GMC Should Die… And be Reborn

[CamaroCrazy]

The judge, jury, and executioner of this debate will be one thing: SALES.

If GMC sales start tanking because no one is buying trucks, then it will be decided.

Watch the sales numbers. If GMC maintains, then who knows, it might stay. Maybe in the end, NOTHING will get axed.

[mgescuro]

Originally Posted by CamaroCrazy

Watch the sales numbers. If GMC maintains, then who knows, it might stay. Maybe in the end, NOTHING will get axed.

Ummm... GMC sales are guaranteed to tank this year. They're all trucks.
Acadia isn't gonna prop up sales.

[PocoToro]

Originally Posted by Lichtronamo

GMC is important because of its buyer demographics, who tend to be more wealthy than Chevy (or even Escalade) buyers.

Why not eliminate the Chevy trucks and sell GMC though Chevrolet/GMC dealers?

Ding Ding Ding.............We have a winner..............My vote goes to killing Chevy trucks

[PocoToro]

Originally Posted by samkung

The thing i dont understand is why some of the GMC supporter wont buy a Chevy, dont they all love GM, or do they just like GMC

PS: do all Chevy truck buyer prefer the chevy name over GMC, if not why not just sell Chevy truck as GMC, or simply use the GMC name for top end chevy truck, just sell them under the same roof

Because Chevy has always had a but ugly grill compared to the GMC

[steinravnik]

This sounds pretty good. What will the BPG dealers be given? Saturn?

[CrimsonTider]

Here we go with the name-game debate again. Any individual who buys a GMC truck because they don't like Chevy or they think they are getting something better than a Chevy deserves exactly what they got(a rebadged Chevy).

As long as these two have been around I still can't believe some people actually think there is a difference. All these different divisions and rebadges will continue to be the bain of GM for quite some time.

Here' a good one: Let's keep all the good products & ditch the under-achievers, then slap a nice little small GM badge on all of them and call it a day!

[2648562]

Originally Posted by PocoToro

Because Chevy has always had a but ugly grill compared to the GMC

It's funny, but I've honestly heard Chevy owners say the same thing about GMCs.

[FenwickHockey65]

Originally Posted by mgescuro

Then let them go to Ford or Dodge. So what?

This is exactly the same reason why Cadillac won't get rid of the DTS. You cling onto customers who don't really need to be there, and hold back the true renaissance of the brand.

Who has a straight answer as to what makes a GMC customer "different" from a Chevy Truck customer?
All I ever hear is "I don't like Chevys." WHY??

Do people buy a GMC because it's a GMC... Period? Or is it something else?
And if it's something else, why can't they accept Chevy?
Obviously people bought the GMC because they saw something there that they liked. What is it? And why isn't that translatable to Chevy?

For the most part, GMCs have always looked better than Chevys. The grilles are much cleaner, just GMC written across the middle, no bright, shiny, chrome bar or plastic body-color bar. Good use of chrome on the side moldings make them look better too.
It all comes down to personal preference. Some people like Chevys, some like GMC, and some like both.
But you have to understand where we GMC guys are coming from. We don't want to see our brand shut down any more than a Pontiac or Buick fan wants to see their brand shut down. Sure, we can all go to Chevy, no problem. But if just the slimmest chance exists in which we can save GMC, we're all for it. I've noticed that the vast majority of the people yelling for the death of GMC have never even owned one. It's easy for other people to say, "Kill off whatever brand," but for people who have grown up around the brand, it really is emotionally disturbing, almost like losing a childhood friend. I've been riding around in GMCs for as long as I can remember, I learned how to service and maintain cars with GMCs, hell, the first time I ever changed the oil by myself was on a GMC. In fourth grade, when all the other kids wanted Mustangs or Lamborghinis, I was the one who wanted a Sierra 1500.
Understand that I'm willing to do whatever it takes to make sure GM as a company stays afloat. If killing GMC is what will do it, then that's what they should do. But like I said, I'm all for any slim chance that GMC can be saved.

[TimR]

Originally Posted by mgescuro

All I ever hear is "I don't like Chevys." WHY??

Because after the latest restyle, the Silverado is butt ugly. Thats why Just because I drive a truck doesn't mean I'm not allowed to have a bit of style (just a bit).

Kill the #2 best selling nameplate you have? Not sure that is a great idea....

[mgescuro]

Originally Posted by TimR

Because after the latest restyle, the Silverado is butt ugly. Thats why Just because I drive a truck doesn't mean I'm not allowed to have a bit of style (just a bit).

Kill the #2 best selling nameplate you have? Not sure that is a great idea....

Ok... so what's to stop Chevrolet from making a better looking truck??
One that is attractive to both GMC and Chevrolet owners??

#2 selling nameplate? The way gas is going? GMC will be dead in 2-3 years if GM did nothing.
The future is NOT trucks. So unless GM wants to sell a GMC Cobalt, GM needs to make the though decision.

And I didn't say "kill GMC." I'm not stupid. But GMC's better off being a true "Professional grade" brand and stick to the commercial market and quit dabbling in crossovers and luxury cars.

[iluvcamaros]

I see no value in GMC. All it has is a moderate reputation as a premium truck maker. These trucks are no longer going to be relevant with the advent of $4.00+ gas. The only model with potential is the Acadia. The Buick Enclave can target the people who would want something more exclusive than a Chevy Traverse. Buick can even get a Theta SUV.

Also, the beloved Denali line does not make any sense as it overlaps with Caddy and Buick.

[djo165]

Originally Posted by mgescuro

Plus the investment in GMC is really minimal as it’s all rebadged anyways.

Exactly. GM's costs for GMC are mostly in advertising. But what would be GM's loss if GMC went away? You would have a lot of Buick and Pontiac dealers losing 1/3 to 1/4 of their volume. How many of them could survive that? What do you propose to replace it with?

Originally Posted by mgescuro

With the advent of $4 gas and in some regions of the US, $5 gas, what use is a brand that is All Truck and All SUV and All Rebadge? The answer is, “None.” It is completely useless.

It's not useless if it brings in more money than it costs. Anyone here got those figures? It's also useful in providing more sales and distribution points for GM manufactured trucks.

Originally Posted by mgescuro

Establish a Hybrid “Collection.” All the same vehicles in Hybrid format. Create a “Sub Brand” similar to Denali. Let’s dub it the “Cascade Line,” in deference to the Denali Line. (e.g. Silverado Cascade)

Not a bad idea, but a terrible name. Cascade? You want to use a name of one of America's best selling dishwashing detergents that has been around for decades on a line of trucks that are supposed to be "Professional Grade"? Trust me. More people in the US think dishes than mountains when they hear that name.

Originally Posted by mgescuro

With the expansion of Chevy Trucks in my scenario, one Chevy dealership, but the trucks should be sold separately from the Chevy cars. There should be 2 separate buildings. One for trucks; one for cars. But one dealership. Simple.

Nope, too cost prohibitive. Besides, it was just a few years ago that Chevrolet was complaining because people perceived them having a good image as far as trucks, but not their cars (remember "Like a Rock"?) If you want one image to rub off on the other, don't separate the two.

[kenman923]

Originally Posted by DemonKnightDK

As I recall, nissan isnt doing so well with their truck line. and If GMC has a better image than chevy, would it make more sence to just stop making chevy trucks? and sell nothing but GMC trucks? leav chevy with an S-10 size truck or G8-ST type car. the simple fact is, GMC has almost an insignifigant amount of money invested into R&D and makes a huge profit for the company.. I do belive GMC should get more into the commercial grade sector, nothing under a 3/4 Ton dually. Let chevy have the 1/2 ton market. make the HD trucks GMC only, and sell them BPG dealers. If any brand needs cut, by damnit it is saturn. every saturn could be a pontiac, open/holden would be perfect as pontiacs, the opels as the FWD performnace (mazda/nissan fighter) and Holden for the G8 and GTO range, just leave it more of a lower end with not so much luxary, give those to Buick. (buick should be the LWB Statesmen, and a few more luxuary optioned exclusives. Enclave can stay.

So, Pontiac would be

Delta II- G5 becomes Sunfire, 1.4L base 115-120HP, GT with 2.0L Non-turbo LNF 160-170, and GTP with 2.2 or 2.4L 230-240 HP or detuned Turbo 2.0L

Epislon II - Re names Grand Am, base 2.0L Non turbo LNF 160-170HP GT with a 2.2L 195-200HP and a GTP top line, with AWD and 2.0L Turbo LNF at the 260HP min.

Vibe, a pontiac version of the HHR, only styled completly different, same drive train as the EPII.

Those are the only FWD cars in the Pontiac marque. they will be the only ones wearing GTP badges.

G8 is Renamed Grand Prix, 3.0L Base engine that is rumored to be coming for the CTS, 260-275HP GT with 3.6L DI-V6 at 300HP and the GXP with the corvete Base V8 with AFM only if its needed to get around the guzzler tax

Intro the G8 Coupe as the Grand Prix Coupe, or style differently enough to be GTO/Firebird. Same specs as Grand Prix 4 door.

Only two RWD that they need.

Buick:

LWB EP-II called Regal, no base modle, starts at LS trim with Leather trimed luxary cloth standard, and leather trimmed sued for the LT trim the base engine would be 3.0L DOHC V6, optional 3.6L and then GS trim would give a GS spec suspension tune and the 3.6 in turbo form.

LWB Zeta, returns the name Park Avenue, 3.6L base engine, with a turbo 3.6 as the upscale, tuned for complete quite and smoothness. Trim names would be Park Avenue Limited and The upscale would be Ultra (super is not an option I'm sorry that is a stuipd trim name.)

Enclave will stay in current form. Its doing every thing right.

GMC would have to be transitioned to a smaller line up, most likely honestly, now that I went through the whole thing in my head, GMC would not fit in this set up. Mazda dose fine with out trucks, and toyota and honda did/does as well.. so perhaps GMC should just become a trim line for Chevy. (or at least be sold at chevy dealers only. if the B-P dealer cant sell cars that are worth it, they arent trying hard enough cause the lack of trucks dont stop any one else.

Okay, after proving my self wrong and seeing the benefits of the GMC+chevy=ChevyGMC I stand by my BP grouping. throw saturn in there to cover a few more crossover options and slightly lower run cars. Nothing that would perform better than a pontiac and nothing more luxuarious than a buick.. make them the rental fleet. (since they dont have a huge public following and the name isnt that valuable... they would be the perfect brand for the fleets...)

okay, I'm done. +1 to any one that actually reads this post

I like your idea. The only thing I would add would be the Theta SUV goes to Buick. They can cancel the GMC Terrain and the Pontiac Torrent replacement could be known as the Buick Everest.

[Snafu_SS]

Originally Posted by poncho1982

While I agree that GMC needs to go, and yes send the Denali line to Chevy. However, the bowtie MUST go on the vehicle somewhere. Thats kinda like GM saying they are ashamed to call it a Chevrolet, if they omit it.

This was the exact idea I have stated for years now, must be a good one!

They certainly aren't ashamed of the Corvette though...no bow tie there either

Camaro for the longest time had it's own symbol...and no bow tie as well

I think it would be ok, ppl would still identify it as a Chevy.

I know that the main reason why so many ppl buy GMC is because they can't stand the looks of the Silverado over the past 4 or 5 years now. My dad wouldn't consider the Silverado on the 800 platform when it had the angeled headlights, instead he got his used 03 Sierra and is very happy with it. My family is very loyal to GM and although I agree that GMC seems to be the obvious choice for off loading...it still provided another "look" to attract more buyers.

Currently, the Acadia and Sierra look so much better (of course my opinion) than the Silverado and that Traverse (one HUGE Malibu lookin beast)

[Ambalanche]

Originally Posted by mgescuro

GMC Should Die… And be Reborn
...another commentary by mgescuro...

For GMC the past couple of years, it has been known as “Professional Grade.” It was the brand of (supposedly) tougher trucks and SUV’s because, it was “Professional Grade.”

But what exactly did that mean anyways?
Well, for all intents and purposes, it was a pure 100% rebadged brand. GM took the basics of a Chevy Truck, reworked a few exterior items, on occasion, there were even a few interior tweaks and upgrades, and sometimes a few options not found on a Chevy. But essentially, it was pure rebadged badness.
The only tangible difference between Chevy Trucks and GMC Trucks were the customers. GMC customers wouldn’t buy a Chevy. And there were enough customer out there to justify GMC’s existence. Plus the investment in GMC is really minimal as it’s all rebadged anyways.

With the advent of $4 gas and in some regions of the US, $5 gas, what use is a brand that is All Truck and All SUV and All Rebadge? The answer is, “None.” It is completely useless.

So, GM should dispatch GMC post haste.

What Happens Now?

There is certainly a good chunk of GMC buyers out there that aren’t necessarily going to go away. Therefore, the strategic thing to do is to strengthen and redefine Chevy Trucks. What made GMC more attractive to buyers than Chevrolet? Build on those strengths. Blend them into Chevy Trucks.

Create a tiered structure at Chevy Trucks.

1. Base level trucks and SUV’s. These are the trucks we know and love today.
2. Reintroduce the Denali Line at Chevy Trucks. However, the Chevy badging disappears. It’s simply Denali. (e.g. Silverado Denali not Chevy Silverado Denali)
3. Establish a Hybrid “Collection.” All the same vehicles in Hybrid format. Create a “Sub Brand” similar to Denali. Let’s dub it the “Cascade Line,” in deference to the Denali Line. (e.g. Silverado Cascade)

This way, the name recognition of the Denali line remains. The phrase, “I bought a Denali” remains. In addition, you make the fact that you’re driving a Hybrid special and more unique, saying, “I drive a Cascade.”

GMC Reborn?

Yes. GMC is “Professional Grade.” So let it be truly “Professional Grade.” GMC becomes the commercial arm for GM Trucks. This shuts down Chevy commercial trucks. GMC becomes the sole source for commercial related trucks at GM.
Canyon and Sierra families remain with chassis/cutaways available.
Savana remains as a cargo and cutaway platform.
Acadia remains in a cargo format.
Light and Medium Duty commercial trucks remain and perhaps expand. I would expect a more aggressive salesforce so GMC more effectively competes with Ford Commercial trucks. Let GMC allow for the same customization with greater truck solutions to compete with Ford.
Envoy and Yukon die.

Over the course of time, GMC can re-establish itself as a tough, commercial grade/professional grade truck company. If the buyer marker in the future allows for another truck company, then GM can reintroduce GMC to the market. But this time, it will have a more solid reputation as a true Professional Grade brand, with solid expectations.

Dealerships?

With the expansion of Chevy Trucks in my scenario, one Chevy dealership, but the trucks should be sold separately from the Chevy cars. There should be 2 separate buildings. One for trucks; one for cars. But one dealership. Simple.

That's interesting. GMC has been a cash cow for GM because like you stated, it basically has very little investment other than a grille here, fender there etc...but to say give the Denali line to Chevy and leave off the bowtie? "I drive a Denali"? That goes against marketing 101. Remember that most of the alpha-numeric soup names are because automakers want people to say "I drive a Cadillac", not "I drive a CTS", or "I drive a lexus" not I drive an LS460. Remember when John Rock tried to reinvent Oldsmobile, He purposly left off any mention of Oldsmobile on the original Aurora. People loved the car but non-automotive types didn't know what it was or where to buy it, so in subsequent years they added a small-type Oldsmobile name under the badge.
As far as the commercial line, I highly doubt GM would spend the money to differenciate the sheet metal for GMC to have Cab and chassis trucks and a panel version of the Acadia etc. If they are going to do that, why not just beef up Chevy trucks and not bother with GMC at all? isn't that the same thing and they can just save the $.30 it costs for the badge and not have to spend anything on sheetmetal?
I'm not slamming you here, these are just my thoughts. Thanks.