More Skeletons in the Closet for "Friendly" Toyota

[AMERICA 123]

Originally Posted by tundrakiller

am gonna make a copy of this and have it sent all over.

Send the full report - all 65 pages.

Be aware this report only briefly covers two specific overseas operating areas and only mentions the USA.

There is much more to be found in certain specific overseas locations.

Our OEMs and their people are being defeated by labor exploitation pure and simple.

Labor at 2.87$ per hour for 75 hours a week is tough to beat.

Throw in the UNLEVEL PLAYING FIELD and all the rest - its amazing we even still have anything left.

Notice that all the propaganda we've been sold for 40 ****ing years explaining why Toyota and Japan INC. are successful is wrong because it left all this kind of stuff out and fails to account for its effects.

The State of California and the United States Federal Goverment have laws against overseas sweatshop product coming into their respective territories.

Same concerning production involved with human trafficking activity and labor.

The definitions have been met.

I don't know how any women in the world could possibly even consider a Toyota product much less buy one.

[marinerbc]

I agree, AMERICA 123, but I just don't think people for the most part care about the abuses suffered by the workers that make the products that they buy. If they did, Nike would have been out of business years ago.

Here in Upper Canuckistan, you cannot explain to anyone here that a Toyota worker in Cambridge makes far less than his fellow worker at Oshawa or Oakville; they simply will not listen because they do not wish to change their view of "how things are".

Toyota is the media darling, and nothing they do or say will change that image for many, many years. Sad, but true.

[MaxLegroom]

I'm not sure about Toyota Nation, but the Prius Chat forum I'm also a member of makes no mention of it. Wonder what would happen if I brought this up...

[marinerbc]

Originally Posted by MaxLegroom

I'm not sure about Toyota Nation, but the Prius Chat forum I'm also a member of makes no mention of it. Wonder what would happen if I brought this up...

[stormwatcher]

First thing I thought when I read the article is: "Is it true?" I've never heard of CNL before, so if everyone wants to believe the story just because it is on the internet, go ahead. I will remain skeptical because I don't know so can't trust the source.

Originally Posted by AMERICA 123

- Toyota is in fact, one of the worst at all this and definitely the worst in the industry.

You know AMERICA 123, you really are a windbag.

Originally Posted by AMERICA 123

Its the real basis of their last 16 years of success - and this plus a long run earlier of exploiting their supplier base are possibly most of the whole story.

Disliking Toyota is fine, but Toyota has among the highest satisfaction rating with suppliers, far higher then the Detroit 2.8.

Originally Posted by AMERICA 123

Toyota thru this exploitation is creating other unnecessary pain and suffering as well, particularly in the United States.

Toyota is hiring, investors are happy, and can't build cars fast enough to satisty demand. Yup, that's creating a lot of "unnecessary pain and suffering".

Your criticism of Toyota is so extreme that you lose all credibility AMERICA 123.

[AMERICA 123]

Aren't you up past your bedtime ?

[stormwatcher]

Originally Posted by marinerbc

Here in Upper Canuckistan, you cannot explain to anyone here that a Toyota worker in Cambridge makes far less than his fellow worker at Oshawa or Oakville; they simply will not listen because they do not wish to change their view of "how things are".

What are you trying to explain? If you listened to most Canadians, they would likely say CAW workers are overpaid.

Originally Posted by marinerbc

Toyota is the media darling, and nothing they do or say will change that image for many, many years. Sad, but true.

The general public are not fools. If a company is treated as a "darling", it is almost always because they have worked hard to earn themselves a good reputation. If Toyota screws up and treats the car buying public poorly, consumers won't quickly forget. But it is immature to constantly blame everyone else for the failures of Detroit automakers.

[stormwatcher]

The National Labor Committee is a socialist organization and union labor front group that is 100% hostile to American companies.

If you believe the NLC, nearly every bad thing that happens to a worker anywhere in the world is almost always the fault of the American government, American companies or Americans themselves.

[marinerbc]

Originally Posted by stormwatcher

What are you trying to explain? If you listened to most Canadians, they would likely say CAW workers are overpaid.

I DO listen to "most Canadians"; especially relatives that work in Cambridge and Oshawa. They don't likely say any such thing.

Originally Posted by stormwatcher

The general public are not fools. If a company is treated as a "darling", it is almost always because they have worked hard to earn themselves a good reputation. If Toyota screws up and treats the car buying public poorly, consumers won't quickly forget. But it is immature to constantly blame everyone else for the failures of Detroit automakers.

I don't think you know much about Canadian media, all due respect.

What model Toyota do you own, by the way? I was looking at Corollas the other day, funny looking but the blue one was a nice hue.

[AMERICA 123]

Originally Posted by stormwatcher

The National Labor Committee is a socialist organization and union labor front group that is 100% hostile to American companies.

HEY, wait a minute, wait just a cotton pickin' minute.

You are badly informed.

Lets measure that by using an organization that is maintaining a death watch on GM and Ford and overall certainly can be characterized as at least friendly to Toyota.

That would be none other than " The Truth About Cars" which actually took the time to call them and although you can tell that its killing'em to report on it, noted that they receive less than 15% of their monies from all union sources combined.

Here is their lead in to their podcast on it - you can also listen to his phone call to the author of the report.

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/nat...er-sweatshops/


National Labor Committee Alleges Toyota Supplier Sweatshops
By Robert Farago
June 20, 2008 -

First of all, the National Labor Committee says that less than 15 percent of its money comes from labor unions.

So this is not a United Auto Workers' front organization.

Second, in a phone call [below] Director Charles Kernaghan was clear that Toyota's Japanese factories adhere to the country's labor laws (even though you may be surprised to learn that ToMoCo's been on a two-tier wage system for decades).

Kernaghan's beef is with the automaker's suppliers.

"Toyota's much admired 'Just in Time' auto parts supply chain is riddled with sweatshop abuse," he insists.

"Including the trafficking of foreign guest workers, mostly from China and Vietnam to Japan.

They're stripped of their passports and often forced to work– including at subcontract plants supplying Toyota– 16 hours a day, seven days a week, while being paid less than half the legal minimum wage.

Guest workers who complain about abusive conditions are deported."

The organization's report is low on stats, big on anecdotes and focused on pious Prius celebs.<BS>

And yet, it's a point we've brought up before.

International automakers'– and their customers'– willingness to turn a blind eye to their suppliers' working conditions is a black eye for the business– albeit one cleverly covered by makeup.

They (NLC) are not hostile to American firms - Toyota is not an American firm as an example.

Further more, they only are concerned with one thing - improving sweatshop labor conditions - regardless of who, what, where, and why.

Is that something you personally support or disagree with ????

Here are three links from the other end - of audio conversations with the author.

You can listen to the conversation between TTAC and NLC from either end - to confirm the accuracy of both.


Press Coverage

*
Toyota and the Auto Industry's Race to the Bottom on Grit TV with Laura Flanders

*
NLC Director Charles Kernaghan on "Building Bridges," WBAI-New York (Audio)

*
NLC Director Charles Kernaghan on theTruthAboutCars.com (Audio)

[Stéphane Dumas]

How long before we discover then Honda (lots of radio ads here said they're the "more greener"), also have some skeletons in the closet as well?

[AMERICA 123]

Originally Posted by stormwatcher

First thing I thought when I read the article is: "Is it true?" I've never heard of CNL

Nice try.

It's NLC not CNL.

Stands for the National Labor Committee.

- before, so if everyone wants to believe the story just because it is on the internet, go ahead. I will remain skeptical because I don't know so can't trust the source.

They are somewhat 'known' and their previous work was found to be 100% on the money.

If anything, they don't go far enough - or all the way in.

As far as not trusting the source - go ahead , check them, and their previous work out.

I did, before I joined this thread.

Disliking Toyota is fine, but Toyota has among the highest satisfaction rating with suppliers, far higher then the Detroit 2.8.

Once again, you don't seem to display that you have even read the posts you respond to.

Toyota in an earlier period as previously noted made an artform out of abusing their suppler base in Japan - especially after Honda got going and the first energy crisis .

The earlier period I'm referring to here predates the era of human trafficking or foreign worker in Japan under sweatshop employment ie pre '92 ish back to approx. '72/'76.

Toyota is hiring, investors are happy, and can't build cars fast enough to satisty demand. Yup, that's creating a lot of "unnecessary pain and suffering".

Well, workers are dying early and being injured and then fired or let go because of that - did you ask them ????

Let me make that a little clearer - you mucked up the obvious yet again.

Toyota would not be enjoying the same kind of success here w/o these labor practices and cost advantages they provide.

From that, some unspecified amount of American Domestic Mfg. automotive labor losses would not be occurring - if they didn't have to try and compete with 2.67 - 3.32$ per hour, with 75 hour work weeks and basically a terrorized into submission group of foreign workers.

These losses would also not be occurring in another way - as in regards to Toyota and anyone else - why the hell would any of them, including Toyota, use an American worker when they can have this kind of labor in Japan ?

And in case you missed it, why would Toyota use a Japanese worker in Japan if they can do it this way?

You did notice at least that part, right ?

Toyota's worst labor practices are reserved for foreign nationals - whether they work in Japan or somewhere else.

So this part of what they do hurts the Japanese labor force as well - which is also in the report - you'd now that if you'd read it - part of that is on page one at the top.

That's not all of it - did you even attempt to read the report ?

[Uzzy]

Originally Posted by marinerbc

I DO listen to "most Canadians"; especially relatives that work in Cambridge and Oshawa. They don't likely say any such thing.

I'm Canadian and I do say that, and most people that I know that are not CAW members agree. Even some CAW members know they are over paid, but they don't mind.

[AMERICA 123]

Originally Posted by Stéphane Dumas

How long before we discover then Honda (lots of radio ads here said they're the "more greener"), also have some skeletons in the closet as well?

There is possibly a hint of that in terms of a contract or temporary Japanese national working in Japan - towards both Honda and Nissan.

In the report, reference is made to how Japanese nationals are recruited from the 'countryside' and also how they are abused in a lesser way.

Anyway, an agency ( that also figures large in the abuse itself) supplied a subcontractor that was dividing output as follows; 80% Toyota, 20% Honda and Nissan.

Not much to go - so far.

Subcontract Workers Also Cheated

To cut costs, auto parts plants all across Aichi prefecture are turning to subcontract workers, who often make up a third of the workforce and earn less than half of what full time workers do.

Employment agencies across Japan recruit subcontract workers to relocate to Aichi Prefecture to work in auto parts plants supplying Toyota and other auto companies.

One such agency, based in Okinowa, called K.K.K. Sanua Staff, told new recruits they would receive a signing bonus of 300,000 Yen ($2,970), would work from 8:30 a.m. to 5:00 p.m., and earn a base wage of $2,970 a month.

It was all a lie.

Once they relocated to the parts factory in Aichi, they were given less than 20 percent of the bonus guaranteed to them, and their wages were one third lower than they agreed to; workers earned just $1,197 a month and not the $2,970 base wage they were supposed to make.

Under these conditions, the subcontract workers would earn just $14,365 a year.

Eighty percent of the factories’ production went to Toyota, with the other 20 percent split between Nissan and Honda.

Of the total of slightly more than 300 workers, 100, or one third were hired as subcontract workers.

The subcontract workers were not only paid less, they were also assigned the most dangerous jobs.

One of the subcontract workers we spoke with handled strong and potentially toxic adhesives while making brake cables.

He used a glue – any contact of which would peel off his skin – to secure the plastic top to the brake cable.

The Subcontract workers were also cheated and forced to pay exorbitant rents for company housing.

Management charged $400 to $640 a month for a tiny apartment, which in the market would cost much less.

[stormwatcher]

Originally Posted by AMERICA 123

HEY, wait a minute, wait just a cotton pickin' minute.

. . . they receive less than 15% of their monies from all union sources combined.

So they say. Where does the other 85% come from? Union members?

Originally Posted by AMERICA 123

They (NLC) are not hostile to American firms - Toyota is not an American firm as an example.

LOL.

ATT, Bershire Hathaway, Costco, Goodyear, Home Depot, Levis, Mattel, etc.
That's only a small sample of American companies the NLC is critical of.