Pontiac's Uncertain Future

[TaHoE]

Originally Posted by nikivee

You need to go back to basic business 101. Pontiac outsells Saturn and Buick almost 2 to one, and you think Pontiac will get cut? Oh, yeah, that makes perfect basic business sense.

...if you only knew...

[JoeT]

Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65

Not that. Three Lambdas at one dealership? Unless they kill the Acadia and make the current Outlook the new Acadia (which it should be, looks much more truck-like than the Acadia), that won't turn out too well.

GMC is heading to the big scrapyard in the sky anyway, so my Pontiac (Pontiac-Saturn) would only be saddled-up with Buick, and if I had things my way Buick would have the Holden Statesman/Caprice and Calais in their lineup too. A Holden-Opel-Pontiac-Buick alliance would be a great, with a few US models thrown in.

[MisterMe]

Originally Posted by JoeT

GMC is heading to the big scrapyard in the sky anyway, ...

Um-m-m-m, maybe not. I am happy that a few of the other members of this forum are speaking up about the fact that Pontiac is GM's No. 3 best-selling brand. It would be the height of stupidity to kill it. Well, GMC is No. 2. How dumb would it be to kill your second best-selling nameplate?

[Chaz_23]

But why kill Pontiac? It doesn't cost much to keep it alive - aside from giving a paycheck to Kimmel (for some reason) and some music-related waste of money. BPG would have less to sell- not a good idea either. Kill Pontiac and GMC and we'll have thousands of...Buick dealers. That wouldn't please them.
They'll keep both Pontiac and GMC alive- if that's what you can call it. Gas prices are dropping, more hybrids are selling (non-GM that is), the Volt and similar cars are coming, etc. So what's the damage in having the G8 around? It's one of, what, 3 RWD cars.
The main problem is that GM has no money. Alpha would have been great for Pontiac. And so would a Firebird be. To have Canada build the Camaro and nothing else would be ridiculous.

[tollytime]

I hope for your sake the legal department at GM comes to the decision that your not worth the effort for a lawsuit. They would probably like to know how you confirmed GM is not working on future product plans for Pontiac. You seem to make this announcement with confidence in your conviction. ("Actually, passed 2012, there are no future product plans for Pontiac".)

Your opinion about global brand alignment is probably very true. Although, you may want to change your story to emphasize that it seems or appears to your knowledge, that GM is not working on new products for Pontiac after 2012.

[chakis24]

Originally Posted by nsap

The cost structure would be setup for luxury vehicles (so that the platform is capable with other luxury marques); meaning that the ROI (return on investment) would be formulated on a higher MSRP than an Alpha Pontiac could ever sell for. So no, financially GM would be better off not building an Alpha Pontiac.

Originally Posted by ChevyRules

Then why did GM have to develop Zeta if they had Sigma? Because Sigma is too expensive! With Cadillac having development over it now, it will most likely use expensive materials and would be impossible to sell an Alpha Pontiac at $24-$26K and make a decent profit.

what platform is the cruze going to be on? that could work, probably the same price range, no?

[nsap]

Originally Posted by tollytime

I hope for your sake the legal department at GM comes to the decision that your not worth the effort for a lawsuit. They would probably like to know how you confirmed GM is not working on future product plans for Pontiac. You seem to make this announcement with confidence in your conviction. ("Actually, passed 2012, there are no future product plans for Pontiac".)

That is why this is an Editorial, not a news piece. The article is based off of information GMI has obtained, but it should not be taken as the all and final truth on the matter. And that is because, frankly, things like this CHANGE a lot. Actually, we are not posting anything that isn't already known within the media. AutoNews already reported about the slew of rebadged Chevrolet products coming to Pontiac lots in the future. The only thing new mentioned is that, to GMI's knowledge, there are no product plans for Pontiac passed 2012. What that means is unknown to us. There just isn't a news story here, that is why it was not posted as one.

Let me make myself clear. We are not reporting the death of Pontiac with this story. We are playing out what we know in Editorial format.

[FoMoCo Fan]

These "brands" are nothing more than marketing labels. Unless GM can define a specific target consumer for the Pontiac brand, it should cease to exist. GM already has a mass market brand with products that range from $12,000-$100,000 in Chevrolet. Having another mass market brand is simply bad business. So either find some unique demographic to go after, or let it go the way of Oakland already!

[ChevyRules]

Originally Posted by Chaz_23

But why kill Pontiac? It doesn't cost much to keep it alive - aside from giving a paycheck to Kimmel (for some reason) and some music-related waste of money. BPG would have less to sell- not a good idea either. Kill Pontiac and GMC and we'll have thousands of...Buick dealers. That wouldn't please them.
They'll keep both Pontiac and GMC alive- if that's what you can call it. Gas prices are dropping, more hybrids are selling (non-GM that is), the Volt and similar cars are coming, etc. So what's the damage in having the G8 around? It's one of, what, 3 RWD cars.
The main problem is that GM has no money. Alpha would have been great for Pontiac. And so would a Firebird be. To have Canada build the Camaro and nothing else would be ridiculous.

Saturn would go into the BPG channel

Originally Posted by chakis24

what platform is the cruze going to be on? that could work, probably the same price range, no?

The Cruze is on Delta II.

[Blair1118]

I'm just throwing this out there: Move any and all BOF anything to GMC, its a smaller outlet for something that still needs to exsist, which helps with CAFE, you sell less, it effects less of the overall picture. GMC can support the higher prices that will be a result of lower production numbers. Make a lambda Silverado and Suburban replacement and let the Traverse replace the Tahoe. Also a theta truck to replace the Colorado. That allows your mainstream brand to have the highest volume, best fuel eco "big" vehicles that we still want.

[tollytime]

Originally Posted by MisterMe

Um-m-m-m, maybe not. I am happy that a few of the other members of this forum are speaking up about the fact that Pontiac is GM's No. 3 best-selling brand. It would be the height of stupidity to kill it. Well, GMC is No. 2. How dumb would it be to kill your second best-selling nameplate?

This is true, But!! A very big BUT!! Your going off past figures that involved cheaper gas and great lease deals for the past 5 years. Now that gas is around $3.75 in the US and over $4.50 in Canada, GMC numbers will drop fast in the next year. Furthermore, GM is getting out of the cheap lease business for all brands, this will impact GMC and Pontiac future sales figures.

[Orbit Orange]

I don't suppose that anyone noted that when Oldsmobile was murdered, the people that bought them went to other makes, mostly Imports. They did NOT for the most part buy Buicks.

Ignore the lessons of history at one's own peril.

Although I have no stats on former Olds owners that jumped ship to imports, I do know that if Pontiac is axed I will part ways with GM and make sure I go right to Ford or Chrysler for a "spite" purchase. Call it what you will but treat the faithful like crap and watch us leave.

[tollytime]

Originally Posted by nsap

That is why this is an Editorial, not a news piece. The article is based off of information GMI has obtained, but it should not be taken as the all and final truth on the matter. And that is because, frankly, things like this CHANGE a lot. Actually, we are not posting anything that isn't already known within the media. AutoNews already reported about the slew of rebadged Chevrolet products coming to Pontiac lots in the future. The only thing new mentioned is that, to GMI's knowledge, there are no product plans for Pontiac passed 2012. What that means is unknown to us. There just isn't a news story here, that is why it was not posted as one.

Let me make myself clear. We are not reporting the death of Pontiac with this story. We are playing out what we know in Editorial format.

I understand completely, But be aware some companies are suing stock analyst for editorials on prospective stock purchases. A lawyer could accuse GMI staff of wrongly obtaining insider information that could impact the companies financial position. The name of this webpage is GM Inside News, that name does implicate certain things. Please, I love you Editorial and all the staff that work hard at GMI to bring us this awsome website. I just want you to know there are Pontiac and GMC dealers with millions invested in their dealerships. Let's not forget the employees working at these dealerships. Finally, all the workers at GM involved with these divisions. Thanks for listening.

[jbernie]

I am not in favour of Pontiac getting killed, but if push comes to shove, I would suggest that G8 sedan goes to Buick, the G8 ST goes to Chevy as an El Camino, and Pontiac becomes a fleet/rental only brand so that way everything that is fleet is in one brand and fleet/rental sales don't bring down the resale value of the retail vehicles.

I understand that Pontiac may not be able to fullfill all of the fleet/rental sales but certainly it would allow GM more flexability to get those sales without compromising sales of the Malibu and eventually the Cruize.

[Millefune]

Originally Posted by Orbit Orange

Although I have no stats on former Olds owners that jumped ship to imports, I do know that if Pontiac is axed I will part ways with GM and make sure I go right to Ford or Chrysler for a "spite" purchase. Call it what you will but treat the faithful like crap and watch us leave.

Amen to that. I know that if GM continues to make Pontiac craptastic and/or axes it, I will not push for my mom to get an Enclave and Malibu to replace her CRV and Accord. I will push for her to get a Flex. Also, my next car after paying off the GTO will not be another Pontiac as I planned, it will be... something not GM.