PM.

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    Re: RWD Lincolns planned if MKZ, brand re-launch successful

    Quotes from the article (emphasis added):

    The first test will come with the imminent launch of the new MKZ sedan. Three other models will follow by 2014, including a remake of the bigger MKS sedan and the Navigator full-size SUV. A compact crossover is also in the works based on the latest Ford Escape platform.
    Insiders declined to discuss Lincoln’s future products in much depth, though TheDetroitBureau.com has learned that the focus will be more on entry and mid-level offerings that could include additional crossovers.

    Flagship sedans and sports cars have become less of a factor,” said new global Lincoln director Matt VanDyke during this month’s background session.
    Flagships and sports cars may be less of a factor with regard to a luxury maker's bottom line these days, but I think they are as important as ever with regard to image--especially if one is trying to rebuild said image. In my opinion trying to build-up a damaged luxury brand's image by starting with lower models has less potential to change people's perceptions than starting at the top and working things down.

    It seems to me that luxury flagship and sports car buyers rarely want to emulate their less affluent counterparts but for up-and-comers, the opposite is a part of climbing the ladder of success (i.e., entry-level buyers typically don't mind if their vehicle reminds you of the top model, but top-model buyers do mind if their vehicle reminds you of an entry-level model.)


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    Re: RWD Lincolns planned if MKZ, brand re-launch successful

    Lincoln is being stupid by saying that future RWD Lincolns rest on the fate of the lame, boring & uninspiring 2nd gen MKZ. Lincoln should have switched to RWD/R-AWD(for the entire line up) toward the end of Ford's turn around.

    I am not at all impressed, so far, by Max Wolff's design direction for Lincoln.
    I say, if the 2nd gen MKZ flops, Mr.Wolff gets kicked out the door!!!

    !!!
    IF It's A Chevrolet & RWD, Don't ride in it!!!

    ALL Chevy's NEED to be FWD/F-AWD!!!

    If it's a Toyota/Lexus/Scion, Don't ride in/drive it!!


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    Re: RWD Lincolns planned if MKZ, brand re-launch successful

    Quote Originally Posted by LeSabre View Post
    I am not at all impressed, so far, by Max Wolff's design direction for Lincoln.
    I say, if the 2nd gen MKZ flops, Mr.Wolff gets kicked out the door!!!

    !!!
    We haven't seen a car designed by Max yet. The MKZ was already in the works before he arrived. He only tweaked the MKZ.

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    Re: RWD Lincolns planned if MKZ, brand re-launch successful

    WASTE OF TIME AND MONEY!!!!

    Ford would just be better off in Killing off Lincoln, No one at the Glass House is serious about long term name/brand reputation to do what is necessary to commit to a World class position.

    It is quite clear, Design EVERY car from the onset to best Mercedes Benz and BMW, not just compete.

    Ford is not willing to do this.. Save your money Ford and just call it quits.
    Jeesh - lighten up. Must every definition of luxury be Mercedes and BMW? Is there no room for luxurious FWD vehicles? I assume many in the luxury market don't care about tight handling and 0-60 times.

    Hey, by RWD, maybe Ford means that they'll bring back the Lincoln Blackwood

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    Re: RWD Lincolns planned if MKZ, brand re-launch successful

    Quote Originally Posted by FanOfDurant View Post
    Please. Lincoln has serious American history. I'd never own one but bringing the name Hyundai into the same sentence is just wrong.
    Lincoln has some historical cache, but it has always been played second fiddle to Cadillac's standard bearer dominance. People use Cadillac as metaphor for any product that is top-of-the line, e.g. calling something the Cadillac of it's respective market, or in the recent healthcare debate about "Cadillac plans" leading to over consumption. This afterthought status is further headwind for company that has very limited credentials with the RWD or luxury market; in the late 90s the Navigator was a **** hot commodity in a segment where image and cache were principle drivers for success. Then the Escalade came in and promptly relegated the Navigator to it's Lincoln-designated lot in life; as second-place "B-list" competitor. That is hard to overcome.

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    Re: RWD Lincolns planned if MKZ, brand re-launch successful

    Quote Originally Posted by Syclone478 View Post
    Quotes from the article (emphasis added):





    Flagships and sports cars may be less of a factor with regard to a luxury maker's bottom line these days, but I think they are as important as ever with regard to image--especially if one is trying to rebuild said image. In my opinion trying to build-up a damaged luxury brand's image by starting with lower models has less potential to change people's perceptions than starting at the top and working things down.

    It seems to me that luxury flagship and sports car buyers rarely want to emulate their less affluent counterparts but for up-and-comers, the opposite is a part of climbing the ladder of success (i.e., entry-level buyers typically don't mind if their vehicle reminds you of the top model, but top-model buyers do mind if their vehicle reminds you of an entry-level model.)
    I disagree with this. Basically, what you are saying is dump 10's of billions of dollars into a top flight flagship and sports car that noone will buy because the brand has not been built back up. So, Ford should lose billions upon billions for years upon years until this said low selling high priced flagship and sports car gain some traction??

    That is ridiculous.

    This is a slow process, and Ford knows this. This is why they have been doing all of the boring things first. Basically trying to get the dealership end lined up correctly. Now, they are giving Lincoln its own finance arm, design studio, and staff. They are building the foundation. This new MKZ, which is NOT badge engineering of any sort, will bring some excitement to the brand. Is it the enthusiasts kind of luxury................... no. Nor is it meant to be, at this point. It is a pretty neat car, however. Especially for those who are looking for a luxury brand that is not pretentious, and a car that will stand out in the luxury crowd. Give them a good car (much better than the Lexus ES), and a great experience, and people will buy. Will the car print money.................... NO. It is a start, however, and a foundation to bring more money into Lincoln.

    The brand does not lose money. I will say this again, Lincoln does not lose money. So, it is not a money pit on its last leg. This is why you build the foundation. This is why you start with the more volume products that the enthusiasts care little about (but luxury buyers love). As the brand starts to make a name for itself, you can be more daring. You keep bringing out the new product, building on the foundation that was started. At some point, the brand will be able to support a flagship, and a sports car.

    The ONLY thing a flagship and sports car do, is make the magazines happy, and the enthusiasts................... most of whom do not have the money to buy them anyway.

    As is always the case, in a Lincoln thread, immediate results are expected. Mulally isn't an idiot. He knows it takes time................. as it did with Ford. He knows you are never done.................... as Ford isn't either (and no brand is). I think many are reading way too much into what was reported (probably out of context, at that).

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    Re: RWD Lincolns planned if MKZ, brand re-launch successful

    The bigger questions is this Ford's elaborate, and well thought out plan to eventually shutter Lincoln after a half arsed effort to revise the brand? Does not this gradual phasing out from Mercury going away to huge investments in new dealer requirements to the attrition of dealers sound mysteriously like a grand scheme to close Lincoln down with little cost to Ford?

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    Re: RWD Lincolns planned if MKZ, brand re-launch successful

    Sometimes i think the execs of the Big 3 must have been blind, deaf or a combination of both! Ford have a perfect RWD platform and a team with years of experienced on building RWD cars on a budget just waiting to be utilised in Australia! And yet they decide that canning the Falcon platform and spending millions developing a new platform for the Mustang and their other RWD cars to sit on is a better idea, than simply honing an already flexible and brilliant platform?

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    Re: RWD Lincolns planned if MKZ, brand re-launch successful

    Versus what?? 10 completely new products on completely new platforms tomorrow??

    Geez, people need to put down the foil hats. What a great plan.................. Lets spend billions on people, studios, marketing, financing, product, etc.................... in this elaborate scheme to fool everyone into thinking we are doing something we aren't, to cause something that we can't be sure of in the first place.

    Slow news day, I guess.

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    Re: RWD Lincolns planned if MKZ, brand re-launch successful

    So what is Lincoln attempting to be, and what is its competition?
    Current:

    2014 Cadillac ATS4 3.6L Premium Collection

    2006 GMC Envoy SLT 4x4

    Past:

    2013 Cadillac ATS4 3.6L Premium Collection -> LEMON

    2011 Chevrolet Malibu LTZ V6

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    Re: RWD Lincolns planned if MKZ, brand re-launch successful

    Lincoln should directly target the Mercedes E-class and SL roadster, while expanding the brand into Europe. After they've lost $10 billion doing that, they can go back to making FWD cars for a while until they save up for another try.

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    Re: RWD Lincolns planned if MKZ, brand re-launch successful

    Quote Originally Posted by Envoy4Life View Post
    So what is Lincoln attempting to be, and what is its competition?
    This is the question that I continue to ask, and it seems not even Ford has a valid answer.

    What kind of convoluted message would suggest that there were no planned Lincoln RWD vehicles , and at the same time also suggest that if Lincoln's FWD vehicles do well that there will be RWD vehicles? I could have sworn brand building via press release, and years in advance of actual product was something that GM had a patent on.
    Last edited by germeezy1; 12-05-2012 at 07:51 PM.

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    Re: RWD Lincolns planned if MKZ, brand re-launch successful

    One billion dollars to re-launch an entire car line, including dealership upgrades, is nothing. Lincoln needs a grand slam right out of the box, otherwise, it's done.
    From what I've seen of the new MKZ, it's not even a triple.

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