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#1 (permalink) |
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GMI Staff Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: NJ
Posts: 5,633
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Mechanic’s Tale: VW, Heal Thyself!
Source: http://www.thecarconnection.com/Enth...281.A9081.html
Mechanic’s Tale: VW, Heal Thyself; Volkswagen needs to be the people's car, not the mechanic's friend. by Douglas Flint (2005-08-15) What's in a name? Sometimes nothing. I couldn't tell you what Buick means. Perhaps the founder was named Stanley Buick. Saturn was probably chosen as a name because the 750 million miles or so between the planets Saturn and Earth represented the distance necessary to escape the lethal radiation of General Motors Corporate Headquarters. (They didn't make it.) But there is no doubt what Volkswagen means and set out to be: "the people's car," a simple utilitarian car for the masses, affordable and easy to maintain. Now I don't believe Volkswagen can ever return to the simple air-cooled Beetle, which predates World War II. But they had better do something because the reputation of their cars is becoming toxic. Europeans have always had a fundamental problem with the understanding of electricity and electrical things. Perhaps because old Ben Franklin discovered it and Thomas Edison figured out what to do with it, they outright rejected it as a nouveau riche affectation from the new world. When the world jumped from electrical to electronic, the German manufacturer's problems became even worse. The first thing I noticed is the AM radio function in most Volkswagens never works. This is a dangerous warning sign as the AM radio is almost as old as the telegraph, and every American male growing up in the past century learned how to build one using a coat hanger and a copper penny as a tuner, yet this is somehow beyond the reach of Germany's finest minds. And if you can't master the AM radio thing, what will happen with modern computer controls? Open source programming? If you know anything about auto maintenance, you know we mechanics often have to connect diagnostic scan tools to the cars to retrieve information necessary for repairs. Since 1996, all cars have the same standardized connectors and all manufacturers provide data in the same format. Very simple, very good, nothing to go wrong or mess up - except Volkswagen! Any time you connect to or begin testing a Volkswagen you can easily and quite accidentally change the delicate, carefully calculated operating parameters of the car. The computer is wide open. There is no other manufacturer's car where you could do this if you wanted to. This is not a good thing. A fellow called me some weeks ago crying how he had taken his car back to the dealer for routine service, and his transmission shifting - which had been beautifully timed and crisp - was now whacked out and no one could get it right. I know what happened. Someone scanning the computer changed something. Look, I love the people in this business, but this is above our pay grade. We're not software engineers. We are guys who turn nuts and bolts and learned some electronics because we had to. Yesterday I was working on a Jetta with an intermittent no start. I had some pretty good ideas about what might be wrong but I was bugged out because I could get no data when I connected my scanner. I called my tech hotline, an excellent service called Identifix, and spoke to a VW tech. When I mentioned the problem with no scan data he asked, "Does the car have an aftermarket radio?" (non-factory equipment). Sure enough it did. He told me the computer system interfaces with the radio and often you can't get data if the radio has been changed. Once again, that's just crazy and completely unnecessary. I assure you that Chrysler, Ford, General Motors, Toyota , Honda, Mazda, Nissan, even Hyundai and Kia vehicles come in the shop with hacked-in radios, and the computer diagnostics still work. And since we know from paragraph two that VW radios don't work all that well, it's an invitation to disaster. When doing electrical repairs on these cars you can never get good, accurate, simple diagrams. I used to think this was because they didn't want non-VW people having them, but after finally getting a good look at some factory information I have concluded that they don't provide diagrams because no one actually knows where the electricity goes once it leaves the battery. The metallic clang I had occasion to work on a 2001 VW Passat with the turbo four-cylinder engine. With less than 65,000 miles on it, the engine had developed a nasty metallic noise that comes from the timing chain on the back of the engine. As we began to disassemble and inspect it, it became apparent that there was a tremendous amount of wasted motion and unnecessary complexity in this engine. In spite of the fact that this car was well maintained (synthetic oil changes every 3000 miles), it had developed sludging in the oil pickup, which starved the timing chain tensioner. Two thousand dollars and some change later it seems to be okay. I won't sleep well for another year. Once again, as I worked through this I called my tech service and discovered that this was common. The tech even laughed and told me how amusing it was when the engine, starved for oil, was accelerated - say, to pass another car - it often locked the camshafts, resulting in pieces flying everywhere. Yeah, real funny for the middle-class person who shelled out $28,000 for a fine driving machine. As I understand it, the old "secret warranty" is in effect, and if you say the magic words, cry, or know a good attorney, you might get warranty help. A true Volkswagen story My buddy Joe gets a lot of VWs in the upper-class neighborhood his shop is in. In the year 2000, a customer came in to show him the great deal she got on a leftover (brand-new) '99 VW Passat. I guess he couldn't hide the look of disappointment on his face because she said, "What's wrong, you don't like it?" To date, Joe can verify $12,000 in repairs and maintenance to that same vehicle, and there are sure to be some dealer bills he hasn't seen. At 20,000 miles it required complete four-wheel brake replacement. At 40,000 miles the water pump impeller broke, causing an overheat. (Before hearing the story I would have said that water pump impellers never break.) The power windows failed one by one all the way around. The heater core leaked. These are just the highlights. Sooner or later the customer will meet a Toyota owner and discover this is not normal. You can only count on those old Sixties kids buying VWs for so much longer. Repent, ye I have more people say to me that they will never buy a Volkswagen again and never go to the dealer for service than any other model. The problem is that bad cars breed a callously indifferent service department that loses all sympathy for the customer because they themselves are under such pressure. VW is not a basket case. They have many redeeming features. They have great road feel, great turning and brakes, and when running well are pretty fun to drive. And my wife said to be sure to add that they look good, too. The upper middle class likes them because it's entry-level European for the kids who wouldn't want to be caught dead driving a Ford Focus to high school. Volkswagen, hire some Japanese teenagers to do all your electrical systems. Review and simplify all your components and procedures. I figure you can eliminate at least 150 moving parts in your engine alone. If it takes more than one paragraph in the manual to check the auto trans fluid (currently 14 pages and climbing), you're doing something wrong. Make your radios easy to remove and throw away. That's what people are going to do with them anyway. Stop squeezing your supplier so hard they have to make your water pumps from metal that could have been recycled beer cans and your ignition coils from copper wire that could have been stolen from the Mexican telephone system. And when you have a problem, look at how Toyota handled the head gasket failures on its V-6 truck engines in the early Nineties. They issued a recall, made complete repairs and offered compensation to people who had already paid for repairs for up to ten years or 100,000 miles. No secret warranties, magic words, or threats. It's a long climb back, but this might be a good time to stop digging the hole. Doug Flint owns and operates Tune-Up Technology, a garage in Alexandria, Va.
__________________
Email: nadepalma@gminsidenews.com "La vita è come un albero di Natale..c'è sempre qualcuno che ti rompe le palle!" "You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could and should do for themselves" -Abraham Lincoln "Democracy is the worst form of government except for all those others that have been tried" -Winston Churchill "In my many years I have come to a conclusion that one useless man is a shame, two is a law firm, and three or more is a Congress" -John Adams |
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#2 (permalink) |
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GMI Fixed Ops Contributor
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 8,928
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Re: Mechanic’s Tale: VW, Heal Thyself!
Stanley Buick? It was David Buick, the founder of Buick, he was of Scottish heritage.
__________________
certified GM Dealer Parts Manager since 1994 GM Dealer Parts employee since 1987 AMC-Jeep-Renault Dealer Parts employee 1987-90 holder of many GM accredations, too numerous to list and not giving a damn! |
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#3 (permalink) |
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GMI Staff Member
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Chicago, IL.
Posts: 3,255
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Re: Mechanic’s Tale: VW, Heal Thyself!
Good read. I knew VW had problems, but holy smoke!
What is worse is that this is going on in an era where total quality is the industry mantra. At least the General's major screwups (350 diesel anyone?, 4/6/8 Caddy?) happened before this era.Funny how he talks about VW's history. For those of you who believe in karma, this could be bad karma from VW's origin. VW was to be the 'people's car' and the Beetle was first made during the third reich. Hitler convinced the German public to pre pay for the cars, but the money wound up being used to build Panzers. And no, people who prepaid did not get a Panzer instead of a Beetle. ![]() |
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#4 (permalink) | |
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GMI Staff Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: NJ
Posts: 5,633
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Re: Mechanic’s Tale: VW, Heal Thyself!
Quote:
Now if I were an American car manufacturer, I'd find this incedibly deflating since they've got quality/reliability gains in the past 5 or 10 years that would blow VW out of the water, yet they are shunned by the 'uplevel' consumer who'd prefer that VW over a Chevy or Pontiac. Really sad. That's why I hope that the work GM is doing now will eventually pay off for them (as well as for Ford and Chrysler since I don't want them to fail either). GM keeps making advances in areas where they have lagged and it seems that the next 3 years or more will bring out some really great products. We've already started to see some of them come out, but they need to keep the pressure on and get things to market faster. But again, it's gonna take time for them to convince folks to give up their imports to come back to the American fold. This is really a problem since I know folks who own foreign cars that won't even look at an American car, no matter what. They had a bad experience in 1988 and still think that American cars are put togther with chicken-wire and duct-tape. That last point is what is going to keep GM execs up at night...I hope Mark LaNeve is up for the challenge.
__________________
Email: nadepalma@gminsidenews.com "La vita è come un albero di Natale..c'è sempre qualcuno che ti rompe le palle!" "You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could and should do for themselves" -Abraham Lincoln "Democracy is the worst form of government except for all those others that have been tried" -Winston Churchill "In my many years I have come to a conclusion that one useless man is a shame, two is a law firm, and three or more is a Congress" -John Adams |
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#5 (permalink) |
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6.0 Liter Vortec V8
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Pembroke, Ontario
Drives: 1998 Ford Escort SE 5-spd Sedan
Posts: 1,558
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Re: Mechanic’s Tale: VW, Heal Thyself!
I've heard of VW's quality issues but this is a real eye-opener. No wonder my local VW dealer always looks so empty...of people...not cars waiting to be sold!
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#6 (permalink) |
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7.0 Liter LS7 V8
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: In hell
Drives: 98 Toyota Avalon
05 Chevrolet Silverado
06 BMW 3
Posts: 6,073
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Re: Mechanic’s Tale: VW, Heal Thyself!
The local used car lots have tons of Beatles, and Jettas. Now what does that tell you?
__________________
![]() Thanks to FordRules for that signature! Is Pluto a planet? 1991 Toyota Cressida 1969 Cadillac Fleetwood (needs to be restored) 1998 Toyota Avalon 2005 Chevy Silverado 2006 BMW 330i Possibility: 2007 Camry Toyota does NOT give MPG figures, the EPA does! |
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#7 (permalink) |
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3.6 Liter V6
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Canada
Drives: 2006 Pontiac G5 GT.
Posts: 1,097
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Re: Mechanic’s Tale: VW, Heal Thyself!
Volkswagen built better vehicles 15 years ago. There are tons of older Passat's and Jetta's still floating around (all diesel). We don't even work on Volkswagens in the shop, we send them to the dealer. Any company that makes changing a headlight a half-hour procedure (New Beetle) is bound to be in dire trouble soon.
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#8 (permalink) | |
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GMI Fixed Ops Contributor
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 8,928
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Re: Mechanic’s Tale: VW, Heal Thyself!
Quote:
Which Beatle? Paul or Ringo?
__________________
certified GM Dealer Parts Manager since 1994 GM Dealer Parts employee since 1987 AMC-Jeep-Renault Dealer Parts employee 1987-90 holder of many GM accredations, too numerous to list and not giving a damn! |
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#9 (permalink) | |
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7.0 Liter LS7 V8
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: In hell
Drives: 98 Toyota Avalon
05 Chevrolet Silverado
06 BMW 3
Posts: 6,073
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Re: Mechanic’s Tale: VW, Heal Thyself!
Quote:
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__________________
![]() Thanks to FordRules for that signature! Is Pluto a planet? 1991 Toyota Cressida 1969 Cadillac Fleetwood (needs to be restored) 1998 Toyota Avalon 2005 Chevy Silverado 2006 BMW 330i Possibility: 2007 Camry Toyota does NOT give MPG figures, the EPA does! |
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#10 (permalink) |
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6.0 Liter Vortec V8
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: MO & FL
Posts: 1,932
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Re: Mechanic’s Tale: VW, Heal Thyself!
I never understood how people thought that VW is an upscale car. They came out with a 1999 Passat and Jetta and BANG they are in the same class as BMW and Mercedes. Most of those new VW owners were so proud and showing off how they suddenly joined the "upper echelon" of society by buying a car from a company that three years prior was considered a joke.
After the buzz wore off (around 2002), you can buy Passats and Jettas all day for about $10k less than they were charging at first. The Passat is a very nice car indeed, but the Jetta, come on, the Focus is a much better value. |
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#11 (permalink) | |
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6.0 Liter LS2 V8
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 4,162
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Re: Mechanic’s Tale: VW, Heal Thyself!
Quote:
I think there are a couple factors: - It's German. Anything foreign is inherently better. (And I naively wondered why economics professors assume that as people get richer, they consume more imported things... seems they were right) Of course, most VWs are actually made in Mexico, but who reads that kind of fine print? - Glowing reviews. Read the comparos: the Passat was THE midsized car to beat, despite the... uhm... uncompetitive price. Same with the Jetta. - The New Beetle factor. That thing probably dragged people into dealers who left with something else. The poor reliability is not a surprise to anyone who reads JD Power results, yet I would be guess that if you stood in front of a VW dealer and asked people going in if GMs or VWs were more reliable, they'd all firmly assert VW. |
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#12 (permalink) |
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7.0 Liter LS7 V8
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Montréal, Québec
Posts: 8,703
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Re: Mechanic’s Tale: VW, Heal Thyself!
German? Almost all the VW's sold in North America hail from Mexico (Jettas, New Beetles, older Golfs) or Brazil (Fox, newer Golfs)
My experiences with VW have been very poor.
__________________
What will destroy our country and us is not the financial crisis but the fact that liberals think the free market is some kind of sect or cult...That’s not what the free market is. The free market is just a measurement, a device to tell us what people are willing to pay for any given thing at any given moment. The free market is a bathroom scale. You may hate what you see when you step on the scale. ‘Jeeze, 230 pounds!’ But you can’t pass a law making yourself weigh 185. |
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#13 (permalink) | |
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6.0 Liter LS2 V8
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 4,162
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Re: Mechanic’s Tale: VW, Heal Thyself!
Quote:
Ask most people driving Impalas, and I'd guess they'd tell you their car was made in the U.S. (It's not) Ask most people driving a MB ML, and they'd tell you their SUV is built in Germany. (It's not) Ask most people driving a Chrysler 300C, and they'll claim their car was built in the U.S. (It's not.) Same thing with VWs. |
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#14 (permalink) |
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7.0 Liter LS7 V8
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Montréal, Québec
Posts: 8,703
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Re: Mechanic’s Tale: VW, Heal Thyself!
German? Almost all the VW's sold in North America hail from Mexico (Jettas, New Beetles, older Golfs) or Brazil (Fox, newer Golfs)
My experiences with VW have been very poor.
__________________
What will destroy our country and us is not the financial crisis but the fact that liberals think the free market is some kind of sect or cult...That’s not what the free market is. The free market is just a measurement, a device to tell us what people are willing to pay for any given thing at any given moment. The free market is a bathroom scale. You may hate what you see when you step on the scale. ‘Jeeze, 230 pounds!’ But you can’t pass a law making yourself weigh 185. |
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#15 (permalink) |
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3.6 Liter V6
Join Date: Dec 2004
Drives: Bicycle
Posts: 1,096
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Re: Mechanic’s Tale: VW, Heal Thyself!
I constantly see New Beetles and Jettas with burnt out taillamps or headlights, and I knew for a long time how terrible the electrical systems are in them. The Jetta 1.8T I drove sure was fun, but honestly I'd get a Hyundai before I got a VW.
__________________
"I cannot wait for the new fad to come along, one that doesn't involve making respectable looking cars look as though they were parked nearby when the plastic factory exploded." |
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