Acura comes roaring back with NSX supercar

[BlackGTP]

Paul A. Eisenstein , The Detroit Bureau – 19 hrs.

Acura comes roaring back with NSX supercar

Acura still has some serious challenges to overcome, but it appears to be making inroads after what some have dubbed a lost decade.

These days, it’s common for automakers to display “concept cars” on the auto show circuit that are thinly disguised versions of upcoming production models – like the MDX Acura introduced at the Detroit Auto Show last month.

But the show car that drew the real crowds was a model that won’t hit the street for at least two years, the reincarnation of Acura’s once formidable NSX supercar.

The Japanese maker is desperately hoping that the re-born NSX will grab the high-line brand some much-needed attention and bring curious new shoppers into Acura showrooms even before it reaches production.

When it was launched more than a quarter-century ago, Acura transformed the way Americans thought about Japanese cars, proving that the Asians could challenge the well-established European and domestic luxury brands. But the initial success of the Honda Motor Co. subsidiary proved far too fleeting and in recent years, Acura has lagged in the back of the premium pack.

“It was a brave experiment when it was first launched,” says automotive analyst George Peterson, of AutoPacific, Inc. And now, he adds, there are signs Acura “has hit bottom and is on the upswing.”


Article continues at link: http://www.nbcnews.com/business/acur...rcar-1C8496355

[JudgeNjury]

Was it the Nissan GTR that so out performed the newest Acura NSX that its been delayed for soooo long..

Roaring back? Its like the sloow train to boring ville ...

When will this pretty mid engine daily driver ever arrive?

I feel bad for honda....they need to catch a break...Acura NSX hopefully will be a winner.

Should compete with the Audi R8 to some degree and offer a reliablity and a maintaince cost that is more inline with honda's civic and accord lineup.

Thanks for the link..

[BlackGTP]

I think the title of the article is very optimistic, almost like Honda gave them the title. I'd hardly call Acura's current status as "roaring back". Nor do I think the NSX will do much to spur sales as it is in such a different class than Acura's normal product I don't think there will be much cross shopping (unless the NSX is priced at $50k). And was the original NSX that great of a halo car in the first place? I don't recall the sales volume ever being high. Maybe just good marketing as all the car mags worshipped the car.

Also, it seems like Honda is still confused by Acura. Didn't we read a few months ago how they were repositioining the brand to be entry level/near luxury (leaving us all confused because that's what we all thought Acura already was)? Yet in the article Acura is comparing themselves to the Germans, etc which are well out of professed near-luxury segment. Sounds like confusion still reigns at Acura.

At least they've toned down the beak.

At the following link there is a current discussion regarding Cadillac's alphabet soup names: New Cadillac Lineup with Actual NAMES!! I think a takeaway from Acura alpha names and the Germans is to at least have them make sense. The Germans follow easy, in order numbers/letters - smallest to largest (3 Series =smallest, 7 Series =largest, C Class=smallest, S Class = largest). Acrua is all over the place RL is the largest, but TL comes after it alphabetically which makes it a lot harder to remember how the names work. So ATS, CTS, STX, XTS follow that naming convention, but if Caddy makes an S Class competitor they have an issue with their naming convention as the XTS is already at the end of the alphabet, so they only have YTS or ZTS to use....

[CrunkedRL]

Roaring? In looking at, test driving, and sitting in some of Acura's more recent entries I think a meowing comeback would be a more appropriate way to sum up their lineup. A halo car can only do so much for a brand.

[63GrandSport001]

What do you guys expect from the mainstream media, you go to them not because you want to put your car through a hard review. It is more of an infomercial for you product, it also allows people to see the car who wouldn't normally and gives them a chance to explain to people what an NSX is (even if you are embellishing things a bit).

As to BlackGTP the point of a halo car isn't to have high sales volume, in fact if it had high sales volume it wouldn't be much of a halo car.

Here is what the NSX is to me....

It is a car in which no more weight then is needed, it is a car that is about the driving experience and being engaging. I feel that with this new NSX being AWD and a hybrid (if that is still the plan) that it doesn't fit the NSX name. When the NSX came out it was priced at $60,000 and was very competitive, it packed something like 270BHP which while short of cars like the Dodge Viper and ZR1 Corvette was still competitive partly due to its low weight. However later on in the NSX life it simply was not competitive as it packed a $90,000 price tag and made 290BHP when for $50,000 you could get a 405BHP C5 Z06 which could run circles around the NSX. I know that some NSX fans (probably some on this site too) would never be willing to admit to this. I was looking at fast lap times in order to bring in actual lap times and for the NSX at willow springs it ran a 1:32.59. A fully optioned C6 Z06 ran a 1:20.43, 1LE Camaro 1:22.70, Grand Sport Corvette 1:27.29, Scion FRS 1:31.15.

[MCGARRETT]

What a BS waste of time article, has there even been a close to production version of this thing shown? Acura has shown the same concept car for like the last 3 years, if it were GM it would be blasted for that crap, but its Honda, so thats OK, perhaps when and IF it makes its debut in another 5 years in can live up to the other overhyped Japaneses car, the LFA.

[BlackGTP]

What do you guys expect from the mainstream media, you go to them not because you want to put your car through a hard review. It is more of an infomercial for you product, it also allows people to see the car who wouldn't normally and gives them a chance to explain to people what an NSX is (even if you are embellishing things a bit).

As to BlackGTP the point of a halo car isn't to have high sales volume, in fact if it had high sales volume it wouldn't be much of a halo car.

Here is what the NSX is to me....

It is a car in which no more weight then is needed, it is a car that is about the driving experience and being engaging. I feel that with this new NSX being AWD and a hybrid (if that is still the plan) that it doesn't fit the NSX name. When the NSX came out it was priced at $60,000 and was very competitive, it packed something like 270BHP which while short of cars like the Dodge Viper and ZR1 Corvette was still competitive partly due to its low weight. However later on in the NSX life it simply was not competitive as it packed a $90,000 price tag and made 290BHP when for $50,000 you could get a 405BHP C5 Z06 which could run circles around the NSX. I know that some NSX fans (probably some on this site too) would never be willing to admit to this. I was looking at fast lap times in order to bring in actual lap times and for the NSX at willow springs it ran a 1:32.59. A fully optioned C6 Z06 ran a 1:20.43, 1LE Camaro 1:22.70, Grand Sport Corvette 1:27.29, Scion FRS 1:31.15.

I think my point was a little unclear, hence your comment. Low sales volume (even of a halo product) indicates it wasn't bringing in much showroom traffic because it wasn't as desirable as the media made it out to be. Plus, I'd expect that not all Acura dealerships had one sitting in their showroom to draw "crowds". I guess at the same time I'm questioning the usefullness of a halo vehicle when the balance of your lineup isn't that strong or related to the halo product. A high end sports car for Mercedes may work because the buyer of an S Class may want to pick up something sporty, the S Class buyer probably has the disposable funds to buy a very expensive toy. A Corvette somewhat works for Chevy as its base price (~$50k) is attainable and many of Chevy's higher end product touches that pricepoint. The NSX was twice the price of any of Acura's cars, so it was above and beyond the means of most Acura patrons. I suspect by the exotic looks of the new NSX it will keep the same unobtainium pricing for the average Acura customer (just a guess, could very well be wrong).

Similar question for a Dodge Viper (when it was a Dodge). Doesn't the Viper start at $80K? No other Dodge comes even close to the Viper, so whoever buys a Viper probably isn't going to buy a regular Dodge. And I doubt and buyer of a regular Dodge is driving around thinking their car looks like a Viper. I think a halo car needs to be attainable for at least the top end of your customer base (hence the Vette working as a halo for Chevy).

[63GrandSport001]

I think my point was a little unclear, hence your comment. Low sales volume (even of a halo product) indicates it wasn't bringing in much showroom traffic because it wasn't as desirable as the media made it out to be. Plus, I'd expect that not all Acura dealerships had one sitting in their showroom to draw "crowds". I guess at the same time I'm questioning the usefullness of a halo vehicle when the balance of your lineup isn't that strong or related to the halo product. A high end sports car for Mercedes may work because the buyer of an S Class may want to pick up something sporty, the S Class buyer probably has the disposable funds to buy a very expensive toy. A Corvette somewhat works for Chevy as its base price (~$50k) is attainable and many of Chevy's higher end product touches that pricepoint. The NSX was twice the price of any of Acura's cars, so it was above and beyond the means of most Acura patrons. I suspect by the exotic looks of the new NSX it will keep the same unobtainium pricing for the average Acura customer (just a guess, could very well be wrong).

Similar question for a Dodge Viper (when it was a Dodge). Doesn't the Viper start at $80K? No other Dodge comes even close to the Viper, so whoever buys a Viper probably isn't going to buy a regular Dodge. And I doubt and buyer of a regular Dodge is driving around thinking their car looks like a Viper. I think a halo car needs to be attainable for at least the top end of your customer base (hence the Vette working as a halo for Chevy).

What do you think is the sales volume suppose to be for a halo car that was $90,000?, how do you know that it wasn't bringing in sales traffic. People could go in to see the NSX then purchase other products, so unless you have actual data to support your claim it is nothing more then your opinion. The ZR1 Corvette also had low sales volume............ so going by your logic it wasn't that good of a halo car and didn't bring in much traffic (lets ignore the fact that a $125,000 car is going to by definition have low sales volume combine that with being small and with only 2 seats).

Also I do not believe that these cars really bring in much sales traffic into dealers resulting in more vehicles sales. No one is going to walk into a dealer to see a Corvette then buy a minivan it simply does not work that way. It raises the brand image and for that all it has to do is exist. It can attract younger generations to your brand who are not yet at the age to buy a car but will be in the future.

[BlackGTP]

What do you think is the sales volume suppose to be for a halo car that was $90,000?, how do you know that it wasn't bringing in sales traffic. People could go in to see the NSX then purchase other products, so unless you have actual data to support your claim it is nothing more then your opinion. The ZR1 Corvette also had low sales volume............ so going by your logic it wasn't that good of a halo car and didn't bring in much traffic (lets ignore the fact that a $125,000 car is going to by definition have low sales volume combine that with being small and with only 2 seats).

Also I do not believe that these cars really bring in much sales traffic into dealers resulting in more vehicles sales. No one is going to walk into a dealer to see a Corvette then buy a minivan it simply does not work that way. It raises the brand image and for that all it has to do is exist. It can attract younger generations to your brand who are not yet at the age to buy a car but will be in the future.

Reading your response makes me either think you didn't read past my first sentance or that my post is unclear.

I addressed the Corvette with the asking price starting in the affordable zone for Chevy buyers making the base model attainable for Chevy buyers. Did I say anywhere that my post is fact? Most of what everyone puts up on this site is opinion, if we only put facts then GMI would only have about two legit posts a month. Clearly the Corvette or NSX or any other high end prices aren't going to sell in the 100,000 range. My point was that the NSX never had great sales even for a halo car.

Another way of putting it is if the NSX were a good halo car Acura would've never let it go 15 years without a real resign. And if it did well as a halo, why did they decide to end production? GM clearly thinks the Vette serves a useful purpose which explains why its been around for 7 generations without a break in production.

[63GrandSport001]

Did you read my post? I addressed the Corvette with the asking price starting in the affordable zone for Chevy buyers making the base model attainable for Chevy buyers. Did I say anywhere that my post is somhow fact? Most of what everyone puts up on this site is opinion. Clearly the Corvette or NSX or any other high end prices aren't going to sell in the 100,000 range. My point was that the NSX never had great sales even for a halo car.

Another way of putting it is if the NSX were a good halo car Acura would've never let it go 15 years without a real resign. And if it did well as a halo, why did they decide to end production? GM clearly thinks the Vette serves a useful purpose which explains why its been around for 7 generations without a break in production.

If the Corvette is at an attainable price for the masses to buy then I am sorry but it isn't much of a Halo car, also selling 30,000+ a year (like they did before the economy crashed) doesn't make it much of a halo car either.

The Nissan GTR has really poor sales (as you would put it as well), so I am sorry but a Halo car doesn't need to sell well.

Also Honda has a habit of letting its performance vehicles sit for far too long before updating it. Actually the NSX had strong sales early on and if it was up dated could have continued at that same sales rate. That fact really blows up your entire argument, they ended the production partly from the belief that such a vehicle wasn't needed and after being on the market for something like 12 years yes sales were low.

However to state that because it's production was ended means it is a failure is to say that vehicles like the Ford GT, Ferrari F40, Ferrari F50 etc... are all also failures for that same exact reason.....

[BlackGTP]

If the Corvette is at an attainable price for the masses to buy then I am sorry but it isn't much of a Halo car, also selling 30,000+ a year (like they did before the economy crashed) doesn't make it much of a halo car either.

The Nissan GTR has really poor sales (as you would put it as well), so I am sorry but a Halo car doesn't need to sell well.

Also Honda has a habit of letting its performance vehicles sit for far too long before updating it. Actually the NSX had strong sales early on and if it was up dated could have continued at that same sales rate. That fact really blows up your entire argument, they ended the production partly from the belief that such a vehicle wasn't needed and after being on the market for something like 12 years yes sales were low.

I don't get how "

However to state that because it's production was ended means it is a failure is to say that vehicles like the Ford GT, Ferrari F40, Ferrari F50 etc... are all also failures for that same exact reason.....

If you read my posts I clearly say that the base Corvette is in the range of the higher end Chevy buyers - the high end pickup trucks, Suburban and Tahoe all get into or close to the $50 grand mark. Those are the people with the money to buy the Vette, and again my point is that the Vette makes more sense as a halo car because at least some of Chevy's regular customers can afford the Vette. Chevy is somewhat unique in that the Suburban and Tahoe both attract wealthy buyers - it's not too uncommon to see someone who has an S Class and a Suburban. I doubt you will see someone with a $100,000 NSX driving around in an RL or any other Acura.

I don't think Ferrari is a good comparison; their entire lineup is halo cars. And yes, they make occasional supercars, but typically have another one of a different name around the corner. However, the Ford is a good comparison. So if the GT40 was an effective marketing tool for Ford, why didn't they produce a new model or something similar? I think they discovered the same; the GT40 was so far out of Ford's regular customer base that it wasn't attracting sales to its profitable volume vehicles.

You say:
"That fact really blows up your entire argument; they ended the production partly from the belief that such a vehicle wasn't needed and after being on the market for something like 12 years yes sales were low."

How does that blow my argument? If Honda thought the NSX was a good marketing tool bringing in sales, why would they discontinue it? They discontinued it because it was unnecessary because there were other more effective marketing tools - therefore as a halo car it was a failure.

I also want to point out that I'm not arguing that it was a great car, based on all the publications it very much was. I'm arguing a more esoteric point that it was a failure as a marketing tool and poorly positioned as a marketing tool.

And I'm enjoying the argument; you are bringing up valid points. I don't have the answers, but I think they are valid questions.

[chakis24]

Also I do not believe that these cars really bring in much sales traffic into dealers resulting in more vehicles sales. No one is going to walk into a dealer to see a Corvette then buy a minivan it simply does not work that way. It raises the brand image and for that all it has to do is exist. It can attract younger generations to your brand who are not yet at the age to buy a car but will be in the future.

but they do buy camaros..."oh, you want a corvette? well it appears you cant afford the vette, but we do have a camaro ss that is 15 grand cheaper and is right within your price range, while providing a similar experience. why dont we go for a test drive?" acura doesnt have that. if you cant get a nsx, there isnt any other option.

[1.21 giggawatts]

they should pull a nissan and badge it as a honda at the last second!

[avro206]

Any kind of hybrid-gas engine, AWD, techno gadgets ect have totally turned me off to any new NSX or any new car, for that matter. All this does is add complexity, weight and cost, IMO. The first NSX was very cool for a few years and then Honda let it carry on way too long, unchanged. And now this thing? No thanks

[germeezy1]

What do you guys expect from the mainstream media, you go to them not because you want to put your car through a hard review. It is more of an infomercial for you product, it also allows people to see the car who wouldn't normally and gives them a chance to explain to people what an NSX is (even if you are embellishing things a bit).

As to BlackGTP the point of a halo car isn't to have high sales volume, in fact if it had high sales volume it wouldn't be much of a halo car.

Here is what the NSX is to me....

It is a car in which no more weight then is needed, it is a car that is about the driving experience and being engaging. I feel that with this new NSX being AWD and a hybrid (if that is still the plan) that it doesn't fit the NSX name. When the NSX came out it was priced at $60,000 and was very competitive, it packed something like 270BHP which while short of cars like the Dodge Viper and ZR1 Corvette was still competitive partly due to its low weight. However later on in the NSX life it simply was not competitive as it packed a $90,000 price tag and made 290BHP when for $50,000 you could get a 405BHP C5 Z06 which could run circles around the NSX. I know that some NSX fans (probably some on this site too) would never be willing to admit to this. I was looking at fast lap times in order to bring in actual lap times and for the NSX at willow springs it ran a 1:32.59. A fully optioned C6 Z06 ran a 1:20.43, 1LE Camaro 1:22.70, Grand Sport Corvette 1:27.29, Scion FRS 1:31.15.

Reality is often a dish that is best served cold, and despite my utter appreciation for a car whose development was aided by the best driver in my opinion ever to turn a wheel ( Senna) I have never been able to purchase an NSX despite considering them many times in the past. There is no way on God's green earth a 270 hp past supercar is worth anywhere near the dear amounts that those who offer them for sale believe them to be worth. I can appreciate marginally powerful vehicles with amazing handling feel but the NSX was easily shaded by the C5 Z06 in almost every way notwithstanding telepathic steering feel.